Maximising Circle Pacific routing
 

I understand the Circle Pacific fare (in D) is available as a 22000 miles routing. I am trying to determine the most advantageous routing based on the fllowing constraints:

• Commence in Brisbane
• Fits under 22,000 miles to meet the fare rules
• Must have stopever in ORD
• Would like to stopover in DFW is possible
• Best services available
• Maximise QF status credits as much as possible

The best I can come up with is this routing:
BNE-LAX-SAN-LAX-DFW-ORD-YVR-HKG-BNE
By my numbers this is 21,885 miles.

I calculate this will earn 610 QF SC's (better than half way to WP requalification), noting that LAX-SAN-LAX will be in Y and hence only 20 SC's each way. SAN is really only there to get even closer to the 22K mile limit and score some extra SC's along the way.

This allows me to use CX for the northern Pacific crossing rather than AA via NRT.

Any better suggestions from experienced CirclePacific fare tweakers would be appreciated.

(edited to fix my silly SC calc error)

[This message has been edited by NM (edited Mar 25, 2004).]

BNE-LAX-LAS-SAT-ORD-YVR-HKG-BNE is 21970 miles (7 flights, with 1 under 1000 miles)
Not sure if the above has D class on all services

Your itinerary has 8 flights, with 3 under 1000 miles (poor SC's)

You should also seriously consider a RTW Oneworld Explorer. Unlimited mileage with 20 flights. Just keep going east until you hit Oz instead turning around in the US and heading west

Looks good. And you'll be able to use the 777 service for LAX-DFW-ORD.

You could almost squeeze in LAX-SBA-LAX-DFW-ACT-DFW, an extra 40 SC's but that puts you over by ~17 miles.

I don't think there is a LAS-SAT flight on AA, but you could do LAX-SAN-SAT-ORD as there is a direct SAN-SAT (as of May 1st)


[This message has been edited by hauteboy (edited Mar 24, 2004).]

You are correct. The pdf timetable I have on my PC is from January. LAS-SAT AA1854 was Jan 6 to Jan 30 only.

Keeping flights over the 1000 miles is good for SC's.
LAS-SAT 1069 miles
SAT-ORD 1042 miles
DFW-ORD 842 miles


[This message has been edited by Mwenenzi (edited Mar 24, 2004).]

BNE-LAX-SBA-LAX-DFW-ACT-DFW-YVR-HKG-BNE is 21204 miles on http://gc.kls2.com/
BNE-LAX-SAN-LAX-SBA-LAX-DFW-ACT-DFW-YVR-HKG-BNE is 21422 miles
BNE-LAX-san-lax-SBA-LAX-san-lax-DFW-ACT-DFW-YVR-HKG-BNE is 21640 miles

How many flights are you allowed on circle pac's? What are the rules (I can't rules find on QF web site)

http://www.hardlink.com/~markdu/OWFiles/OneCirPac.html

Fare is dependent on miles and fits into 22K, 26K or 29K. I am hoping to fit under 22K.

Basically you need to cross the Pacific by north (ie Asia-USA) and South (AU/NZ-USA or AU/NZ-Chile) and keep travelling in the same clockwise or anti-clockwise direction. Some other limits on stopovers in the same city etc.

I would love to make it a DONE4, but since I will be paying the difference between a B or K fare BNE-LAX-DFW-ORD-LAX-BNE, I want to keep to least expensive way to travel in J and score some SC's at the same time.

If I use SAT or ACT instead of DFW I will have a long drive to get to Fort Worth, but that is not impossible. I could always fly into DFW and then out of SAT, making this look attractive:

BNE-LAX-LAS-DFW
SAT-ORD-YVR-HKG-BNE

This would be 21,957 miles and 630 SC's.

