composing a DONE4 itinerary
 

My brother is moving to Sydney (for good) soon, and next year I intend to visit him. I've read a lot about the xONEx fares (Thanks to FT :) ^ ) and I'm thinking of treating myself to an ex-GIB or ex-WAW DONE4 rather than a boring old LHR-SYD return. I'm not a regular business class flyer, in fact before this year I'd never done so, but after CX LHR-HKG and BA SFO-LHR I'm now reluctant to tour the world in economy :D

If I do this trip the 4 continents are going to be Europe, Asia, SWP and North America, in that order and I'm thinking it will be 2-3 months long. The only genuine requirement on the trip is to visit SYD. Everything else is a bonus. That said, I would like to revisit SFO, go to Las Vegas and avoid New York. Other than that I'm after maximising BAEC miles, doing as many flights as I can, and avoiding overland sectors -- I don't drive, will probably be travelling alone and am not that adventurous... I'm a big fan of cities, especially ones with lots of good pubs ^

In my head I've got ideas of visiting Singapore, Tokyo and Hong Kong; Melbourne, Sydney, and Auckland; San Francisco, LA, Las Vegas, Seattle (looks difficult though) and Boston. In Europe I've no preferences, DXB sounds good though. Basically I'm kinda throwing this out there to let FTers suggest where I should and shouldn't go :) My first draft looks like this:

(GIB or WAW)-LHR-HKG-SIN-NRT-MEL-SYD-AKL-SYD-SFO-DFW-LAS-LAX-BOS-LHR-DXB-LHR-(GIB or WAW)

To my shame I've not run it through the validator :( (actually the link in the FAQ gives me a 404 error) and I know I've not got 20 flights there. Please help, denizens of FT - any recommendations gratefully received!

Unless JL joins one world by the time you've bought the ticket, SIN-NRT will need to be SIN-HKG-NRT.

You still have enough north american sectors to do DFW-SEA-DFW (but only on AA metal not the codeshares on Alaska).

First, when will take this trip? Can you wait until JAL and others join OW, hopefully in early 2007?
Second, drop the MEL-SYD and LAS-LAX segments and buy separate, cheap tickets for those flights.
If you change the order to Europe-SWP-Asia-North America, you can add lots of miles as you will be able to add 2 more intercontential flights by transiting thru Asia on the way to SWP.
(GIB or WAW)-LHR-SYD-AKL-SYD-PER-HKG-SIN-HKG-NRT-LAX-BOS-DFW-SEA-DFW/ORD-SFO-LHR-DXB-LHR-(GIB or WAW).

(And to Kiwi Flyer) it'll probably be not until at least April or May 2007.

Now that's more like it :) ^ thanks a lot. I've read the rules and FAQs but I still get confused about the transit rules and thought I had to do Asia before SWP. Great to hear I don't :) Despite explicitly mentioning LAS I can probably live without it, 'cos I won't be able to afford to do any gambling anyway! And I can always head there on a separate trip paid for with miles after the RTW finishes.

Firstly GIB is better than WAW IIRC. There have been significant price rises since Gaza did his ex-WAW (which is where I suspect you go thte WAW idea from.

Pushing the miles a bit further. And I'm working off the top of my head here!

GIB-LHR-SYD-flit around Oz-AKL-HKG-SIN-HKG-NRT-HKG-JFK-flit around the US-LAX/SFO-LHR-DXB-LHR-GIB.

Avoiding land sectors is easy - but does restrict your miles. You can buy a few cheap tickets to plug any gaps, or in the US and Oz at least land travel is pretty painless. You could do, say, SYD-MEL by bus/train/tour in a couple of days and see a few things on the way. And the train SFO-LAX is not a bad trip either.

As to miles. BAEC is probably not the best option. Sign up to AAdvantage, sign up for the Plat challenge and you'll get far more benefit that what BA offer.

Partly yeah, although it's also partly because I have friends in Warsaw who I've not seen for a long time, so I was considering topping and tailing the tour with a visit. The extra cost is offset by actually having a reason to go there :)

Thanks for the advice. I'm glad I've got a lot of months to work out all my options! :) Because I'm not a really frequent flyer I was just going to stick with BA because it's the only scheme I'm already in (VS Silver is a work "perk", but seems to be some kind of oblique joke :confused: ;) ) and I've around 55k miles to start with. Starting at zero elsewhere didn't seem like a good idea, but I'll go and read what the AAdvantage platinum challenge is all about. Thanks again!

