Same city, different airport = count towards 16 sectors?
 

Just wondered if I have an open jaw in the same city but different airports:

eg. LHR-ORY//CDG-HKG, will the ORY-CDG counts as 1 sector in the 16 sector limits of the DONE4?

What about for subsequent reissues, will this problem be elinminated if these sectors are flown already.

I am trying to work out how many sectors do I have left on my DONE4 I can reroute.

Thanks

ORY-CDG will count as a segment.

Transit between coterminals counts as a segment:
From the rules:
See also:
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/onewo...gment-why.html

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/3024164-post1.html

Thanks
Technically I think they made a mistake when they issue my original ticket, because it was:

HKG-CDG
ORY-LHR
LHR-MUC
MUC-LHR
LHR-MAD
MAD-GRU

etc....

Whilst I only had 4 european segments, should CDG-ORY be counted as one segment in the quota for each region?

Sorry I just read the quota said FLIGHT SEGMENTS.. so the above shouldn't count, but will count towards the 16 segments.

Anecdote has it that the 16-segment rule (including surface segments) came about with electronic ticketing, presumably because the record format was brilliantly (:rolleyes:) designed with that limitation.

The OneWorld Visit South America Fare also has a 16 segment limit, but at least a couple of years ago the AA ATW desk (which issues them) understood that to be a ticketing limitation, and had no trouble selling me more than 16 segments after some had been flown.

Not to suggest that anyone could find an agent who'd use that logic on xONEx - that chorus has been chanting '16' for too long now.

As mentioned, the 16 segment limit is due to eticket limits. etickets can only have 4 coupons of 4 segments.

Just after the IATA eticket "only" rule came in, I had an LONE4 with 16 flights. The last flight was booked as NRT-MEL. After ticket issue, QF caned the flight and I was rerouted NRT-SYD-MEL, making a 17 sector ticket. QF had to reissue it to paper.

Some agents can get around the rule by using the city code rather then the airport code (eg, NYC instead of JFK/LGA/EWR or TYO instead of HND/NRT).

There was a time before the current eticket IATA rules came into force where the "including surface segments" wasn't in the xONEx rules and it stated 16 flights.

The only thing stopping the use of a 5th coupon on an eticket (and thus a 17th+ segment) are the current IATA rules.

What's the difference between a coupon and a segment? I thought that the limit was a holdover from paper tickets, the largest of which was four flight coupons (one per flight), so four tickets of four coupons each.

This is the [edited] eticket number of my DONE3 last year.
160-233XXXX417-20
417 had 4 flights, as did 418, 419 and 420.

On the old paper tickets, each 'page' had 4 segments with 4 copies of that page, one for each segment with the segment that copy was for highlighted.

eg:
copy 1
>JFK-LAX<
LAX-NRT
NRT-HKG
HKG-SIN

copy 2
JFK-LAX
>LAX-NRT<
NRT-HKG
HKG-SIN

copy 3
JFK-LAX
LAX-NRT
>NRT-HKG<
HKG-SIN

copy 4
JFK-LAX
LAX-NRT
NRT-HKG
>HKG-SIN<

the next page would then have the next 4 segments.

Correct. Since the grace period for paper tickets expired, if an involuntary reroute forces more than 16 sectors a conjunction ticket is issued which then can cause other issues. I've had this a couple of times (and also due to other e-ticket rules such as no duplicate segments).

Back in the 20 segment paper ticket days we flew a booking with 20 flight segments as well as with -JFK,LGA-, LHR,LGW, -LGW,LHR-.

They were ticketed as NYC and LON.

Sort of, yeah. Each "page" as you call it was a separate ticket, with a separate number. The four flight tickets had a blue cover (i.e., the handwritten stock). There were also three, two and one flight tickets, the colors were orange, green and red, IIRC (not in that order). The three flight ticket stock was pretty rare; most travel agents I knew used the four flight tix for three flight itineraries.

I think the "coupon" Himeno referred to is what is usually called "ticket." Each page on a paper ticket is called a coupon.

Actually, I don't think it's a IATA mandate, just that most airlines are choosing 16 as the maximum coupons per electronic ticket record, and oneworld decided to standardize on this number for their alliance products.

Having said that, with the exception of WN (4 coupons per ETR, which I am sure will increase to 16 once they've fully migrated to Amadeus' Altéa), I can't think of an airline that has a maximum number that's different than 16.

Incidentally, in 2003 I was able to construct a single award with 32 coupons, which, of course, had to be hand written.