silverpie

Not necessarily. Want to go to Tyler, Texas? You WILL fly on American Eagle, or take a Greyhound from somewhere else (if, like me, you cannot drive). Actually, Minot is an even better example in my case--they don't even have Greyhound service!

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MRJ1964

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JS

GGG (Longview, TX; Gregg County) is only served by American Eagle. You could take Amtrak from Longview to Tyler and then fly CO Express.

rwinn

It's not that I REALLY dislike Northwest, in fact I think the schedules and route structures are great. I can also earn miles in the FF program of my choice. I'm even a shareholder.

In my case, I was stuck in Minot without a car and without anyone that I knew. I couldn't justify paying what Northwest wanted to get me out of town and there weren't any other choices for air travel out of Minot.

I ended up taking Greyhound (back when Greyhound served Minot) to MSP where I flew Vanguard.

I have a number of friends who work for Northwest and I know they're quality people, but, the vast majority of NW staff that I encounter are less than professional and quite crass.

I'm truly impressed and surprised when I encounter a genuinely friendly and considerate NWA employee.

That's not to say that NWA is the only carrier with spotty service, but there are carriers where concern, professionalism and a friendly attitude are the norm as opposed to the exception.

-Robert

rwinn

I guess that depends on how "major airline" is defined. Based on the 10 largest domestic carriers, I don't believe "all major airlines" serve both cities.

I believe there are at least two majors that don't serve MSP, one that doesn't serve DTW and three that don't serve MEM.

-Robert

travelcoupons

As a resident of Minot, ND, I feel qualified to answer this question.

Northwest has put the screws to us big time since the last time we lost any competition. (the 'new' Frontier Airlines served Minot and Bismarck ND for less than a year, just as the 'old' Frontier did for quite some time.

I NEVER pay the outrageous fares out of MOT on NW. I do use my FF miles out of MOT on NW.

90% of the time I drive to MSP and fly my entire family (4) for the price of one ticket out of MOT. This doesn't work well for short flights, but for longer ones it works well.

Amtrak also served MOT, but it is slower than driving and offers only 1 eastbound and 1 westbound train a day...which often run late.

Bus service is offered to Bismarck, ND which has connection to the Greyhound system...this option is slower than taking a train and often just as costly or costlier.

For air service, you can drive to Bismarck, ND to take United Express 30 passenger Dornier 328 turboprops (Air Wisconsin) for normally the same high priced fare as you would pay for jet service on NW. Or you can drive about the same distance to either Williston, ND or Devil's Lake, ND and fly United Exp. turboprops.

The worst part of the whole deal?
Flights to/from MOT are ALWAYS full!!!!!

eastwest

There are many communities like these. My parents live in Ridgecrest, CA. IYK is about 10 minutes from their door. The next closest commercial service is BFL (about 2 hours drive).

UA (Skywest) is the only commercial airline that flies into IYK. There are 3 commuter flights a day between LAX-IYK. Sometimes when the wind is bad in IYK the planes can't land and have to turn back. There is no bus service. There is no train service.

My folks love the place and wouldn't move for the world.

Ya gotta take your lumps!

bwallet

I've flown to IYK before. Wow, what a flight. The thermals coming off the desert make the plane move in directions planes were not meant to move. One of the coolest flight experiences of my life. That little airport is probably quite busy for its size because of China Lake.

rwinn

And of course there are the towns and villages in Alaska!

How's life? I had hoped to hook up with you for lunch when I was in ANC, maybe next time.

-Robert

doc

On the subject of NWA and its' old and tired aircraft and their "rapid" ongoing switch to newer ones:

Northwest Takes Delivery of 100th Airbus Aircraft; Carrier Among the Largest North American Operators of Aircraft

Northwest Airlines (Nasdaq: NWAC - news) announced that it accepted delivery of the 100th Airbus aircraft into its fleet. The July 27 arrival of Northwest's 30th new A319 at Minneapolis/St. Paul International Airport marked the 100th Airbus addition to the airline's growing fleet. Northwest also operates 70 Airbus A320's.

Northwest has rapidly built its A319 fleet from zero to thirty in less than two years. The airline plans to accept delivery of a total of 74 A319's by 2003.

