Part Two - Galileo: "THIS SERVICE HAS BEEN STOPPED!"?
Apr 2, 2004, 9:08 am
#46
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: ABQ
Programs: AA Plat Pro, HH Dia
Posts: 268
Adding my thanks...
Matthias, I’d like to add my thanks to the chorus. Your availability tool has been a godsend. Just a few weeks ago, I was able to secure an upgrade on a transatlantic flight even when the airline’s agent initially claimed that there was no availability. I told her that I was seeing availability in C, she checked again, I got my upgrade, and a few minutes later I saw availability go back to C0.
Thanks again for all your work on this!
Thanks again for all your work on this!
Apr 3, 2004, 10:35 am
#47
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: LAX, SAN, ORD, MAA & COK
Programs: AA EXP 6+ MM, AC, DL (MM) & LT SC; All Airlines 10+MM, Hilton LT Diamond, Marriott LT Plat
Posts: 749
Originally Posted by smile67
...all your suggestions are useful and easy to implement too... next time i will do it
A suggestion I have is to alter the server usage period from a 120 minute availabilty 300 minute non-availabilty schedule to a 30 minute availability 75 minute non-availabiltiy schedule or something similar. Waiting 300 minutes to determine availability of seats is like an expectant mother waiting 9 loooong months to determine if the baby is a boy or girl; perhaps too long a wait. With the suggested schedule the server usage period over an extend time is the same as before but the service is available more often with shorter waiting periods.
Last edited by ROW2Aisle; Apr 3, 2004 at 10:38 am
Apr 4, 2004, 9:06 am
#48
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 10
Old Sabre link for availability requests works again (some Browsers ask for login, my IE 6.026 not??), look at http://webservices.sabre.com/index.html -> Shop for Services -> Keyword Search "availability" -> Choose "OTA_AirAvailLLSRQ" -> Click "Demo", enter Data and see XML Response...
...first days it was the complete CRS output, now they only show a short section of the XML response - effective solution not very usable
They know the flyertalk hackers 
!
...first days it was the complete CRS output, now they only show a short section of the XML response - effective solution not very usable
They know the flyertalk hackers !
Last edited by mm67; Apr 5, 2004 at 11:24 pm
Apr 9, 2004, 1:53 pm
#50
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: MEL
Posts: 2,441
Adding fare information...
Matthias, is it possible to add fare information to your 'to-do' list?
The old pre-web easySabre system used to allow you to see fares by class. I'm not sure I remember exactly how it worked but I think you could put in a date, a routing and an airline and it would show you all the available fares by fare class. You then had to work out which fare classes were available on which flights.
Similar to the 'seat map' functionality you have, where you input a routing, the date, airline and flight number, is it possible to pull up available fares by class?
When trying to come up with international itineraries that earn 100% miles in whatever program you're in (AA, in my case), knowing what fare classes are available is critical ... and being able to see the difference between say an "L" class fare on CX (which earns 0 miles) and an "H" class fare on CX (which earns 100% miles) is critical. This information just isn't available elsewhere (as far as I know). Some sites, like Travelocity, are some help if you use their "flexible dates" function but even that is limited and hard to use.
Like everyone else, I sincerely appreciate your efforts and your willingness to make this tool available - it is enormously valuable. Now, if you could just add fare information......
The old pre-web easySabre system used to allow you to see fares by class. I'm not sure I remember exactly how it worked but I think you could put in a date, a routing and an airline and it would show you all the available fares by fare class. You then had to work out which fare classes were available on which flights.
Similar to the 'seat map' functionality you have, where you input a routing, the date, airline and flight number, is it possible to pull up available fares by class?
When trying to come up with international itineraries that earn 100% miles in whatever program you're in (AA, in my case), knowing what fare classes are available is critical ... and being able to see the difference between say an "L" class fare on CX (which earns 0 miles) and an "H" class fare on CX (which earns 100% miles) is critical. This information just isn't available elsewhere (as far as I know). Some sites, like Travelocity, are some help if you use their "flexible dates" function but even that is limited and hard to use.
Like everyone else, I sincerely appreciate your efforts and your willingness to make this tool available - it is enormously valuable. Now, if you could just add fare information......
Apr 11, 2004, 9:06 am
#51
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Bellevue, WA - AA EXP 3MM
Posts: 2,756
Fare Data
tt7, I share your interst in fare data. But I think we should hesitate before asking or suggesting that this be put into the Availability Tool -- there's only so much that we can hope for from one already-overgenerous tool designer!
From http://www.benedelman.org/travel/ , I have linked to two sites I think may be helpful. See the heading Published Fares, with entries Expedia.Com Fare Listings and Expedia.co.uk Fare Listings. The latter allows searches by citypair + airline, and shows USD fares in fare detail pages; the former shows USD throughout, but doesn't allow airline specifications. Are these perfect? No. But they're pretty good, in my experience.
