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NW Domestic First Class - Worst in the industry???

NW Domestic First Class - Worst in the industry???

 
Old Mar 24, 04, 10:43 pm
  #31  
 
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Admittedly, I've only flow domestic first on NW/CO & DL. Each has F seats that are better or worse, depending on aircraft. All three have at one time or another not had my preferred meal choice by the time the FA reached my seat. My last F meal on NW included a nice appetizer, a decent entree, and the best chunk of chocolate cake I can remember being treated to in a long time, served by a super friendly and attentive FA who remembered me from a previous flight.

Oh, and I love IFE, but turns out I get some much needed rest after reading a book when it's not an option. So unless UA & AA offer in flight massage, prime rib carved to order seat-side, served with the finest wines in crystal goblets on my way to TPA, I really don't see the difference, and Iíll gladly continue to ride the red tail .
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Old Mar 24, 04, 11:06 pm
  #32  
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<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by kidvintage:
because if all frequent flyer programs were the same, NW would be most travelers LAST choice!! </font>
Not necessarily. A lot of travellers pick their flights based on schedule and availability of non-stops to their destination. I suspect the paid F pax will be even more tied to schedule.

I just can't picture someone who's so important that he/she is paying $3-4K for a domestic full fare F ticket to say "Forget that LAX-DTW non-stop. I can connect in ORD. I hear the food is better on AA." or "That CO transcon F service kicks b*tt...let me do the LAX-EWR transcon then backtrack to DTW since it's allowed in the routing rules." Doesn't make sense.

Unless flying to another carrier's hub, NW doesn't have much premium competition in the markets it serves. Further, look at some of the top, big ticket paid domestic F routes and who's flying them:

LAX-NYC/EWR (CO, AA, UA)
SFO-NYC/EWR (CO, AA, UA)
LAX-WAS (AA, UA)

NW doesn't come up once, so they can afford to be less competitive in the F cabin domestically since they're presumably selling less F than others.
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Old Mar 24, 04, 11:36 pm
  #33  
 
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In defense of NW, this is often the case on other carriers as well...although...other carriers have 3 entree choices rather than 2 from time to time.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by kidvintage:
Quick question for Radioman and others who think I am off-base:

Why should the FIRST CLASS passenger in seat 4D be treated differently than the passenger in 2D??? There is a 90+% chance you will not get a selection of meal in 4D!!!

The grandmother in seat 22E even gets a choice of meal!!!!

How about this: Before spending millions & millions to put in new WBC seats on the widebodies, how about catering an extra couple of meals for your domestic flights so your supposed "premium" passengers can get something they want?? Would that be too much to ask??
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Old Mar 24, 04, 11:48 pm
  #34  
 
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I never cared the seats weren't leather.

Why does leather matter? Do cloth seats offend your egalitarian sensabilities?

I actually prefer the cloth seats...
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Old Mar 25, 04, 3:05 am
  #35  
 
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<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by kidvintage:
Quick question for Radioman and others who think I am off-base:

Why should the FIRST CLASS passenger in seat 4D be treated differently than the passenger in 2D??? There is a 90+% chance you will not get a selection of meal in 4D!!!

The grandmother in seat 22E even gets a choice of meal!!!!

How about this: Before spending millions & millions to put in new WBC seats on the widebodies, how about catering an extra couple of meals for your domestic flights so your supposed "premium" passengers can get something they want?? Would that be too much to ask??
</font>
The airline (nwa) is trying to operate a "for profit" business. Adding extra meals that will be disgarded upon arrival at the destination just doesn't make good business sense.

Re: WBC Seats.

To make the A330 experience better NWA researched a more comfortable eat for the long haul flights. Powerports, good international IFE, games, music, etc were upgraded from the old WBC product. The MC also has powerports on the A330 in the first section.

Other than the slope (angle) of the seats I think NWA did a good job with the new WBC.

These trips cost more (have you purchased a WBC ticket recently?) and I think it was a good investment for NWA to develop a more competitive/comfortable WBC product.

RC

[This message has been edited by Radiocycle (edited Mar 25, 2004).]
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Old Mar 25, 04, 4:17 am
  #36  
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I don't have any problems with NW flights, myself. I do think that CO F/C is a bit better (sundaes), but nothing I'd really consider when buying a ticket.