See the sticky in the AA forum, because AA publishes no info about it.

DSF, please click here for access to a copy of the OWE validator.

I think i've managed to come up with an itinerary that allows you to see all the places you've listed, and hits 58,000 base miles... However, it does require an overnight by JFK... I know you specifically mentioned you didn't want to, but as far as miles are concerned it'll be beneficial to do a transcon, or ANC run. It's all down to personal preference, but the general conensus seems to be if you can get on either CX's YVR-JFK (or V.V.!) or QF's LAX-JFK (or V.V.) they're the two most comfortable ways of getting across, both in full intl business config & with full service!

The routing i've got is;

GIB/WAW-LHR-SIN-HKG-NRT-SYD-PER-DRW-SYD//MEL-AKL-HKG-LAX//LAS-DFW-SEA//YVR-JFK-DFW-SFO-LHR-MCT-LHR-GIB/WAW, and according to Mileage Monkey gives you 58,131 base miles (ex-GIB).

With regards to the ex-GIB or ex-WAW debate, the savings you make ex-GIB could fund about 90% of an I-Class (v. cheap business class) return on BA to WAW however, this would really only be beneficial depending if you choose to stick with BA's FF programme.

If you're simply looking to rack-up as many miles as possible to redeem on flights then sure, AA is the way to go. It would perfect if most of your travel is between the Europe and the US. Obviously there is a bias here but assuming you reside in surbiton as per your profile and will be looking to explore a little further afield than the US, then i'd stick with BA.

Regardless of which programme you choose you will end up with the same status within the OneWorld Alliance - Sapphire. I don't know enough about AA to know where you'll be in terms of status, but with BA using the routing above and doing the seperate WAW trip you will be Silver upon reaching Darwin and eligable to recieve the extra 25% tier bonus for your status when flying either BA/QF (along with 25% bonus miles for flying business class). By the time you get home you'll be holding Silver as mentioned as well as 1080 points towards gold, which in 10 months would need 5/6 return flights to Europe in Business class or 3 return flights to the US/Middle East in WT+ to reach. This is normally pretty feasible - work and/or finances permitting - and a good excuse for a few long weekends/short breaks if you used miles to upgrade the 3 WT+ return flights to Club! (n.b. If you hit Gold, and ceased flying you get a 'soft' landing to Silver after 12 months, in essence ensuring lounge access & business class check-in for 2 years

Either way this will give you use of business-class check-in and lounges (+1 guest) regardless of your class of travel - the only requirement is that you are travelling on a flight operated by a OneWorld partner. However, both AA & QF doe not allow their members access of domestic flights in the US/Carribean and Australia, resptively. BA does not have such restrcitions, even if flying on an domestic LHR-MAN flight you are entitled to lounge access.

Another thing to bear in mind is that when booking an award flight on a partner airline - i.e. BA miles on a QF operated flight then the booking is not flexible, and non-refundable. Whereas is you book BA miles for a BA flight (or AA miles for an AA flight etc...) bookings are flexible up until 24 hours before departure.

The only restriction I can think that both AA & BA impose is that you cannot earn/burn miles on transatlantic flights using the other airline. I.e. if you are AA Plat you will not earn miles on a BA operated JFK-LHR, nor can you redeem miles on it, the same goes for a BAEC member flying JFK-LHR on AA.

If you are unsure who to go for, then let us know how you would like to redeem your miles (what routes you are likely to use them on, and in what class - are you happy to pay for economy/premium economy and then upgrade). Is flexibility of importance to you? Also what are your flying patterns like - Do you fly regularly? What routes? What class? etc...

If you haven't done so already i'd suggest reading the 'BA Ultimate Guide' sticky at the top of the BA Forum, it's long, so you'll need a bit of time but it should tell you everything you need to know.

