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-   -   NW Domestic First Class - Worst in the industry??? (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/northwest-worldperks/78507-nw-domestic-first-class-worst-industry.html)

kidvintage Mar 24, 04 5:58 pm

NW Domestic First Class - Worst in the industry???
 
Being NW Platinum for five straight years, I have gotten to know NW pretty darn well. I have also on occasion flown CO, AA, UA, and other majors "up front". The inflight experiences in FC on all other carriers has been MUCH better than NW. Here are a few examples:

NW - VERY scratchy cloth seats
Others - Leather

NW - Rarely FC pillows
Others - Dedicated "nicer" pillows up front

NW - ABSOLUTELY ZERO domestic inflight music/movies
Others - Full selection

NW - NO FIRST CLASS MEAL SELECTION in the last 2 or 3 seats
Others - Several (more than two) selections


I am not complaining, since I happily upgrade for free on discount tickets, - I am simply making an observation. That is why I think NW can NEVER go the route that CO has gone by not giving full mileage credit on discount tickets. The FFers would bolt in a heartbeat if the WP program made that change.
If NW ever demanded that their FFers needed to pay a "premium" (non-discount fares) for their Elite level status, then NW would have to provide a "premium" product. Or most FFers would leave. Instantly & without hesitation.
We will ALWAYS fly NW because of the WP program, NOT because of the in-flight amenities. Lets face it, we all fly NW because of the huge mileage bonuses and the auto upgrades.
NW knows that their "product" is not even on the same planet as most other carriers (except SW), so they realize that they MUST keep the same (or better) FF benefits to retain the FFers. NW is simply not in a position to make achieving Elite-level status harder.
All I know is that if I paid $1800 for a FC ticket and I was sitting in 4D on an A319, & the FA told me my only option for breakfast was a bowl of Cheerios, I would be extremely disappointed. Even the guy in 22E gets a meal choice!!!!!
That is why we have NOTHING to fear as FFers. NW recognizes this and will never, ever demand higher fares for elite status like other airlines. They know they do not have the product & service to back it up with!!!
Can you guys please let me know who has the worst domestic FC? I hope I am not off-base with this post. (Just joined the board this week!!). THANKS SO MUCH!!

Radiocycle Mar 24, 04 6:26 pm

NW - VERY scratchy cloth seats
Others - Leather

******************************************

NWA seats are as comfortable as the other airlines. I personally think Mesaba's RJ85 seats in FC (with lumbar support) are the best FC seats of all the domestic airlines)

RC

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NW - Rarely FC pillows
Others - Dedicated "nicer" pillows up front

*******************************************

I find plenty of pillows and blankets on most every flight I take on NWa, the caution is that pillows and blankets are not always clean (this is an industry wide issue)

RC

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NW - ABSOLUTELY ZERO domestic inflight music/movies
Others - Full selection

****************************************

I think most pax don't want to listen to a video (like Co's intro Video of Gordon and "shorts" whe they are reading, doing work on a laptop, or talking to a business asociate. Many people that want to see a moviw bring the movie they want to watch and a DVD player. It may be wasteful to show movies on a/c that nobody wants to watch (and expensive too!)

RC

***************************************

NW - NO FIRST CLASS MEAL SELECTION in the last 2 or 3 seats
Others - Several (more than two) selections

Easy solution to this concern, sit in rows 1 (bulkhead, or rows 2-3 of A320/319 and rows 1-4 on 757's)

RC


flyboy7974 Mar 24, 04 6:30 pm

i highly disagree with you about the audio/visual portion, this is why i stopped flying nwa, lack of ife. i enjoy the f cabin on america west. i enjoyed most of my experiences with co in f, but their f/a always seem to have a stick up their _ _ _! alaska air also had a nice f product, but recent catering cutbacks have hurt i think.

gachen Mar 24, 04 6:35 pm

NW: more seats in the front for free upgrate regardless of fare base

Others: ...

If I have to pay $1800 to sit in the front, I may select a different carrier. If I pay the price sit in the back, I will still chose NW.

LexPassenger Mar 24, 04 6:41 pm

The worst first class is the one I can't get into...

I've often enough been in the last row and had my meal choice to dispute that claim.... plus, it's nice to get a meal! You should have seen what that widget airline claimed was a "meal" the last time I flew first class (paid, mind you) with them...

And personally, I dislike sticky leather and don't watch IFE -- I actively LIKE the fact that on NW domestic there is no "battle of the windowshades". I know many have a different take, but that should tip you that comparatives and superlatives are very subjective.

It is very much a matter of personal preference. Since I have never had the pleasure of Potentate Class (tm) on a far or middle eastern airline, but have too often had the less-than-pleasant experience of North American coach, I can stay happy with NW first, thank you very much.

I believe that NW does successfully demand higher returns for elite status by making us loyal -- fly more or less conveniently -- in return for the bribe. That has to count for extra cash in the till, eh?

If enough of us like the NW approach, they'll do okay.



------------------
"It was the epoch of belief, it was the epoch of incredulity..."