The biggest factor is EQMs and FC upgrade. I have a trip to Philly tomorrow. One leg is on Continental. The other 3 are on NW. Care to guess which didn't get upgraded?

I get treated well on NW, no need to buy the tickets on nwa.com, their Biz Perk program is a nice bonus, and plenty of upgrades. I would hope for more international upgrades, but hopefully in the future. At least they're not gutting their FF program, and they have decent availability for miles.
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Old Mar 25, 04, 7:04 am
  #37  
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The IFE I agree with to some extent, but I really don't care much. I don't find myself desiring to watch stale reruns of Everybody Loves Raymond or some chopped up second-rate movie. If IFE is there, I'll generally partake a bit, if it's not, I don't mind.

With seats, who cares if it's leather or cloth? I certainly don't. I feel just as comfortable in NW F seats as I do in CO or DL F seats. I can't speak for other airlines.

As for meal choice, I have never not had a choice, regardless of where in the F cabin I have been seated. Maybe I'm just lucky. I find the quality of food is nearly identical to CO, and it is far above what's offered as "food" on DL. I also don't care if it's served all at once. I actually prefer to get rid of the tray ASAP.

IMHO NW offers the best overall product in the sky. My butt sits in the big seat nearly all the time, and I enjoy that.

Please keep in mind though that my senses may have been dulled by years of flying the bottom of the barrel: DL.
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Old Mar 25, 04, 7:52 am
  #38  
 
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NW represents the best value for my travel dollars. For me it boils down to where I am the most comfortable, treated the best in the air and on the ground and how much it costs me to be sitting in F or WBC. NW wins hands down! As for actually sitting in F I am 100% as a platinum, unless I make a change at the last minute(i.e. deciding to take an earlier flight) and I have never had a problem using miles to upgrade into WBC.

I have a nuetral opinion about leather v. cloth. I have paid some serious dollars to sit in leather seats a few times and have experienced some less than spectacular service.

IFE, who needs it! The movies are lousy most of the time. It doesn't matter who you are flying on because all the airlines are showing the same things anyway, give or take a month. The music selections never rocked my boat either. When I fly in WBC I usually watch the air show, and listen to my own CD's.

I do enjoy the meals on NW and either selection will be fine with me as long as I get the cake . When asked for a meal choice I will offer to take whats left in case anyone else has a stronger preference.
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Old Mar 25, 04, 9:36 am
  #39  
 
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<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by ORDguy:
NW represents the best value for my travel dollars. For me it boils down to where I am the most comfortable, treated the best in the air and on the ground and how much it costs me to be sitting in F or WBC. NW wins hands down! As for actually sitting in F I am 100% as a platinum, unless I make a change at the last minute(i.e. deciding to take an earlier flight) and I have never had a problem using miles to upgrade into WBC.

I have a nuetral opinion about leather v. cloth. I have paid some serious dollars to sit in leather seats a few times and have experienced some less than spectacular service.

IFE, who needs it! The movies are lousy most of the time. It doesn't matter who you are flying on because all the airlines are showing the same things anyway, give or take a month. The music selections never rocked my boat either. When I fly in WBC I usually watch the air show, and listen to my own CD's.

I do enjoy the meals on NW and either selection will be fine with me as long as I get the cake . When asked for a meal choice I will offer to take whats left in case anyone else has a stronger preference.
</font>

Our experiences are about the same -- sometimes I prefer the cloth seats and even DC-9's!

As for IFE--depends on the program. I was on a DL flight where "13 Days" was being shown. It was so gripping that nobody got up to use the facilities -- until the closing credits when there was a mad dash and long line!
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Old Mar 25, 04, 10:14 am
  #40  
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<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by kidvintage:
Can you guys please let me know who has the worst domestic FC? I hope I am not off-base with this post. (Just joined the board this week!!). THANKS SO MUCH!!
</font>
Welcome to FlyerTalk kidvintage

This discussion has come up many times in the past and usually in one of the forums like TravelBuzz where individuals from all the different forums post. Ultimately what it comes down to is what are your personal preferences.