Thanks to the info there, i've managed to recently book LIS-LHR//LHR-SFO//JFK-LHR//LGW-DFW all in Club World, for £1000 and 40,000 miles all-in!!!! A bargin in my opinion and exactly the kind of useage i'm looking at - When compared to 40,000 each way for a business class flight from LHR-DXB it offers great value. Especially when it'll net me 245 tier points and close to 30,000 miles!

Unfortunately, nobody has recently reported being able to get a second entry into Asia between SWP and NA ticketed. I really don't think that will work. You would need to do SWP before Asia.

Very true, and this is a pretty ironclad rule now (unfortunately). The routing is easily fixed by flying AKL-LAX on QF instead of AKL-HKG-LAX on CX (saves a segment but loses a lot of mileage). However AKL-LAX is much more pleasant in D or L than AKL-HKG-LAX (I would only do that routing in A, which is no longer available ex-AKL).

Thanks ^

Overnight in a hotel near the airport I can manage... what I really meant was that despite being a fan of cities, I don't really like New York/Manhattan; having a one-night stay in order to get more time in the air works for me :)

My untrained mind didn't even consider the idea of flying to the east coast direct from SWP, heading west and returning to Europe from SFO! Good old FT ^

I don't fly enough to call it a pattern :) Typically I fly maybe 3 or 4 round trips a year, twice with work and twice leisure. I'd like it to be more! Only been business class twice in my life, both this year (one was an OpUp from WT+). Work normally sends me to California (SFO), and very very occasionally elsewhere (Europe or Asia). Policy seems to be BA, or VS to the States/CX to Asia. I've never flown nor heard of anyone else flying AA. For leisure I (currently ;)) fly economy and tend to stay in Europe or the US but part of the reason for doing a DONE4 is to see what the rest of the world has to offer :) Of course with family in Australia being able to head there again would be a bonus.

In terms of how to redeem, well, I've never redeemed a single mile in my life so don't really know what I intend to do with them. Flying F somewhere sounds tempting :D

Isn't SYD-DRW on the Australia restricted list, ie cant do that on the same itin as SYD-PER.

SYD-PER-DRW-ADL-AKL would work (assuming DRW-ADL hasn't been switched from Qantas to Jetstar).

My believe was that these city pairs are exclusive. i.e. You could do -MEL-PER-BME-SYD-

Please feel free to correct me if I'm wrong...

I agree.

FT (and FTers) is great - learn something every day :)

OK, I've read quite a lot of that sticky and spotted this
which raised an eyebrow... does this mean if I do DXB at the start I'd make AA Platinum before even leaving Europe? eg something like this:

WAW-LHR-DXB-LHR-SYD-AKL-SYD-PER-HKG-SIN-HKG-NRT-JFK-YVR-DFW-BOS-ORD-SFO-LHR-WAW

I'm yet to fully understand the implications of this, but it seems good :)

Yes.

Edited to add: but do note that it might not be the best way to do it. If you do WAW-LHR-SYD instead, you will not be PLT until you get to Sydney, BUT, the 100% bonus will be much bigger (DXB-LHR vs LHR-SYD).

Just remember only 2 stopovers in continent of origin, so 1 of the 3 LHR routings must be a transit (presumably you would go to DXB immediately after WAW, without a stopover back home). You don't get any extra lounge access due to making Platinum, however it makes the 100% bonus for LHR-SYD unambiguous. I guess that is the only advantage.

Sorry to be a pain, but i'm completely confused by the rules shown above, if one of you guys could clarify i'd be most grateful.

To me it reads as though you can only do one transcon as I thought you could i.e. 1 flight between Per & BNE/CNS/SYD/MEL - leaving the door open for PER-CBR which is greater than 2000 miles and could be combined with a SYD-PER leg.

It then reads as though although un-related to the 1 transcon rule, you are only allow 1 flight between SYD/MEL -DRW and SYD/MEL - BME, effectively meaning you could do SYD-PER-DRW-SYD on the same routing? or SYD-PER-BME-SYD etc...?

Actually with all the options available and new things I'm learning, I'm coming up with a few new ideas. Like doing WAW-LHR-DXB-LHR before Christmas, with the rest of the trip in Spring/Summer next year. Getting AA platinum/OneWorld Sapphire would be handy in case I do any flying with work (which is possible) in the intervening months.

