Canadian fare exception not accepted by BA?
 

I have been on the phone with a Oneworld representative who very nicely helped me sort through an itinerary for a RTW for myself and two children. Lon-DME-surface-KWL-HKG-NRT-JFK-BDA-LON. In all honesty I am in the midst of pricing so I really don't know if the 21,000 mile available fare in economy is possible or this becomes a 26,000. Flush with the success of the Misner family I called the available telephone number found in Canada which connected me to the Oneworld office in USA. They said that they never price a Canadian purchased ticket with the benefit of the lower initial departing flight price. They have sent it off to be queried which will take they say at last 48 to 72 hours. I am flumoxed because my response seemed so weak and they seemed very disinterested with this anomaly in their traditional pricing. Any rules that pertain to this situation that I can find in writing. Thank You

I must say I am attempting this using BA Oneworld.

The Canada exception is a question that has already been answered by oneworld4u (see post #47). The rule you are looking for is the following:

Thank you for responding
 

I did read this response to them and it phased them not in the least. They were very nice about it but clearly felt that they were right . I am just a little miffed that the ensuing 48 hours will erode my opportunity to do alternative bookings. Regards

Things are looking up for Canada purchase ex Lon
 

After searching methodically on the one world site I found the oneworld_explorer_rule_sheet.pdf. Under the point #15 the exception that the oneworld representative referred to about Canada was there. I then called the BA people to debate and lo and behold the BA rep. had actually debated this same exception with his supervisors before. He has tried to speed up their response by pointing out this exception and hopefully I will be ticketed by this evening. Thank You flyertalk for this info. I hope this will help someone somewhere.

Keep fighting
 

I had to point out this exception to more than 6 people at the AA rtw desk. Fortunately I didn't give up and pressed the rate desk to rate the ticket and made reference to point#15. They rated it properly. I spoke to several experienced travel agents who have been working with Oneworld rtw tickets for years in London, US and CAN.....majority all thought I was wrong but perserverance (also knowing CDN competitve pricing laws) saw to it that we saved $$$.

I'm somewhat confused by all this but maybe it's just me ....

The only mileage-based RTW tickets that I'm aware of are Global Explorer, Circle Pacific and Circle SWP Asia tickets. Presumably, you're planning a Global Explorer? If so, they come in 26,000, 29,000, 34,000 and 39,000 variations (at least in Y) - no 21,000 mile version.

The 26,000 mile ticket ex-London is L1,179 (or L1,289 in high season). Ex-Canada, the same ticket is C$3,999 (or almost twice as much). I don't understand why you would have this issued in Canada when you are starting in London?

Now that I re-read your post, are you starting in London, Ontario (for which the airport code is YXU, not LON, which is the universal code for London, England)? Are you really going to KWL (which is Guilin in China) rather than KUL (which is Kuala Lumpur)?

Can you perhaps clarify the proposed itinerary?

The Canada exception allows one to purchase a UK departing xonex in Canada at the UK price so she would be able to purchase at the UK price. I have no clue about the itinerary or if the OP is actually doing something other than an xonex.

The OP has researched the oneworld explorer rules (pdf version) so it must be an OWE otherwise it would make no sense. Also, from posts in other forums the answer to the Guilin, China, question is yes, the OP actually wants to go there.

I think I understand that bit but I'm unclear why you would do it in this case. I assume the OP must be in Canada and therefore it's easier to do it this way? .... rather than simply calling AA in the U.K. and have them issue the ticket..... and, having said that, I don't know whether the OP is using AA at all or even has an Aadvantage # so I guess I should learn to be less AA-centric!

Not to digress but I've never understood the issue of having to have the ticket issued in the country of origin - is that an AA/OW imposed constraint or is it some sort of IATA requirement? When tickets are electronic, the "issuing button" can be pushed by anyone, anywhere so the concept of having it "issued" in a particular place seems irrelevant.