Might as well avoid the DFW-SAT drive and go:

BNE-LAX-SAN-LAX-LAS-DFW-ORD-YVR-HKG-BNE

for 21,935 miles flown and 640 SC's. I can even arrange a meal with some friends in SAN area while I pass through. Thanks for the tip of adding LAS into the LAX-DFW routing. Of course the down side of that is the use of AA's MD80 rather than 777 for LAX-DFW. I wonder how desperate I am for the extra SC's?

(edited to fix silly SC calc error)

[This message has been edited by NM (edited Mar 25, 2004).]

BNE-ADL-MEL-NRT-ORD-DFW-LAS-LAX-BNE is 21,995 miles but only 690 SCs unless I cannot count. 'Course on the downside you are on AA not CX ....

I make that 690 SC's (when I use the correct values)

• BNE-ADL = 60 (1007m)
• ALD-MEL = 30 (399m)
• MEL-NRT = 160 (5060m)
• NRT-ORD = 160 (6274m)
• ORD-DFW = 30 (802m)
• DFW-LAS = 60 (1055m)
• LAS-LAX = 30 (236m)
• LAX-BNE = 160 (7161m)

Total SC = 690.

That's probably worth the AA international sector. Their J is not all that bad on the 777 - and they have the Bose headphones.

I would probably do it in reverse just because it will make more sense for me to visit DFW before ORD, but that won't affect the earnings.

Another options I just tought of is breaking DFW-ORD into DFW-STL-ORD, making it 808 miles in two segments. That will put the NRT routing over by 2 miles! But the YVR-HGK routing can then get up to 670 SC's and remain under 22,000 miles (21,941). So for a difference of only 20 SC's I would probably chose the CX routing rather than AA, but it does give some choice and flight times and connections might come into play.

(edited to fix silly SC calc error)

[This message has been edited by NM (edited Mar 25, 2004).]

I flew LAS-NRT last year on AA128 5513 miles. (AA129 is NRT-LAS) Went via SJC, where I had to change aircraft, but the flight number stated the same. NRT-DFW & NRT-AUS are other possibilities.

Getting more flights over 1000 miles is worth the effort


[This message has been edited by Mwenenzi (edited Mar 24, 2004).]

Or course one problem with using Great Circle mapper to calculate distance is that QF have their own table of distances they use. Using their FF point calculator, they list some of these distances differently:

• BNE-ADL = 1008 (GC=1007)
• ADL-MEL = 400 (GC=399)
• MEL-NRT = 5080 (GC=5060)
• LAX-BNE = 7166 (GC=7161)

So unfortunately, QF would likely total the BNE-LAX-LAS-DFW-ORD-NRT-MEL-ADL-BNE as just over 22,000 miles http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/frown.gif. Might be worth a try anyway http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/wink.gif.

The BNE-LAX-SAN-LAX-LAS-DFW-STL-ORD-YVR-HKG-BNE rounting has a little more to play with (well its 59 miles under 22K according to GC). If I use QF's distances for the routing for which they provide, it still comes out at 21,943 miles http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif. I assume they get the distances for AA/CX flights from whatever that carrier has identified for the flight.

OOPs, I've been using the incorrect assumption (you know what they say about an assumption manking an ... out of u and me, well in this case its just me that is the ...) about SC's. Its only 30 for <1000 miles and 60 for 1000-2700, not the 40/80 I have been using.

Better go back and edit the posts to be accurate. Sorry folks.

How much does this cost?
 

NM

I have business at DFW next month and was considering doing similar. What is the cost of the 22k in D?

Meloz

Aussie $6759 or US $4900 + tax of course (others too, of course). Starfile with fares and rules etc is
here

If the miles fit, a nice way to start the trip is via AKL. That way you can stay in the Grand Chancellor Hotel (free shuttle and 1000 QF FF points for about $100), transit through AKL (<24 hrs) and avoid the tax, have a go at a three class 744 sold as 2 class (ie turn left upon entering), then go about your business in the land of the security check and rubber glove.