Also possible: Travelocity shows fare data. Choose "flexible dates" on http://www.travelocity.com/Flights/0...LOCITY,00.html , and optionally specify the desired airline.
From http://www.benedelman.org/travel/ , I have linked to two sites I think may be helpful. See the heading Published Fares, with entries Expedia.Com Fare Listings and Expedia.co.uk Fare Listings. The latter allows searches by citypair + airline, and shows USD fares in fare detail pages; the former shows USD throughout, but doesn't allow airline specifications. Are these perfect? No. But they're pretty good, in my experience.
Also possible: Travelocity shows fare data. Choose "flexible dates" on http://www.travelocity.com/Flights/0...LOCITY,00.html , and optionally specify the desired airline.
Apr 11, 2004, 11:03 am
#52
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: MEL
Posts: 2,441
Accessing fare data
Ben - many thanks for the input. I agree with your sentiments about how much we can expect Matthias to do - obviously, up to him as to whether he can or will be able to do anything. If he can, that would be great.
I was aware of the Expedia function - but not the one on the U.K. site, which appears to be much better, so thanks for pointing me to that. It's a big help, but still leaves one wondering how to get the information you want.
Case in point. Trying to go U.S. - Australia, in coach (i.e., as cheaply as possible), on AA where possible so we can upgrade. That means U.S. - NRT, and then either direct from there to Australia or on to HKG or BKK on the AA codeshare and then from there..... bearing in mind that discount economy (except H) earns no miles on CX and deep discount on QF earns no miles (including RTW tickets in L). Using Expedia, I stumbled across a K class fare on QF (which earns 100%) in May for about $740, so our trip is less than $1,400 roundtrip, upgrading on AA to NRT and then QF from there. Need to do the same trip in December. Lowest fare NRT-BNE, per Travelocity is $2,086 and that's B. Expedia (U.K.) shows 15 K class fares for various dates, but none go past Sep 30. Matthias's tool shows K class inventory available but no K class fares to be found anywhere. Curiously, Matthias's tool shows no B inventory available. Being able to match (see) available classes and associated fares in one place would be a big plus......
Curiously, the Expedia U.K. site allows you to input a month ('December' in my example case) but it then appears to ignore it - as I said, the 15 K class fares it showed don't go past September. Unfortunately, their display shows the 'effective date' rather than the 'seasons'. The 'effective date' appears to be pretty meaningless - either it's the first date of sale availability or the date the fare was loaded so all 15 K fares show 17 Feb as the effective date - you have to laboriously open each one to see what the season dates are. That said, it all helps .....
I was aware of the Expedia function - but not the one on the U.K. site, which appears to be much better, so thanks for pointing me to that. It's a big help, but still leaves one wondering how to get the information you want.
Case in point. Trying to go U.S. - Australia, in coach (i.e., as cheaply as possible), on AA where possible so we can upgrade. That means U.S. - NRT, and then either direct from there to Australia or on to HKG or BKK on the AA codeshare and then from there..... bearing in mind that discount economy (except H) earns no miles on CX and deep discount on QF earns no miles (including RTW tickets in L). Using Expedia, I stumbled across a K class fare on QF (which earns 100%) in May for about $740, so our trip is less than $1,400 roundtrip, upgrading on AA to NRT and then QF from there. Need to do the same trip in December. Lowest fare NRT-BNE, per Travelocity is $2,086 and that's B. Expedia (U.K.) shows 15 K class fares for various dates, but none go past Sep 30. Matthias's tool shows K class inventory available but no K class fares to be found anywhere. Curiously, Matthias's tool shows no B inventory available. Being able to match (see) available classes and associated fares in one place would be a big plus......
Curiously, the Expedia U.K. site allows you to input a month ('December' in my example case) but it then appears to ignore it - as I said, the 15 K class fares it showed don't go past September. Unfortunately, their display shows the 'effective date' rather than the 'seasons'. The 'effective date' appears to be pretty meaningless - either it's the first date of sale availability or the date the fare was loaded so all 15 K fares show 17 Feb as the effective date - you have to laboriously open each one to see what the season dates are. That said, it all helps .....
Apr 12, 2004, 5:09 pm
#53
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Bellevue, WA - AA EXP 3MM
Posts: 2,756
tt7 wrote:
The 'effective date' appears to be pretty meaningless
Yes, that's been my experience too. Quite inconvenient, for precisely the reason you identify. I guess we could all write to Expedia UK support!...
Apr 12, 2004, 8:58 pm
#54
Join Date: Jul 1999
Location: Sacramento, CA
Programs: AA Exec Plat, Hyatt,Marriott,BA,AS
Posts: 4,424
Perhaps I'm doing something wrong, but I am unable to check award availability using version 1.63 on JL (A inventory), LX (Z inventory), CX (Z or U inventory) or HA (D inventory). I have checked various days in various months and I get either a message that says "error: " or else I get a display of availability of numerous other inventories other than the one I specified. I have double checked and made sure I am checking for valid award inventories using AAdvantage awards. The program does seem to work fine for AA, AS and TN. I've tried doing a search of the Miles Buzz board for any other postings relating to these carriers but nothing comes up. Has anyone else been successful in checking award inventory on these carriers?