Yes, the city pairs with a * before them are separate, independent.

One problem is that the formatting of the star file is lousy. Have a look at the same rule as formatted by CX, and posted by christep here.

Flights in Aust
 

From QF web site

Again there is confusion caused by lousy formatting issues; even the text posted by Mwenenzi could be read either way.

Consider if the following change was made:If the wording was in this manner it would be specific and -MEL-PER-BME-SYD- would not be permissible.

However, using similar techniques to "deduction by omission" the implications to me are that the routing is permissible.

Of course it all gets down to whoever is booking your journey. YMMV

Bumping my own thread in search of a bit more advice, clarification, and encouragement :o ... my travel agent has forwarded the itinerary I decided on to BA for pricing. Because of a change or two in circumstance I've now almost settled on this, starting in early September:
If I understand the rules correctly, this:
lets me sleep in my own bed without a waste of a stopover 'cos it's 35 minutes short of 24 hours ^ and I assume the rule applies to scheduled times, not flight times, ie if LHR-DXB was cancelled or delayed to later than 2215 I wouldn't have broken the rules -- is this right?

If so the only things I'm worried about now are whether GIB-...JFK-LHR in just over 5 weeks is a bit too ambitious :eek: and the old chestnut of who to credit the miles to :confused: . I opened an AAdvantage account without yet signing up to the plat challenge as I'm still leaning towards piling all my miles in one BAsket. I figure I'd make silver and 920 TPs. With that 55k starting balance, a job that's about to take me transatlantic on BA a few more times per year than previously ( ^ ), and if I can find the funds to do JFK-LHR-JFK in a TP-earning cabin, I reckon I'm doing the right thing.

Am I?

Yes

5 weeks? I don't think too ambitious. Two weeks is ambitious. Just stop and smell the roses in a few different places.

IMO, the only redeeming thing about BAEC is that you can upgrade a T fare to Club World for a reasonable number of miles. Keep in mind, though, that AA doesn't have a SFO-LHR flight so you would be forced to take BA. If you decide on crediting the miles to AAdvantage, you won't be able to earn miles on that flight.

Or you could use your last NA segment by adding a short QF flight, JFK-YVR-DFW-BOS-ORD-SFO-YVR-LHR-GIB, with full AA credit should you want it.

Depending when you plan to do the final sector, you may ultimately need to change that to LGW-GIB: http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=583637

Interesting. What happens if I book LHR-GIB open-dated now and the route is discontinued by the time I come to book it? Would the enforced change to SFO-LHR/LGW-GIB be free? Actually I guess the question could be applied to any segment...

The date of last service for LHR-GIB is 28 Oct. It's been pulled from the timetables now, so you can't actually book it past that date.

Perceived wisdom here is not to use open dated sectors; if in doubt simply make dated bookings towards the end of the 12 month ticket validity period. For OWE tickets, date changes are free, so once you know the real dates you can simply pull it forwards. Best not to use an open dated sector for a variety of reasons.

If you know you'll be wanting to do LON-GIB after the route is dropped from LHR, then you should probably ticket it as LGW-GIB in the first place.

Thanks yet again SLF (and Darren and Gardyloo!) ^ , I've changed to SFO-YVR-LHR, LGW-GIB at the tail end, and asked for it to be resubmitted with dates for JFK-...-GIB set in July/August next year.

I think some of us here would disagree with these statements. See, e.g., this post and this post and this thread for a discussion.

Yeh, I would be one of them. 80% of my problems were due to open-dated tickets.

Interesting, thanks :) I guess my "perceived wisdom" comment was based on what I'd read here over the last year or so. The main thread with some interesting viewpoints is the third one you referenced; however post #4 from NM is the one which resonates most strongly with my own experiences. As does the second paragraph of post #5 where it is reported you lose your PNR when you reach the end of your dated sectors. I had great trouble resurrecting a ticket with a few (open) sectors left on it; I had to supply the ticket number (which I fortunately had to hand) but it was still a struggle.

This thread is now nearly two years old; perhaps the airlines have improved their systems now and some of the issues which caused problems in the past have been fixed? Me, I'm certainly in the "dated" camp now.

Thanks for pointing the debate, it's not nearly as clear cut as I'd thought.