NW WBC vs KLM WBC

 
Old May 9, 2007, 1:07 pm
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NW WBC vs KLM WBC

I'm planning an award trip to Germany next year for me and She Who Must Be Obeyed

From LA our two choices* are LAX-DTW-FRA and LAX-AMS-FRA, the latter being on a 747 Combi. All things being equal I'd lean towards KLM (I think SWMBO would get a kick out of the upper deck) but never having flown KLM WBC I have no idea if things are equal. Anybody have strong feelings one way or the other?

* There are obviously other SkyTeam choices, LAX-CDG-FRA on AF, LAX-EWR-FRA on CO, etc.
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Old May 9, 2007, 1:15 pm
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Haven't flown new NW WBC in a few years but I prefer it to the WBC seats KL uses on the 74Ms (flew late last month). I had 1A which I prefer to the u/d. LAX-AMS would give you more premium seat travel time than DTW-AMS though. Given the time factor, I'd go for KL LAX-AMS.
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Old May 9, 2007, 1:25 pm
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I think flying the DTW-LAX segment in domestic first alone would make the two combinations not equal. I would fly the KL flights, given those choices. Although LAX-CDG-FRA on AF is an interesting combination, especially if you can work a stopover in CDG (who doesn't like a couple days in Paris?) so you don't have to deal with the transfer madness at CDG.
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Old May 9, 2007, 1:34 pm
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Having done both NW & KL routings to Europe, I'd say it's a toss up:

NW WBC via DTW:

- DTW is great/easy airport to connect
- nice WorldClubs in DTW
- A333's have power, good seats and I think improving service

KL WBC via AMS:

- 747 is cool, but seats are no where near new as NW's
- slightly better amenity kit
- slightly better wine
- you now have to go thru security again in AMS when connecting from Int'l (and the liquid Nazi's in AMS don't like the size of the zip bags LAX airports give out!)
- remember there is now an earlier LAX-AMS FL flight 3 days a week on a 777, new seats but WBC has a middle

LAX-CDG-FRA is not an option I've tried yet, but anxious to do. Just allow a DAY to transit at CDG as it's a freakin' zoo to connect.
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Old May 9, 2007, 1:50 pm
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Originally Posted by nroscoe
- remember there is now an earlier LAX-AMS FL flight 3 days a week on a 777, new seats but WBC has a middle
Supposed to be really bad so all the KL FFs are avoiding it.
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Old May 9, 2007, 2:11 pm
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I've lomg been a big KL fan (lots of LAX-AMS trips in WBC) but, since you have to change planes someplace, I'd go with NW. WBC on the 330 is much more comfortable, more modern, more private and more luxurious. And domestic first beats the pants off KL's intra-European "Europe Select" product, which is just a normal 3-abreast coach section with 2" more legroom, a fussier inflight meal and a free newspaper.

That said, there are a few newly-refitted KL 747s in the wild, and you might luck out and get one--but I doubt it.
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Old May 9, 2007, 2:17 pm
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The new KLM WBC seat is especially stiff, and unbelievably you won't get a pillow, not even as you'd find on NW in coach, but instead a very flimsy vinyl roll cushion. If you stay awake on flights, have a tight schedule, or must have the delft houses - go direct. Otherwise go for comfort on AF, NW or CO.
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Old May 9, 2007, 2:53 pm
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Assuming this is leisure traveling, flying KLM opens the possibility of a stopover in AMS. AMS-FRA is a very short flight so the fact that it's Europe Select wouldn't make that big of difference.

Here's an idea:
Fly NW on the way there and KLM on the way back. That way, you avoid the immigrations, customs and luggage re-check hassle in DTW, which I think adds a lot of stress to a trip. You wouldn't worry about that on your way there and another advantage would be that you'd get to come back and give us a comparison (the latter would be the "priceless" part in a mastercard commercial)
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Old May 9, 2007, 3:11 pm
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Thanks all for the suggestions. I know "Europe Select" is not much to get excited about, but it is only an hour flight. KLM (either direction) gives us a few more options for arrival/departure cities (MUC, NUE, DUS, etc).

I actually have a whole bunch of the Delft houses from back in the early 90's when I did fly KLM "Executive Class" a number of times. Do they still give those out? I figured they'd be victim of the new liquid policies. Makes an argument for KLM on the way home, at least.

I think I have my answer -- KLM WBC seems not be an order of magnitude better or worse then NW WBC. So I'll let the schedule decide (and SWMBO if she wants some more Delft houses )
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Old May 9, 2007, 3:49 pm
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Originally Posted by TheMadBrewer
I actually have a whole bunch of the Delft houses from back in the early 90's when I did fly KLM "Executive Class" a number of times. Do they still give those out? I figured they'd be victim of the new liquid policies. Makes an argument for KLM on the way home, at least.
Still did as of < 2 weeks ago. Some 90+ different designs now so make a note of what you have/haven't got. AMS security lets these from previous flights through.
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Old May 9, 2007, 3:55 pm
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I'm really partial to the A330, and will pick it over the 747 unless the price/schedule is quite bad.
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Old May 9, 2007, 3:56 pm
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Originally Posted by YVR Cockroach
Still did as of < 2 weeks ago. Some 90+ different designs now so make a note of what you have/haven't got. AMS security lets these from previous flights through.
That's good to know. I drank (yuck!) a bit of one, and emptied out the rest on my last trip through AMS.
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Old May 9, 2007, 3:59 pm
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NW over and KL back is a good idea. You can sleep in the more comfy and private NW "pod" seats, and stay awake in KLs "easy chair" style seats.
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Old May 9, 2007, 4:13 pm
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Originally Posted by MJLogan
NW over and KL back is a good idea. You can sleep in the more comfy and private NW "pod" seats, and stay awake in KLs "easy chair" style seats.
Only thing is that LAX-AMS gives you more time to sleep. 10:25 of block flight time vs. 8:20 DTW-FRA.
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Old May 9, 2007, 6:46 pm
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I would go NW WBC IMHO. I think the seats and the overall experience on the 330 is far better. If the only reason is the upper deck it is really not worth giving up the NW WBC seat for that. It is kinda neat for about 1/2 hour then the shade goes down and you are watching a movie or reading or whatever. I actually find the upstairs a bit too warm and always pick 1B on the 744 anyway if given a choice. It is also kind of nice to break up a long flight like that anyway.
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