Apr 12, 2004, 10:01 pm
#55
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: SJC
Programs: AA Gold; HH Gold
Posts: 2,850
What are some of the specific dates you're searching for? Maybe one of us can try to see if we get the same results. It may be that there is no award inventory for the days you're doing your searches. That could be the reason you're just seeing a list of all the fare classes.
Apr 12, 2004, 10:15 pm
#56
Join Date: Jul 1999
Location: Sacramento, CA
Programs: AA Exec Plat, Hyatt,Marriott,BA,AS
Posts: 4,424
I tried about 10 different dates using various months for each of those carriers and got the same response each time. I am just trying to determine which carriers (participating in AAdvantage) show their award inventory using this tool. I'd appreciate your trying any dates with these carriers in the inventories I mentioned. I tried JL (A inventory) SFO-NRT and LAX-NRT, LX (Z and U) from LAX-ZRH, CX (Z and U) from SFO-HKG, YVR-HKG and LAX-HKG, and HA (D inventory) from SFO and SMF to HNL. In each case I tried a few dates in May, September, November and January and none around a holiday. If there are no seats available, it would be helpful if the display showed a zero, rather than "error" or a listing of other inventories.
Apr 14, 2004, 2:49 pm
#57
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: MEL
Posts: 2,441
I get the same results.....
Jimchi - I tried a couple of your examples with random dates ... and got the 'same' results, i.e., a list of every other code except what I asked for....
When you do it for AA, it does return 0 if there are no seats (e.g., DFW-NRT on 8/05 has U3 on AA175 and U0 on AA61).
I tried inputting a non-existent fare code (are there any??). Well, I tried 'E' on AA, to see what it would do. Came back with a whole bunch of flights on United, which apparently does have an E class.
Not sure what the logic is here - I was thinking that if I gave it a non-existent class, it might return all the available classes instead, which would be analagous to it not returning a 'hidden' class (like mileage awards)... but it didn't - just gave me that code on other airlines!
Bear in mind that it also only shows 10 classes, even if there are more available (I think Matthias has this on his to-do list to change). Not sure what effect, if any, that has - presumably none as you're asking for a specific fare class and 'expect' it to give you only that class.
.... all of which is a long-winded way of saying I don't know why it works for some airlines and not others....
When you do it for AA, it does return 0 if there are no seats (e.g., DFW-NRT on 8/05 has U3 on AA175 and U0 on AA61).
I tried inputting a non-existent fare code (are there any??). Well, I tried 'E' on AA, to see what it would do. Came back with a whole bunch of flights on United, which apparently does have an E class.
Not sure what the logic is here - I was thinking that if I gave it a non-existent class, it might return all the available classes instead, which would be analagous to it not returning a 'hidden' class (like mileage awards)... but it didn't - just gave me that code on other airlines!
Bear in mind that it also only shows 10 classes, even if there are more available (I think Matthias has this on his to-do list to change). Not sure what effect, if any, that has - presumably none as you're asking for a specific fare class and 'expect' it to give you only that class.
.... all of which is a long-winded way of saying I don't know why it works for some airlines and not others....
Apr 14, 2004, 4:35 pm
#58
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Seat 1A
Programs: Non-status paid F/J (best value for $$$)
Posts: 4,124
Some carriers restrict fare class information
Please note that some carriers such as CX restrict their fare class display shown to travel agents. For example, you will not be able to see award Z, or U class availability.
However, CX does allow their frequent flyer partners (eg. AA) to view such inventory.
However, CX does allow their frequent flyer partners (eg. AA) to view such inventory.
Apr 17, 2004, 12:07 am
#59
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Ontario
Posts: 321
Can someone pls tell me why Im having trbl checking UA award inventory using the tool. I've had no difficulty with AC using D and W but when I try to check UA using R,O and N respectively I just get the regular fare codes. I wondered if this is perhaps because the awards are avail on UA's web site, or is it something Im doing wrong?
Btw, let me also echo thanks for this wonderful tool. Because of some rather severe limitations on the AC aeroplan web site, I wouldnt have been able to change a recent award booking to get the exact dates we were looking for. I greatly appreciate the extra vacation time you provided us with
Btw, let me also echo thanks for this wonderful tool. Because of some rather severe limitations on the AC aeroplan web site, I wouldnt have been able to change a recent award booking to get the exact dates we were looking for. I greatly appreciate the extra vacation time you provided us with
Apr 19, 2004, 2:14 pm
#60
Moderator: GLBT Travelers & Hyatt Gold Passport
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: CVG
Posts: 15,300
Matthias, quick question. I tried to use your tool this afternoon to find Z inventory on DL and the site said "LINK CURRENTLY UNAVAILABLE WITH DL". Is that because the connection is down somehow now or that your tool can no longer access DL? Thank you very much.