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My first international op-up was LAME.

My first international op-up was LAME.

 
Old Jun 27, 07, 2:09 am
  #16  
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
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I understand the frustration of the sometimes ambigous mutual representation of NW and KL respective business across the pond. Trust me that there are frustrations on both sides. I expect improvement in the coming years.

WBC on short European hops used to be amazing. Same great (old WBC) seats, full meals with cognac after, etc. even on 40 minute AMS-LHR. Thing is, if now your purchasing manager can put you on EasyJet for $50 he won't pay the $1500 for the WBC ticket anymore. That is why ES had to be introduced.

I wouldn't personally pay a nickel for Europe Select (which is explicity not called World Business Class since it is not) either. However, happily for KLM, the profits of AFKL and the long-term viability of the airline NW joint ventures with, many people and companies do pay substantially more for the extra flexibility and marginally extra comfort of an ES ticket. If ES were a just a space-hogging, FF program upgrade gimmick like NW FC, then NW WP members would also be upgraded on KL domestic flights. However, it is not. It is a money maker. No one goes into ES "just because" (unless they are an employee) without either paying or by being asked to help in an overbooked Y or W&B situation. Nevertheless, WP members share the same or even better priority for op-ups into ES as FB elites. And, if you are put into paid ES automatically from your WBC connection on your NW code-share, you can rest assured that there will be more newspapers & magazines, better food and better liquor then you will find on any NW FC US flight of equivalent length.

If it is any consolation, FB Platinum Elites are almost never op-upped on NW international WBC, only WP. And, the last time I spent more than $1.100 on tickets plus 25.000 FB miles plus $250 for a WBC upgrade AMS-MSP on NW metal for my family, the FA on aboard made a point of always serving them dead last, giving them no choice of meal and reminding them "they didn't pay for their seat"(!)

P.S. It is not true that USA residents cannot be members of AKFL Flying Blue. That was the case for KL Flying Dutchman, but is no longer so. If you are tired of earning double & triple miles from all the great WP promotions, want to deal with lots 0% and 25% earning fare classes on NW, KL & AF, like the idea of paying $300 in surcharges and taxes for a single "free" award ticket, etc. you might want to switch to FB!
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Old Jun 27, 07, 2:54 am
  #17  
 
Join Date: May 2002
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Originally Posted by SamuelS View Post
I was seeing off a good friend at MSP on a MSP-LGW flight. He was late to check-in, right at the cut off. Flight was overbooked, so he got automatic seat assignment in WBC.

He wasn't even a WP member, so whilst good for him, I think it's lame that WP members weren't upgraded first. I find it hard to believe on a full DC10 MSP-LGW that there wasn't one single elite member sitting in Y. Advising seat assignment at gate, and paging an Elite member in Y for the op-up would take care of it, but I guess at the last minute, they couldn't be bothered.

Not sure if it's standard operating procedure or just 'luck of draw' with op-ups - anyone any ideas?

This would be the last person I would op-up on ANY flight...no offense. Upgrading someone who checks in late only rewards the situation and encourages the customer to check-in late again the next time. Secondly, with no FF status, much-less an account at all, is this the type of customer we want to bring back, perhaps...but rewarding those who are consitantly and proven to be loyal (elites) would be my first choice.
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Old Jun 27, 07, 3:06 am
  #18  
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And let me say thank you for having this mentality. I take it the GA in the original situation just didn't care; likely saw an oversell and a quick simply way to resolve the problem. You, OTOH, actually take that extra step to make sure things are the way they should be. ^
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Old Jun 27, 07, 6:00 am
  #19  
 
Join Date: May 2005
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Originally Posted by DanTravels View Post
...I am not a Flying Blue member - and under the terms of the joint venture, can't be one, since I live in the U.S. ...
Leaving all other issues aside, this is not true. Flying Blue operates worldwide (it was Flying Dutchman, RIP, which did not operate in the US). On the other hand, as a Europe-based traveller I am not "allowed" to belong to WorldPerks
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Old Jun 27, 07, 6:20 am
  #20  
 
Join Date: Jul 2000
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Originally Posted by DanTravels View Post
This isn't the "NW forum," it's the Northwest WorldPerks forum. I'm a WorldPerks member. I am not a Flying Blue member - and under the terms of the joint venture, can't be one, since I live in the U.S.

As a WorldPerks member, I participate in the WorldPerks forum, not the Flying Blue one. When something happens to me solely because of my WorldPerks elite status, I don't think it odd to post in the WorldPerks forum. In this case, the carrier is a red (tail) herring.

If the information above doesn't constitute a sufficient rationale for why I posted here originally, instead of continuing to go back and forth with Mike, please just PM one of the moderators - xyzzy, slippahs or thezipper - and suggest that the thread be moved. It's been here for almost a month now - maybe they just didn't notice it.

Sincerely,

the O.P.
(I'm surprised I'm posting this since I get quite amused by those who criticize the title of the post!)

I think you make a good case for the post being in this forum...but the title originally led me to assume that a NW flight across one of the ponds (what I thought of when I read "international op-up") was disappointing (which surprised me, and led me to read the thread).

If I had seen a post about lousy business class on KLM European flights, I probably would have skipped it as I don't have any plans to use those flights.
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Old Jun 27, 07, 6:41 am
  #21  
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
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Originally Posted by Vegas Agent View Post
This would be the last person I would op-up on ANY flight...no offense. Upgrading someone who checks in late only rewards the situation and encourages the customer to check-in late again the next time. Secondly, with no FF status, much-less an account at all, is this the type of customer we want to bring back, perhaps...but rewarding those who are consitantly and proven to be loyal (elites) would be my first choice.
I know people without Skyteam status who have achieved a significantly better op-up % on NW TATL flights than me just because they arrive late at the MSP gate from their connections out of Podunk, USA. They saw it working first by accident and later adopted it as a self-reinforcing strategy that subsequently led them to fly NW more. So, yes, it happens, again for reasons of operational expediency (gotta close the flight), but more often than you might think. And, although this statement may piss off NW elites, doing so may help gain more future high value customers for NW by giving passengers a good "slot-machine"-like experience...
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Old Jun 27, 07, 9:56 am
  #22  
 
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Originally Posted by DanTravels View Post
On that flight, the purser came through the plane with his printout, stopping and talking personally to everyone who was gold or better - even in Y. There were only 2 GE/PE folks in ES, so I was the third person he got to.
^ I had that happen 2 weeks ago on an OTP-AMS flight. The purser came to me first (I was in row 4, I guess no Plats/Golds in ES) and I found that to be an excellent touch. It was just small talk to acknowledge my Platinumhood (I had a book about Dutch and she taught me how to count to 10 in Dutch) - nothing big but I for one loved it. ^

The best part about that was that afterwards all the pax around me were looking at me in dismay... gave me that "yeah, I know, I'm awesome" feeling
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Old Jun 27, 07, 8:50 pm
  #23  
 
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Originally Posted by Klm is Dead - Long Live KLM View Post
And, if you are put into paid ES automatically from your WBC connection on your NW code-share, you can rest assured that there will be more newspapers & magazines, better food and better liquor then you will find on any NW FC US flight of equivalent length.
For that matter, you'll get better (or at least more) food in KLM Y than in NW F for short flights -- even the 45-minute hop from AMS to LHR gets you a meal (well, at least a sandwich), rather than just a bag of peanuts or pretzels.
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