Divide, Conquer, Screw!
 

Thinking about the "givebacks" that have occurred today and their relative impact on the NW vs. EL elites, it appears that the DL elites are largely maintaining their status quo:

1. 50% bonus returned on YBM fares
2. 2 changes allowed & reduced redepost fee for Plats
3. They get upgrades on awards & the return of segment qualifying.

There are no net negatives on the DL side other than reduced/limited award redeposit/reissue privileges for Plats.

On the NW side, we're still screwed:

1. Reduced mileage accumulation (25% for Silver, 100% for Plat).
2. Close-in redemption extortion (up the $750 for a family of five to get award tickets to a funeral)
3. reduced/limited award redeposit/reissue privileges for Plats (assuming we get the same break they gave the DL Plats)
4. Increased redemption levels
5. SWU's reduced to DL's sucky version, crippled by requirement for close-in redemption
6. 3-tier award calendar

Did I miss anything?

I think they caved in so they can say they mollified everyone in the 4Q earnings confernce tomorrow, but basically they've mollified their own elites while still giving the shaft to the NW side of the aisle.

Sucky DL.COM software. Horrid customer rep on Flyertalk. Fuel surcharges on DL (and probably NW soon) ex-Europe. I'm sure the partner surcharge will also be coming our way, possibly as soon as March 1st.

FT NWA folk actually like most of the people working for the airline. We've taken money out of our pockets to show the Elite phone reps that we do value them. NWA Scoop has been an important member of our group, and would actually help us out, not be some PR flack's mouthpiece.

7. TATL phantom upgrades
8. 1,000 mile PE upgrade guarantee

Are these confirmed to be gone? My thinking is that they haven't yet been addressed.

I guess it's not confirmed they are gone. I'd be amazed if they don't take these away too. :confused:

Plat companion UGs (NW style) is the other thing I am guessing will go the way of the dodo.

That actually showed up in the 2009 benefits for DL Plats! :)

Availability may be less because upgrades are more competitive on DL, but the benefit as documented today appears substantially the same as on NW.

Except for the fact that they cannot be used on sLUT fares?

+50% bonus for M fares
+segment qualifying on DL flights

Also, we can apparently dodge the close-in booking fees, if the DL flyers don't get them, by moving your NW miles to a DL account and then booking.


Regardless, there are no circumstances in which the DL elites don't get better changes than we do, assuming we all end up in the same place, since they started out in a worse spot.

Sadly, apparently it's the DL elites that they are listening too. Since the merger, apparently DL could care less about NWA elites. Although, the two changes vs unlimited is still a pretty big loss to PE/PM's given how many itins you change annually.

http://www.nwa.com/worldperks/elite/...mpEliteUpgrade

PE companion seems to still be valid on NW from the same link above. Subject to enhancement though, also no mention as to when it processes. I'm presuming for now still at the 5 day window. No word also on if it will go for all revenue classes going forward or the DL non LUT fares.

Can you point me to it? Companion UGs didn't seem to be mentioned at all in the mailer, and I didn't notice it in Jeff's email, although I could have missed something.

From: http://www.nwa.com/worldperks/elite/upgrades09.shtml

Platinum Elite Confirmed Companion Upgrade
Platinum Elites will be able to upgrade one companion booked within the same reservation at the same time the Platinum Elite upgrade is processed. Upgrades will be accommodated via the automated upgrade process. Platinum Elite Companion Upgrade is valid on Northwest-operated flights only, and is permitted in the same travel region as the WorldPerks Elite Upgrades. Award tickets are not eligible for Platinum Elite Companion.

Looks like companion is still upgraded at the 5-day window.

Aren't you missing an important benefit for NW elites -- we now receive SWUs? Isn't it true that we didn't get them automatically before, but rather only as an Elite ExtraPerks redemption at one of the high thresholds?

Perhaps the NW version was better than the DL version before, but for those of us who didn't receive them before, this seems like a great benefit.

https://www.delta.com/skymiles/about...ades/index.jsp

Note that while Delta does not offer companion upgrades on sLUT fares, they DO offer them to Silvers.

I think the new DL SWUs are very limited in use for most NWA flyers. Taking away the excellent EEP SWUs is one of the very sore points about all the changes.

If I had to place a value on the SWUs vs PMUs, I'd value the former at $1000 each, the latter at $25.

They're capacity controlled and apparently can only be redeemed 2-7 days prior to departure. The general consensus is that they're worse than Delta's PMUs, which even though they can be booked anytime, are considered useless due to capacity controls.