Good point ... I should have picked up on that .... though I'm now even more confused, given that xONEx tickets are continent-based and not mileage-based.

Neither; it is merely a question of $. You can have the ticket issued anywhere you please but it is the 'higher of the two' rule the one that bites you.
 

You must be, because the OP mentions in a couple of posts that she's contacted BA. :)

Is this route able to be issued as an e-ticket? If so I'm wondering the same as tt7 (ignoring the AA/BA confusion), why not call BA in the UK and have them issue the ticket? Yes, it's an international phone call, but for a few dollars (or less if you use VoIP) you avoid the hassle of having to educate the airline reps.

The main benifit in getting the ticket issued in Canada is the exclusion of the "higher fare" rules.

i.e. Get a JNB priced in originating DONE5 issued in Canada for the ZAR45,600 base price (~USD6000).

Certainly not such a benefit for an ex UK fare, but it is there. (GBP5169 or ~USD10,200 against CAD11,400 or ~USD11,500)

Viajero, I assume that what you're saying is that it is simply a OW-imposed constraint (not IATA or any similar legal constraint)? That is, we will charge you (because we make the rules and therefore we can) the higher of the price where you originate or the price where the person-who-presses-the-ticketing-button is sitting? In an era of electronic ticketing, that makes no sense (other than giving the airlines greater revenue and/or causing additional effort on the part of the customer). If they're willing to sell a DONE4 ex-NRT cheaper than a DONE4 ex-US, that's great - but why make me go through the hassle of calling AA in Tokyo when AA-US has done all the work to set up the ticket for me and could (presumably) push the button just as easily as the people in AA's office in Tokyo?

I'm not an airline or IATA insider so all I have is an opinion based on what I see from the perspective of a passenger. In my view the whole OWE pricing structure is based on nothing more than market rules, and probably even less than that. I find it extremely hard to believe that the airlines are the reluctant slaves of a powerful IATA master that tells them what to charge. Instead, I see the Canada exception as simply the result of one government passing legislation that forbids abuse and the airlines having to comply, reluctantly, in this case.

As for ex-NRT cheaper than ex-US being great, well, I see the glass half empty and say that ex-US being more expensive than ex-NRT sucks. :)

I would also note that the Canadian exception is really just a convenience in ticketing factor.

One still has to start the xONEx product in whatever country one has bought the fare for (as distinct from purchasing the ticket itself), it just may make it easier to pay for it / collect tickets

No you don't! That's the whole point. You can purchase a ticket in Canada at the local price for anywhere in the world that you want to take the first sector. (So if, for example, you want an xONEn that starts in South Africa, you can purchase that in Canada for the South African price)

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It is much more than simple ticketing convenience or ease in payment. Doing away with the "higher fare" rule in Canada means you can save real money.

For an example let's take a RTW which originates in South Africa (say the first segment is JNB-LHR) and takes advantage of this exception:

• Convenience: Purchase 'locally' (for some) in Canada, pay in Canada, get ticket in Canada.
  
• Savings: Pay the South African price, which is much lower than the Canadian price.

Without this exception one would be forced (in the example above) to either purchase in South Africa (inconvenient) or pay the Canadian price (more expensive). What the Canadian exception does is remove the airlines orchestrated restriction that forces one to pay the higher of the two fares.

In summary, if purchasing in Canada one can now choose the cheapest origin and go there to start the OWE with ticket in hand, without penalty.

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Must admit I had wondered why canucks had been singled out for special treatment:)

BUT, if this exception was being imposed by the Canadian government, then one would expect it to be allowed for all such products - eg *GLOB* and *CIRC* in addition to *ONE*. However the rule for *GLOB* and *CIRC* is more restrictive, namely:

When travel originates in a Country for which a specific local currency fare is published and the ticket is sold in another country, the fare will be that published for the country of origin converted into the currency of sale at the bank selling rate, the resultant fare must not be lower than that from the country of sale.
Exception: For travel originating in the United States and sold in Canada, the applicable USD fare converted to CAD at the bank selling rate shall apply.