I'd opt for a WHY award fare in the US and save the pleasure of D class for the long hauls. Eg: WHY DFW-ORD-DFW. You could get that as an AA award for 20,000 QF FF points (you'll earn more than this on the trip anyway). That's good value for money compared to SYD-MEL-SYD for the same price!

BNE-AKL-LAX-DFW-YVR-HKG-BNE = 21618 miles. Travel via CNS is only a few miles more.

Planning the trip is almost as good as doing it.

Amazing place, FT!

I'm currently booked BNE-SYD-LAX-LAS return - published D class fare A$7999.

Changing this to a DCIR22 (A$6,759), Any suggestions on LAS-BNE (via Asia)? I'm ready to travel from LAS after 13:00 on 19 May (currently booked QF3126/AA1913)...

Best I've been able to do so far:
bne-syd, syd-lax, lax-las, las-dfw, dfw-yvr, yvr-hkg, hkg-bne = 21,698
http://gc.kls2.com/cgi-bin/gc?PATH=b...avy&MAP-STYLE=
Going las-lax, then lax-dfw puts you 77 miles or so over.

Edited to add:
Okay, if you want to maximize mileage I've been able to improve on it slightly:
bne-syd, syd-lax, lax-las, las-dfw, dfw-yvr, yvr-hkg, hkg-bne, bne-ool, ool-bne = 21,815
Rules provide you can transit your point of origin once provided you don't stop over, so going down to gold coast on the way back is ok.
http://gc.kls2.com/cgi-bin/gc?PATH=b...avy&MAP-STYLE=
jerry

Thanks, jerry!

I'll give BNE-OOL-BNE a miss, even though it's worth 40 SCs - Mrs willyroo would kill me... :)

21,943 miles, and good connections (except a day in HKG):

bne-syd, syd-lax, lax-las, las-dfw, dfw-sfo, sfo-hkg, hkg-bne

Willyroo, your choices across the nborth Pacific are AA into NRT (from several US ports including LAX, SJC, ORD) or CX YVR-HKG. For me, its CX or CX for that sector.

I suggest starting with BNE-LAX (not via SYD) and then returning HKG-SYD-BNE since HKG-SYD should be consistent with Skybeds now.

You should easily fit a flexible routing to/from LAS, esprically if not trying to absolutely max miles and SC's, but just taking the savings for a few extra SC's (and Skybed out of HKG). In my case, ORD and DFW are the two places I will need to visit, and that takes it very close to the miles limit so can't return HKG-SYD-BNE but must make it HKG-BNE direct, but then have a choice of CX or QF, with QF winning due to the way our corp discount works (cheaper for more QF metal) and the status bonus for QF flights.

CX or CX :)
 

I do need BNE-SYD-LAX, as I actually have some work to do with a colleague. OK then, we will have a couple of mis-en-caves too... :)

Even better! Good routing, I often forget about sfo-hkg on CX. I'm more inclined to take the YVR flight or the JFK flight once it starts.

Dont forget HKG-CX-CNS-QF-BNE. It's not a daily flight into CNS, but almost the same mileage.

A good reason to catch up with Dr D, Mrs Dr D and Dr D Junior :) . The train into Hong Kong is not too expensive and you can leave your carry-on stuff at the airport for a reasonable fee. just note that they charge per item, so get it all into one large bag rather than several small ones. It was cheaper for us to purchase a large soft bag at the airport and stuff three kids backpacks plus a few other things into it and just leave a single piece there for the day.

Ticketed today:

BNE-SYD-LAX-LAS-DFW-SFO-HKG-BNE

Sorry og, both CX103 and QF98 are direct, so no CNS stop... :)

I get to try CX in J !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Thanks again guys for your thoughts and help and inspiration.

willyroo, CX web site advises for (sample) week of 3 July 2004:
CX103 HKG 23:20 CNS 08:25+1 We Sa 330 0
Now, you may well be flying in a period when the HKG-CNS is not offered. I also assume the 330 does not have NBC seats.