Even before I was a poster and still a lurker here at FT one of the original posters (those without a date after registered) stated: "ultimately what it comes down to is that each individual has different needs/wants and that those needs/wants are going to provide a different solution."

As a value-minded leisure traveler my needs/wants have not changed since I first posted what they were in FT. 1)an inexpensive fare 2)an opportunity to upgrade once in awhile 3)flights to where I want to go.

So what all this meant was that yesterday I was flying in coach non-stop to Boston on an AA plane so that I could get a free tix anywhere that AA flies in the future. Thought it was a good trade off under what is my critera. In fact it ultimately will also mean that at the end of the year I will not be plat on NW (only Gold) but I will also be (Plat) on AA. 2005 who knows?

Okay I just have one question. What do you wear on a plane that you would even believe that the cloth is 'scratchy?' I have visions of short shorts and a tank top but there just may be clothing out there that is thin enough (i do not wear it) where scratchiness of cloth can be percieved.



[This message has been edited by magic111 (edited Mar 25, 2004).]
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Old Mar 25, 04, 1:36 pm
  #41  
 
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from a post on the USAirways page:

Also, effective last week, top tier elites on AA get unlimited, free domestic upgrades.

A smart competitor might borrow what makes us NW flyers pretty loyal, despite what appears to be a lower quality FC product.

On another note, when they upgraded the international product (WBC), they made it virutally IMPOSSIBLE to sit there without paying a lot of money. I have given up even trying and fly the absolute cheapest ticket and would definitely switch if I few more internationally. An upgraded domestic product might result in the same outcome.
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Old Mar 25, 04, 1:51 pm
  #42  
 
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<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by Radiocycle:
The airline (nwa) is trying to operate a "for profit" business. Adding extra meals that will be disgarded upon arrival at the destination just doesn't make good business sense.</font>
To operate a "for profit" business does not mean operating using minimum resources. This is especially true for premium products. Being cheap does not neccessarily lead to profits.

Every restaurant has spoilage, regardless of quality and profitability.
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Old Mar 25, 04, 2:33 pm
  #43  
 
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This is a very subjective matter, and despite what some think Northwest does have positive aspects to it's first class service beyond the fact that many of us fly up there without paying too premium of a price.

My $0.02 worth? On the A320 series & 757's, Northwest has comparable cabin comfort to the others. On the ARJ85, they are worlds ahead of what any other carrier has in that size range. On the DC9's, it's not nearly as nice as the MD80's that DL and CO both fly, with the same sized cross-section.

Leather seats get hot and sticky, IMHO, especially on a longer flight. A lot of the premium international carriers don't even use leather in first class.

Mealwise, Northwest is more likely than most to have a meal, and unlike with CO, you can still order specials. While I bet their frequency is better than most, they unfortunately don't take your orders by name or status, like other carriers.

When I used to fly from MSN to DAY on a YUP fare of $673, I was frustrated that I didn't get much other than a slightly bigger seat. Now that I fly MSN to LGA for around $250 most weeks, and I get a meal through MSP, the bigger seat and 1,000 miles if I'm not upgraded, I'm very happy with their service. It's the best deal that I could get in my market.

*EDITED FOR GRAMMAR

[This message has been edited by bergamini (edited Mar 25, 2004).]
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Old Mar 25, 04, 2:44 pm
  #44  
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I can agree with intiator of this topic. In the last couple of years I have flown domestic first on AA, UA, DL, CO and AS as well as NW. It's good that it's free, and I welcome seat width versus coach, but don't tell me the 'cheap pillows on a lawn chair' construction of the DC9 seats leads the industry. They did at least replace the infamous negative lumbar seats from the early A320s. In terms of service, welcome, and food: please.
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Old Apr 1, 04, 1:02 pm
  #45  
 
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I am glad to get any seat in FC, I am also glad to get any kind of meal in FC.
But I should add, I have always had a choice even when sitting in 4B, guess I have been lucky.
I think it would be nice to have the choice of putting a headset on and watching a FRASIER repeat - or not!
The seats in the CRJ are beautiful - but just to small for a "big Boned" person such as myself!
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