HeelLaw Mar 24, 04 6:41 pm

I absolutely agree, and think you should join a different program to free up a seat for me.

Thanks in advance.

socrates Mar 24, 04 6:46 pm

If I want to watch a movie I put a DVD in the player...if I want to listen to music I put my headphones on (I usually don't like the airline selections anyways)....F on NWA beats an RJ any day of the week in my book and since NWA has more F seats in their inventory it's very unusual that I'm not upgraded....unlike CO

Radiocycle Mar 24, 04 6:56 pm


<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by flyboy7974:
i highly disagree with you about the audio/visual portion, this is why i stopped flying nwa, lack of ife. i enjoy the f cabin on america west. i enjoyed most of my experiences with co in f, but their f/a always seem to have a stick up their _ _ _! alaska air also had a nice f product, but recent catering cutbacks have hurt i think.</font>
I think most domestic/Intl IFE is second rate.

If you fly to AMS for example, how often do you find a first rate (current in theatres) movie to watch.

Aren't most IFE choice 3-4 months (or more!) out of date?

I think in domestic FC most pax want a quiet FC cabin, enjoy the extra seat pitch (and seat width) and if a FC pax wants to watch a movie they have the DVD player and the movie.

Personally, I think the airlines spending a lot of $$$$ on domestic IFE and paying big $$$$ for the IFE content (whether anyone watches it or not) is not good business.

Just my opinion

RC

parkums Mar 24, 04 7:07 pm

yo kid,

You're 100% dead on with your assessment. Don't let the emotional redcoats here fool you - they're drinking too much of the nwa kool-aid (james page?).

The same points have been brought up by myself and others before. We stay with NWA b/c of the FF program (bonus, promotions, upgrades) ONLY. Everything else is bottom of the barrel (IFE, FC seats, meals, etc.)

The issues you mention are quite noticeable with trans-con flights. NWA doesn't (and can't) compete in the heavy, business trans-con LAX,SFO,NYC,BOS markets. They can get away with lower level of services. Have you been to the LAX WC? It's a joke....

I give NWA leadership a lot of credit for the "business" they run. However, let's not fool ourselves with what product they truly have and target.

aw Mar 24, 04 7:22 pm

Kidvintage,

I agree 100% with you. NW FC is not the best out there but it is easily available and it has one of the biggest cabins up front for the airplanes that they operate.

Let's not forget the lack of HOT TOWELS and yes, it bothers me that whenever I am in row 4 they always seem to run out of choice.

kidvintage Mar 24, 04 7:25 pm

I was not complaining - merely making a few observations.

kidvintage Mar 24, 04 7:30 pm


<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by Radiocycle:
NW - VERY scratchy cloth seats
Others - Leather


NW - NO FIRST CLASS MEAL SELECTION in the last 2 or 3 seats
Others - Several (more than two) selections

Easy solution to this concern, sit in rows 1 (bulkhead, or rows 2-3 of A320/319 and rows 1-4 on 757's)

RC

</font>
Isn't it pretty embarrassing that NW gives different levels of FC service depending on what seat you are sitting in???


BackOfTheBus Mar 24, 04 7:45 pm

NW tends to provide the most consistent domestic FC experience: it is by far not the best, but it is the most consistent. Highlights http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/wink.gif include:

* Meals at meal times for longer duration flights
* Unlimitied free drinks
* Large cloth seats
* FC on all domestic mainline aircraft
* No IFE on any domestic flight
* Easier to upgrade than AA, UA, US, DL, CO... for Plats, Golds AND Silvers

I have had my share of steak on UA and ice cream on CO.... but no other airline will offer me a reasonable (75%+) to upgrade for free on a cheap coach fare - which is all I am prepared to pay while I'm still in school http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/biggrin.gif

keithguy Mar 24, 04 7:50 pm


<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by Radiocycle:
I think in domestic FC most pax want a quiet FC cabin, enjoy the extra seat pitch (and seat width) and if a FC pax wants to watch a movie they have the DVD player and the movie.</font>
In case you are not familiar with in-flight entertainment, it involves passengers plugging in headphones for the audio portion. As a result, a cabin with IFE can also be quiet.

And if passenger all just brought their own amenities, would airlines need to provide them at all?


<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Personally, I think the airlines spending a lot of $$$$ on domestic IFE and paying big $$$$ for the IFE content (whether anyone watches it or not) is not good business.

Just my opinion
</font>
Is the part regarding "the airlines spending a lot of $$$$ on domestic IFE and paying big $$$$ for the IFE content" an opinion or fact? Do airlines actually spend a lot of "$$$$" on domestic IFE? Are they actually paying big "$$$$" for IFE content?

Radiocycle Mar 24, 04 7:52 pm

I fly over 200+ domestic segments/year on Northwest aircraft (excluding Mesaba/Pinnacle) and have a 99% success rate I think that speaks volumes for NWA.

I don't see why pax are unhappy with NWA's FC domestic product, I'm happy with it.

RC


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