fromYXU

This should help with the timeline:

Northwest Airlines Pilots to Vote on Strike

martin33

NW received about $400 million in grants, but did not apply for an ATSB loan.

there is not a chance that Congress would intervene to prevent a liquidation. there simply are not the votes to pass such a bill.

hazelrah

I seem to recall some congressman saying, and I quote, "we already gave them aid".

wldtrvlr

I don't remember mentioning congress, or any more financial aid.

I said the Fed Govt.

I believe there is a law on the books (it might be in the Railway Labor act, but I don't know) where the president has the authority to order striking employees back to work and/or to prevent a strike in certain industries which have a major impact on the countries economy. Of which I believe the airline/transportation industry is one of those. I don't know all the lingo or the specific law, or what specific criteria have to be met for the authority to kick in but I would think someone on here would know it. I may be totally in the dark here, but I do remember when other airlines pilots have threatened to strike this "authority" has been mentioned on news casts.

I am not saying that I am favor of it, or that it should happen. However, since this thread is all about what MIGHT happen, I think the govt doing something is a possibility if even a remote possibility. Only since it would ultimately be caused by LABOR relations.

MSP

Just to summarize all of the information in this thread by providing an updated timeline:

February 3: ALPA announces strike vote to take place.

February 10: Deadline for NW to present its case to court. ALPA announces stike voting to run from Feb. 13-28.

February 13: Strike voting begins.

February 14: Deadline for ALPA, PFAA to present their cases to court.

February 16: Chambers Conference updating the judge on the status of ongoing negotiations.

February 17: Barring an extension request from both NW and ALPA, PFAA; the Judge should rule on whether or not to throw out the union contracts.

February 28: ALPA Strike Voting concludes.

March 1: Strike possible? Possible NW injunction against pilots to prevent strike?

HeathrowGuy

There is an issue of unsettled law with respect to this. Under the RLA, the President can order the creation of a Presidential Emergency Board which can mediate a new agreement while both sides continue business as usual under the status quo - should both sides not reach a deal with PEB help after 60 days, they are free to engage in self-help, but Congress can then step in and impose the final proposed PEB settlement.

However, unlike traditional airline labor disputes, an 1113(c) abrogation is distinguishable by the fact that a binding contract mutually agreed to by the parties would no longer exist. Section 1113(c) allows the airline to reject the existing contract and unilaterally impose any employment terms it deems necessary to permit reorganization. In essence, Section 1113(c) eliminates the "status quo" that the RLA tries to preserve until the parties reach a new agreement. Thus, it does not appear that the RLA can be invoked to establish a PEB subsequent to 1113(c).

Furthermore, there is an important policy consideration present - we simply do not compel people to work for employment terms that have not been agreed to.

wldtrvlr

Thank you for the clarification/explanation. I agree with you that in the US and other countries that we do not generally force people to work when they have not agreed to the terms.

There are precedents though where this has happened. To a lessor extent, NWA flight attendants worked for approx 3 years without a "current" contract. I am sure the expired contract is what was used as the terms of employment. Ultimately, the agreement occurs when you go either show up for work or don't show up for work after the change. The New York city transit workers basically were ordered back to work just a few months ago "for the greater good" of the city and it's economy. (Possibly since it was an "illegal" strike, but mostly due to the economic effect on the city).

I don't think it will come to that in this particular case since NWA is not the only game in town. I just knew that the news reports had always mentioned some authority the President had to basically cancel and/or postpone a strike and thought that could come into play.

I guess whether it would apply in this case or not would be up to the courts to decide to interpret the intent of the wording.

martin33

If a liquidation were to be in the offing, the only way for the Federal Government to stop it would be Congressional bailout. Hence the NOT HAPPENING post.

The president has no power in this instance, certainly not to order a union to show up for work at rates it has not agreed to. In regular Section 6 negotiations, he can order them to go back to work temporarily under the *old* contract terms. In this case those would be long gone...

Donna49

Being an issue of "unsettled" law, is this an all or nothing issue?

NWA wants the court to abrogate the current contract, while ALPA wants to retain it. Does the court have the power to abrogate only certain portions of the contract, such as rates of pay, and leave other areas unchanged? Or does the entire contract have to be abrogated in the 1113(c) process?

Does the Judge have any way to find a compromise position for the parties, or is this a strictly an up or down finding on the elimination of the entire contract?

martin33

the whole thing.

NW has the right to reject in full all of its contracts in bankruptcy, except the labor agreements. To reject a labor contract (and like any other contract the rejection is the whole contract), it must obtain the court's permission. The court does not get to pick and choose terms. If the company's request is granted, the contract vanishes, null and void. That's why most cases have not reached this point--- instead some form of mutual agreement on a new contract has been reached, and the request to void has been withdrawn.

amartin1979

I have a northwest flight from SFO-NRT-PVG on March 16th. If there is a strike at this time, what are my options? Standby on United? Is United required to let me standby on a NWA ticket in the event of a strike? If so, will my status on United help me with my standby chances?