[false info removed]
You are correct that the A330 has regional business class, not long-haul.

Guys - CX103 is sometimes direct to BNE, sometimes stops in CNS.

21 May 2004:

Cathay Pacific
CX 103 Hong Kong Int'l (HKG), Hong Kong, Hongkong 23:20
Brisbane Airport (BNE), Brisbane, QL, Australia 09:55 + 1 day(s)
Non-stop
330 8h35min N/A Yes Yes

Qantas Airways
QF 098 Hong Kong Int'l (HKG), Hong Kong, Hongkong 23:25
Brisbane Airport (BNE), Brisbane, QL, Australia 10:00 + 1 day(s)
Non-stop
763 8h35min N/A Yes Yes

QF98 please - I like the Dreamtimes, and the status bonus...

I now face the same dilema. I have a work meeting to attend in ORD in late June, possibly preceeded by or followed by a meeting in PEK. Work allows J travel between Aus and the US so do I try and get a Circle fare (with a HKG-PEK shuttle) or go for the DONE4 and head to the UK to catch up with friends and family? Rhetorical question - I know the answer :D

Anyone know the price differential, ex-SYD, between the Circle fare and a DONE4 from an aggresively priced agent?

The prices are what they are. Australian pricing on CIRPAC in D is $6759, $8249 and $9689 for routings <22K, <26K and <29K miles respectively, and a DONE4 is $9169.

All of which are cheaper than the full J fare from Australia to ORD. But be cafreful ... the taxes on a 20 segment DONE4 can come back to bite you, especially if including stopovers in places like LHR.

When I used to buy my DONE4s ex Australia I used to price them on travel.com.au (usually approx 5% below RRP - I believe BestFlights.com.au is now even cheaper) and then a TA would match or come under it and do all the leg work for me (although I had the itinerary all planned etc).

No reason why you couldn't do the same with a CIRPAC...

If purchasing a DCIR22 fare and including flights that only offer economy class services, am I correct to assume I will be booked in L class for those sectors? And of course only earn miles/points/status credits per L class fare earnings?

I don't mind sitting Y for short AmericanEagle flights, and I don't mind missing the FF points, but I want to make sure I still get the min 10 Status Credits from QF for these sectors.

I have to return to Asia for a followup business trip visiting a number of sites. Although an AA platinum, I have become very fond of CX service crossing the pacific in business class. I live in San Antonio, Texas. Would it be possible to plan a circle pacific route that would include the following destinations:
shanghai
hkg
sin,
mel
syd
akl
and probably one pleasure destination DPS or CNS. I dont fully understand the direction of travel (would that eliminate shanghai if I landed in HKG) and the need to transit in a north and south pacific crossing (i would cross west on CX and return on QF?)

A few months ago there was a rule change for AONEx and DONEx fares making AAEagle flights book into Y (instead of L). Presumably the same rule change was also made for the circle fares (this is a great rule change, making inventory easily available on the otherwise poor AE flights, along with giving the full Y SC). Some other one class services were also changed to book into Y instead of L (but not all).

Thanks number_6. That is good news. I had forgotten about this part of my planning while talking with the TA this morning looking at all the options. The 7-day ticketing rule is a pain compared with the 1 hour requirement for a DONE4 from SWP.

I am now booked BNE-LAX-DFW-ORD-YVR-HKG-BNE. But could squeeze in a very short DFW-XXX-DFW before heading to ORD, though not sure if it is really worthwhile. However, if its booked as full Y, then even an 89 mile AE flight DFW-ACT (Waco) is going to be 20 SC's each way.

This routing worked out only A$2700 more than the appropriate economy fare for BNE-DFW-ORD-BNE. That is only A$1400 after tax. So I tought that was a very good deal.

Hopefully I can get it authorised and ticketed tomorrow. Also note that I was offered e-ticket for this fare.