Just wondering, that's all

Good point. I would expect, however, that if push came to shove the Canadian exception would have to be applied to all fares. Just guessing though.

The "Canadian Exception" has been around for quite some time. While it was reintroduced into the xONEx rule text late last year; I conject it has been applicable for many years and could be enforced with some pushing, even when it was not specifically mentioned in the rule texts. This Law applies to most if not all fares booked in Canada.

I typed "Re"-introduced as, according to posts in this forum, apparently it was included in the rules around five years ago but was subsequently removed. Same people have considered that the re-inclusion was enforced by agent(s) of the Canadian Government.

More here:

• http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/showt...t=#post5775167
• http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/showt...9&postcount=14
• http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/showt...3&postcount=13
• http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/showt...t=#post7831585
• http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/showt...3&postcount=25
• http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/showt...461&highlight=
• http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/showt...445&highlight=

I am now lost.. Are you saying that I can pay an exSouth Africa rate for a trip that starts in say Canada?

No, what christep means by 'local price' is local to the country of origin of the RTW, not local to the country of purchase. A trip that starts in Canada will always cost ex-Canada prices (or higher, if the ticket is purchased in a country with an even higher base price).

I have finally had the RTW ticket issued by BA. Now after reading what you have put forth in the last few days I will go through my logic, and eventually my sheer perserverance. Misplaced sometimes I have realized. So - the reason I did the ex LHR LONE4 ticket is because it was much cheaper then the US based one. Also I had to use a Canadian credit card to pay for this ticket Without it they were very clear they would have not done this ticket. Now initially I did this because I thought I would be in Toronto this weekend and I had thought I would have to show up in person for this ticket. On hindsight I was not thinking this through. Secondly I was in too deep before I could pull out. A slight exaggeration but yes I now need this ticket by tomorrow to get my Chinese Visas and this way was almost finished. When I attempted to do this ticket by calling the UK and paying in pounds the agent said he felt my fare could not be matched and to go through the Canadian channel. The UK agent was also helpful but exacting when he said I had to use a UK credit card. Now after reading other info on the sticky this seems to not be the case but I am not sure. So frankly while I am now more knowledgeable about this system I am nowhere near the level of the average FT'er. By the way - yes I am going to Guilin. Now I think in my first RTW foray I have left tons of miles on the table and prob. did some things that made this process harder. On the other hand BA were at times helpful (esp. UK based) and not.

I have to admit I wish I could have asked a few more questions but being a newbie in this world can be an intimidating place to be. I feel that asking questions albeit "daft" ones are normally done honestly and not to annoy or bore people. A few times here I have done unacceptable practices and asked about something that was similar in tone to a question asked previously (or I admit I asked the forbidden "Help me with a cheap fare?") but I am learning. On another thread I gathered that some newbies get up and leave or quietly lurk. I hope that one day I will reach your knowledge. Sadly I will be doing it from cattle at the back because I choose to grin and bear it and there is no business that pays for F when you raise two girls but at least we see a lot that way. I will also hope to get savvy enough that the lingo trips off of my tongue as I plan trips. All in all this site is useful and brilliant. I will continue to learn with all of this info that is here for the reading and I am thrilled that it prompted my foray into RTW and and I'll be back.

Thanks Viajero for confirming what I thought all along... Reading these posts is getting to me :)

3galsontour, congratulations on succesfully having the ticket issued. You certainly needed persistence, and it's very unfortunate that you had to go through it all when these things should be simple. As you will have seen if you've perused the various forums on FT, no matter how much knowledge one has, the airlines will at some time (well, often actually) do something to make your life difficult.

I hope you and your daughters have a fantastic trip - travel is one of the best forms of education we can give our kids. Don't forget to discuss with them the "Canadian exception" and all things frequent flyer - it will give them a big head start on the way to becoming frequent flyer gurus so they can continue to travel their whole lives.