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-   -   Int'l Upgrade Policy needs review!! (

fromYXU May 14, 04 4:23 pm

Originally Posted by wldtrvlr
It has often been stated on this board that people fly NW for the Free Unlimited DOMESTIC upgrades, but if you do a lot of INTL travel you should pick another airline if upgrades are important to you. That is as plain as it gets. A few of the other airlines are now offering more domestic upgrades, but they still don't compare to the Availabilty on NW. You choose a program that fits your patterns the best. Not every program will match every other program exactly.

True, but does not contradict the wish of some elites here that some International upgrades would be a nice addition to the program. Most of us are suggesting an upgrade policy based on status and high-fares.

The issue of non-revs upfront is that of proportions. It can be frustated to know that few seats are sold up front and seing lots of non-revs in those seats. I am not saying that this is the case at NW, but look at other forums and you will see that this often happens. I would suggest that as long as some of us can also move up with reasonable upgrades (not like now where its a crap shoot) none of us would be upset about non-revs.

Unimatrix One May 14, 04 8:09 pm

"When you signed up for WP you knew what the rules were. Therefore you agreed to the policy and do not deserve it. "

When I signed up for WP, the program materials said I could upgrade most discount coach fares on trans-Pacific flights for 25,000 miles each way. There was no mention in any of the program rules about limitations on seating or any other restrictions. Believe me, I scoured the rules when I first ran into NW's practice of "zeroing out" upgrade inventory on Asia flights that had plenty of BC availability, and there was no mention of this anywhere. There was also no mention in the rules about which fare categories are upgradeable and which are not. (I understand that NW has now finally publicly stated which classes are upgradeable.)

My beef is not so much with how NW manages it upgrades. They can do whatever the hell they want. My beef was that they were engaging in all kinds of practices to restrict upgrades WITHOUT telling their customers. This is pure deception and is an unacceptable way to deal with customers.

Gold Member May 14, 04 8:54 pm

From the marketing viewpoint it makes sense to give one or two coupons a year to give frequent flyers a taste of business/first class seating.
However, as a frequent user of paid business/first class seating I can assure you the obvious non-paying passenger next to you is annoying, as you actually get used to empty seats, greater ratio of cabin staff attention, and so you come to prefer the seat next to you to be empty. This, technically is the premium you paid for.
Airline employees except flight deck crew should fly at the back of the aircraft where they experience their own service. This makes good training sense. As they fly at considerable discount they should not affect the business/first class seating standards by reducing the attention time of cabin staff to paying passanegers.

Vegas Agent May 14, 04 9:14 pm

NW's position on last-minute upgrades mainly breaks down to this: if it were to be offered for mileage, cash, or to Elite members on day-of-departure, it would strongly discourage anyone from actually purchasing the seat in the beginning, thereby dilluting revenue significantly.

buck hunter May 14, 04 9:21 pm

Lots of opinions....
Well, guess my original post stirred a few minds into action! Lots of excellent points have been submitted - certainly gives one some food for thought! I agree with a few posters regarding the present lack of ability to upgrade using some cases, depending on fare class -- I think Hooverer had a good point/idea about allowing upgrades and using miles/costs depending on the fare originally purchased - also sounds like KLM has a somewhat better policy for UG at the gate. I still have mixed emotions about non-revs situation....I think they deserve the perk of flying free (I think just pay the tax etc.) but the UG should be used to diminish FF miles/liability or generate some additional cash revenue for those interested in using their miles....or maybe also allowing non-revs to fly Int'l BC with a small additonal fee rather than free in coach should they elect to do so?? The whole Int'l UG system with NWA needs a little tweaking - in my opinion -- domestic UG system is great!

fromYXU May 15, 04 7:34 am

Originally Posted by Gold Member
However, as a frequent user of paid business/first class seating I can assure you the obvious non-paying passenger next to you is annoying, as you actually get used to empty seats, greater ratio of cabin staff attention, and so you come to prefer the seat next to you to be empty. This, technically is the premium you paid for.

A couple of points:
1. What is so obvious about non-paying passengers? Are they labelled? Last time I saw one he entered the plane just like you, sat in his seat just like you, said thank you and please, read his paper... This type of statement is elitist. We all get the best seats we can the most efficient way. I would not be judgemental since the person you refer to may actually be paying a higher fare. You never know!
2. You did not pay for the empty seat next to you. You did not pay for a "empty" cabin. You paid for a seat in BC, period. NW can do whatever it wants with the rest of the seats and you should not have any expectations whatsoever about the load in that cabin.

remedy May 15, 04 5:14 pm

I have been slammed for this before, but I do think that NW's policy for international upgrades stinks. I fly 4-6 times per year and have given up getting an upgrade on anything but a Y class fare, which is at least 2000 more than the lowest fare. I am willing to pay/pass along SOME of the difference, but this is really too much to really be considered a "perk." If it were not for the lack of good options for domestic travel from CMH, I would switch in a minute. It's not just upgrade policies - it is the hubs (too may ATC delays to ORD) and proliferation of ARJ's to hub airlines. For now, I am getting used to 10 A on the 330. Much more erosion in FF benefits, and I will fly whoever is cheapest and more convenient out of CMH. It is getting closer by the year....

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