HeathrowGuy

Labor contracts governed by the RLA do not expire; rather, they become amenable at a specified date.

HeathrowGuy

I'd suggest running a search - this topic has been discussed at length on several threads.

murphy

So companies have no responsibility to their employees, only the shareholders, but unions have responsibility to tens of thousands of travelers. Do I have that right?

remedy

Judge to Rule
On Northwest's Bid
To Void Labor Pacts

By SUSAN CAREY
February 13, 2006; Page A2

Northwest Airlines and its unionized pilots are on a collision course, with potential ramifications for the entire U.S. airline industry, as a federal judge nears a crucial ruling this week in the airline's bankruptcy.

The carrier's 5,000 pilots are resisting Northwest's bid to increase contracting with commuter airlines to provide more flights on larger regional jets with lower-paid pilots, rather than continuing to provide those services on larger jets flown by Northwest pilots. Northwest's pilots say they will strike if Judge Allan Gropper allows the airline to void its labor contract and impose those and other terms.

The issue, unfolding in a bankruptcy court in New York, has the entire industry's attention partly because a strike by pilots, who aren't easily replaced, is the kind of event that could force the nation's fourth-largest airline by traffic to liquidate. If Northwest can hire regional carriers to fly new, efficient planes in the growing 70- to 90-seat class, other big airlines will be tempted to do the same or more of it.

The pilots say they are ready to walk out. The Air Line Pilots Association at Northwest has received an initial $10 million grant from the national union's $85 million strike fund. A strike-authorization ballot is going out to pilots today. If a majority approves it, the leadership would be able to call for a work stoppage as early as next month.

Last August, Northwest flew through a strike by its mechanics with replacement workers. But the carrier has no such backup plan for a strike by pilots, other than vowing to seek a judicial injunction against such a job action. The last time pilots walked out, in 1998, the airline shut down for 15 days. Negotiations continue and a spokesman says the Eagan, Minn., company is "cautiously optimistic" it will be able to reach a deal with ALPA.

At the core of the fight is an industry race to find the least costly, most efficient pay structure and work rules. If Northwest gets its way, "a lot of mainline pilot jobs would be thrown to the regionals," says Robert Mann, an airline consultant for R.W. Mann & Co. "It would remake the entire domestic network. This is a big battle."

For decades, pilots with the most seniority have had the right to fly the largest planes and thus earn the best pay and working conditions. To hold onto as many of those mainline jobs as possible, the big airline unions have insisted on "scope" contract clauses that limit how much flying their employers can outsource to regional partners. For example, Northwest's current pilot contract limits the number of 50-seat planes flying for the airline's two commuter partners.

In recent years, big airlines have grown more interested in putting passengers on regional airliners. Manufacturers of the smaller jets have come out with efficient jets that can carry 64 to 106 passengers. Regional carriers have snapped them up, and bigger carriers want to subcontract them because they are sized more closely to market demand.

The regional carriers also can do the work for less. A veteran Northwest captain on a 100-seat DC-9 earns $124 an hour, after two big pay cuts. But a senior captain flying a 69-seat jet for a Northwest commuter subsidiary earns only $82 an hour, while the average captain flying a 76-seat regional jet at an outside contractor earns just $68 an hour.

As seats keep getting added to these smaller planes, the planes are bumping up against the size of the smallest planes flying in mainline fleets. That has fanned union fears that mainline work eventually will be handed to regional pilots. If Northwest gets the ability to outsource flying on 70-seat regional jets, the company then is likely to press to outsource jobs on 90- and 110-seaters, says Capt. Mark McClain, chairman of the ALPA branch at Northwest. With 20% of Northwest's pilots flying 100-seat DC-9s, "we feel the vulnerability," he says.

Since the Sept. 11, 2001, terrorist attacks, big airlines have laid off 6,000 mainline pilots -- 700 Northwest pilots are furloughed -- while regional carriers have added 7,000 pilot jobs, according to Capt. Duane Woerth, president of ALPA National and a former Northwest pilot. "We've reached the limits of what we'll tolerate," says Capt. Woerth. "If the real goal is to have all this outsourcing, to have eight or nine suppliers to the [big airline] brand, we're all just bidding against each other."

Northwest says it wants to have the same flexibility as some rivals have gained through bankruptcy proceedings. With approval from its pilots, UAL Corp.'s United Airlines now allows its regional affiliates to operate an unlimited number of 70-seat jets. US Airways Group Inc., after two bankruptcies, lets regional suppliers operate 76-seat jets. Delta Air Lines, which entered bankruptcy in the fall and also faces the potential of a pilots' strike, is seeking to augment the number of larger jets in its commuter fleets.

Northwest's latest proposal calls for outsourcing 95 76-seat jets to outside operators, but keeping regional planes larger than that with the Northwest pilots.

Judge Gropper is expected to rule by Friday.