I am one who has never received them & I don't think I will benefit from it, although others probably will. I haven't read all of the details, so maybe somebody will tell me that I am wrong. (Also, I am switching my paid flights to AA whenever possible, so even less likely this will help me.)

If I was continuing with NWA & I have the same flying patterns as I have for the last 3 years would these be useful to me? I have no international travel, ICT is 100% CRJ, over half of my destinations are also served by RJ's after connecting in the hub, & the only time I haven't been upgraded on my other routes was when I changed flights the day of the flight. Unless these are good on award tickets & can be used on family members, I don't think I will benefit.

Interesting. . . I've had no experience with either NW or DL SWU/PMU before, so this is good to know. Thanks for the info.

I guess United's are much better -- I have an almost perfect record in upgrading about a dozen trans-Atlantic segments (from either Y to C or C to F) over the past two or three years when I have sought to under various circumstances.

I don't know of a better SWU than NW has (had). Very easy to use, upgrades any revenue ticket, into C class.

For what its worth, next year (if any of us are left :) ) we should get the Delta PMUs

Has there been any indication that the NW ones will be good on M fares as are the DL ones. I have a flight I'm planning (after Mar 1) where the M fare is not all that much more than the next available fare, and with 150% EQM for M, it might be worth a gamble.

The other question I have on them is what happens if there is a intra-Europe KLM flight (I often do AMS-NUE or AMS-ZRH or even AMS-DUS after taking NW metal over the pond). I don't care about getting upgraded on the CityHopper flight, but I have a feeling that any KLM metal will invalidate them.

I think that us Delta Plats are so busy reacting to changes to our existing program that we are not looking closely at NW Plat benefits we could have and haven't started to demand those (fat chance that will happen anyway). It could be just a smoke screen put up by DL folks so us DL plats don't have the time to look into the beneis would could be getting?

You just got one -- upgrades on award tickets.

Overall now the program merger is a plus for DL elits and big minus for NW elites.

I agree 100%. They should be takeing the best of both. DL plat can not look at NWA because no one can keep up wit all the changes.

Not sure I would say a plus for DL elites - maybe less of a minus? Did DL platinum elites/medallions get free award ticket changes too?

That's only a plus if there are empty F seats. Otherwise, it's just taking seats from Silvers and giving them to Plats/Golds.

I'm no conspiracy theorist but with all the distractions that have been created by DL, I admit I have spent no time whatsoever to look at what NW elites are receiving. We are so preoccupied fighting the fight to keep our existing benefits that we may actually be loosing in the long run by not acquiring NW benefits.

Intresting strategy .....

Sleazy DL SkyMiles management is used to putting up smoke and mirrors in order to maximize the fleecing of the "loyalty" program customers. These kind of dishonest games by DL are par for the course as of late.

Welcome to Delta Airlines, where management thinks of the customers as the enemy or sheep to be fleeced and it shows.

SWUs are one of those wonderful phantom benefits...just try to redeem one.

9. UP6 snafu...

Increased award change/cancellation fees and more types of award fees.

For now. Clearly there is a disparity between DL/NW on this, and I can only assume given the track record of keeping the worst of both, this will go away in due course (i.e. very shortly) or when NWA disappears - which ever occurs first. It is of some solace that the link indicates 09, but then again that means nothing.

The first "best of both" to occur, but for NWA elites it's a no change no betterment. For us, we just saw fleecing left and right.

And will continue indefinitely until we become DL PM's. DL IT is incompatible with NW elites IMHO.

Oh yes, and don't forget higher award levels. We've been enhanced!

I figured the end result might look more like DL than NW. Any1 know what they're going to do with Million Miler? Wish I could be optimistic on that one.

Would agree that NW elites have taken a worse hit. I think the scale of the take-backs is commensurate to the reduction in competition from the merger. Looks like we've got essentially 3 big competitors now in the mega-programs/alliances, and with a field like that it's easier for them to behave like an oligopoly.

The reduction to 25% bonuses for silvers stinks, as it changes the math and doesn't provide much incentive for maintaining silver elite.

Maybe the future's just filled with LCCs and ULCCs and an unbundle-everything approach where price is king and first class is more like Spirit's "big front seat." :(

I'd agree... classic uncompetitive behaviour. Remove a major player from the game, and the big three will put the squeeze on their FFs. Nowhere to run, nowhere to hide.