Northwest's fleet of 70 A320 aircraft also continues to grow. The carrier will take delivery of 12 additional A320's. By 2004, Northwest will operate 82 A320's.

In January, Northwest announced that its fleet would expand further to include Airbus wide-body aircraft with an order for 24 A330 aircraft. The first A330 is expected to join the Northwest fleet in 2003.

Northwest's Boeing Fleet Expands As Well

Northwest also is in the process of expanding its fleet of Boeing aircraft. The carrier recently took delivery of its 50th 757-200 and its 757 fleet will number 53 by the end of 2001. Northwest also has an order for an additional 20 757's beginning in 2002.

The carrier also will expand its Boeing wide-body fleet with the delivery of two 747-400's in 2002.

http://biz.yahoo.com/prnews/010802/mnth009_2.html

MRJ1964

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JS

Yes, but that's for advance purchase fares (I found $380 for MOT/EWR). Look at the 3-day advance purchases:

Aug 5-Aug 12

MOT-EWR $1690 NW

MSP-EWR
$679 FL
$1090 DL
$1411 CO
$1420 NW

MOT-MSP is $210 one way; $218 round trip with 21-day advance purchase.

The non-stop MSP-EWR leaving in three days is a lot of money because it's non-stop. That's OK, because you could always fly AirTran via ATL and save over $700.

However, out of MOT you do have monopoly pricing, whether it's just to MSP to fly someone else or connecting to another NW flight.

Fares are similar out of BIS, which indicates a lack of price competition even though it's not a monopoly (i.e., oligopoly).

[This message has been edited by JS (edited 08-02-2001).]

MRJ1964

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JS

Just because everyone else is doing it, that makes it OK? Odd reasoning. A monopoly is a monopoly is a monopoly! Your belief that NW can do no wrong is the reason NW has such a bad reputation.

And, you will need to come up with better examples of allowed monopolies. 7-11 does not have a monopoly on the milk market. They are more convenient, so their prices are marginally higher. Not three times higher, just marginally -- enough to offset the cost of operating many small stores around the clock.

ATM's charge a fee because it costs money to operate an ATM and participate in bank networks. Unusually high fees tend to exist in out-of-the-way locations where it costs more to service the machine. In those cases, using a credit card instead of doing a cash withdrawal is pretty easy, unlike flying out of MOT for a reasonable price.

ilovemiles

Why is NW a monopoly in MOT? To be a monopoly, there must be a barrier to entry to prevent other competitors from entering the market, or some other guarantee of exclusivity in that market.

Is there some outside force (governmental?) or other factor that prevents other airlines from serving MOT? I doubt it. I suspect that NW is the only airline in MOT due to economics.

There are at least two economic factors involved: 1) The population of Minot is tiny (35-40k). Comparing MOT fares with MSP fares isn't an "apples to apples" comparison . MSP has a population well over 10-15 times Minot. Of course, the MSP metro area has a population larger than the entire state of ND! This means more business travelers, more leisure passengers, more schedule options, better yield, more competition, lower fares, etc.

2) MOT is a significant distance from the hub of any major airline. Any aircraft is tied up for a significant period of time (and using a significant amount of fuel) just bringing people to the "hub". Why shouldn't there be an extra fee for this convenience?

I think that the examples above fit the situation:

1) People can choose to pay more for the convenience of purchasing their milk at 7-11 or they can save some money and get it somewhere else. Likewise, people can choose the convenience of flying from MOT for a high fare or choose another travel option (see Amtrak/Greyhound mentioned earlier in this thread).

2) "Unusually high fees tend to exist in out-of-the-way locations where it costs more to service the machine". Minot is an "out-of-the-way location".

As mentioned earlier... "Flights to/from MOT are ALWAYS full". If the prices were higher than the market will bear, the flights wouldn't be full.

I frequently fly out of airports where NW/Mesaba is the only real option (BJI, GPZ) and face the same issues. I certainly wish that the fares were lower. I often have to drive to MSP because flying local is so expensive. Of course, once I've decided to drive to MSP I go with the best fare/airline. We're going Delta this month!

I wonder how much business Delta and the other airlines gained because people have to drive to MSP? If the local fares were lower, we'd go NW for the entire route.

But, I can't blame NW for trying to maximize their profits in the smaller markets... They are in business to earn money.