and that was the point I was trying to make earlier - fairly large companies tend to have these types of agreements spelled out so it MAY be that the OK for the planner to keep the points (and it looks llike the max is 50K) came from a corporate decision, or a policy of her department, and not from the person whose department paid the bill.I understand your concern but I again ask - how doyou know that this was just "greed" on the planner's part. Someone may have told her the points were hers to keep.In any case there is no way ANY individual such as yourself would have gotten any part of the points...

Andif it's an unstated perk but common by history of that department, and it's lost over this affair, I wouldn't be showing up at the company picnic if I were you http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif

I love the way that everyone keeps throwing out rules which state that events and the like do not earn points, or they earn up to a certain ceiling. Yes, these rules do exist, but most hotels will normally, and especially in this economy allow you to accrue points if you ask them (witness a friend of mine who recently had a very big wedding at an establishment that gave no points for events, after all the negotiations, he asked about points and they said "no". He said no wedding then, they immediately offered him the points at the normal rate --the overall wedding bill for the hotel was about $35000). RUles are meant to be broken.

So bad topic title. At least it generated some responses.

I don't care about my points, in particular, as I thought the original post made clear. Nor do I know that the meeting planner got 1.8MM points for this meeting. Maybe she just got 50 grand or so. Who cares?

I do know that the guy who threw (and paid for) the meeting, was p!ssed off when he found out that this meeting planner, his nominal employee for this meeting, took a basket of points that presumably could have been given a) to persons of his choosing or b) been retained by him to be used for business purposes.

That's all.

Mike

Meeting planners negotiate a rate with the hotels for their in-house staff that is all on a master bill. This rate is not usually eligible for points. I don't believe the meeting planner receives points on the total $ of this bill, but they do often receive points for booking the meeting itself, based on the total room nights booked.

This often happens to me, as our clients provide our hotel rooms, and they are usually on a master bill. I only receive points for the incidentials posted to the room. In fact, Starwood won't even count it as a "stay" for status.

The meeting planner was just doing what all meeting planner's do, hence the Marriott making rules and designations for them, allowing them special pts (but only up to 50,000 per event) for being a meeting planner on master billed rooms.

She did nothing out of what her role defined.

That said, the person you should take this up with is the person in charge (who you keep alluding to), as they showed complete ignorance of this common practice. This person put the in house travel planner in place to be able to take advantage of the practice.

Now that the person in charge is (finally) aware, if they want the points for the company, they should make policy that all meeting planner points and/or bonuses shall go to the corporate account or desingated in some way so that the person in charge of receiving them uses them for the company, not self-indulgently.

Or, just let ALL the employees (as opposed to one greedy travel planner) have them, paying for the rooms themselves, getting rid of the master-billed room deal.

To lament, whoever hired the meeting planner, if allowing this master billing practice on her word, like that it would benefit the company, but without disclosing her personal benefit, may have an out, if this is the case, blamewise.

But, really, someone in the position of taking care of a company's travel, or in charge of assigning someone to do so, such as a in house travel person, should be more knowledgeable about travel practices.

Where did he think all the bonuses or perks of paying corporate rates for so many rooms was going all this time? Anybody who knows anything about travel had to know that somebody had to be getting something.

Major duncecap.




[This message has been edited by lisamcgu (edited 03-05-2002).]

Mike, your refrence to a "national sales meeting" and "event planner" makes me wonder for what company you work. My wife used to work for, lets see, how can I make a hint that only you might know. Hmmmm. Does your company have a large "headquarter building" at "161"?

Answer: no. You haven't heard of my company unless you're 65+, most likely.

In any event, I don't think that the vagaries of the side deals that meeting planners cut for themselves is something that the "person in charge" (not me, BTW) should have necessarily been aware of. He's too busy trying to run a business to worry about whether this person who was foisted upon him by Corporate was accruing some personal benefit.

With that said, he expected this person to be straight and she wasn't. A failure to disclose a personal benefit accruing to oneself, ESPECIALLY where, as has been suggested in this thread, such a secret benefit was specifically bargained for by this meeting planner, where the person paying the bill shouldn't necessarily be aware of the same, is not the right thing to do. PERIOD. Plain and simple. It's no different, to pose a different analogy, than if she requested a bill for $10M greater than the actual bill and received a $10M check directly from the hotel for her services.

I guess I should have blackmailed her. Because the "person in charge" is now on the warpath. But then I would have been no better.

[This message has been edited by Mikey likes it (edited 03-05-2002).]

Actually, M=thousand and MM=million is correct. K is also used for thousand, but the M & MM conention seems more used in banking.

Hey Mikey!

I didn't think you hired her, but I did think the person you kept referring to did. I thought he was in charge, I didn't realize she was foisted upon him. (Can he dictate, at least, how she performs certain duties of her job, like she must pass on any bonuses or points she is offered, if possible? Or, can he dictate how the company pays for the rooms, like by letting all the emps pay and get reimbursed, getting pts - making for lots of happy emps instead of just one greedy one?)

You see, it is common for these mtg planner bonuses to be proffered. Your mtg planner didn't have to negotiate to get them, hotels run promos all the time in their efforts to lure mtg planners toward using their properties (even if it may cost their employers more) instead of others. And, some bonuses aren't even specials. They have been around so long as to be considered standard depending on the property.

Trust me, one of the first things an experienced mtg planner will ask about is the hotel's incentive program.

Oh, and anyone who does his own human resources should know who he is hiring and what is required. There are no excuses for that one, especially being too busy. If that was it, an outside, knowledgeable firm could have been hired to do the staffing.

However, there comes a point at which correctness detracts from the original objective of clear communication.

I keep getting so thrown at the concept of multi-million dollar commissions before I catch myself, and a number of people have been confused.

However, on the actual topic, it seems at least plausible that the meeting planner should get the points. Generally, FF programs try to reward the decision maker, and that was she.

If you take the tack that the company should get benefits, then why shouldn't they get your FF miles for all company travel? If you take the tack that you should get the benefits, then what interest of the hotel have you served?

First, a bit OT. Maybe it's just US convention, but I hardly ever see "M" being used to express thousand.

If I write (or see) $180M, my automatic reaction is $180,000,000. It's true that "M" is thousand in roman numerals, the metric system of using "k" [for kilo] is far more common. I've read through many SEC filings, and in no case have I ever seen "M" used to express "thousands".

-----------------

Back to the matter of points, I don't see any moral high ground for any of the parties involved.

You tried to jump in and take the potential 1.8 million points using your account. Since you are not the manager paying for this global sales conference, you have even less claim on those points than the travel planner.

Now that it's clear that someone else got to the prize [Marriott points] ahead of you, the course of action you've taken is geared toward taking the prize away from her.

If you had gotten the points posted to your personal Marriott account, did you plan to volunteer those points for compnay use?

I'm afraid that I find less sympathy for you the more you explain.

Finance professionals almost exclusively use MM for millions and M for thousands. Bank meetings, financial control, etc. The New York Post and New York Daily News tend to use K for thousands and M for millions

Aw, Mike you take me back to my good old days in the Windy City. Are you sure you don't work FOR the city, or Cook county? Graft, corruption, and getting yours come with a part of Chicago's history. I mean, it is just all about being part of the machine there, I'm serious, in dealings with city government, the media, religion, etc, I found there are much more of these behaviors than most people care to know or will ever see. And of course culturally these transfer themselves into our corporate instutitions.

So, I'm glad to see your nemesis is living that dream and but also glad that you are on to her. I tend to side with the high line on ethical dilemmas.

SO, don't worry, life's circle will catch up with her. How well does she know her alderman? So she'll lose her job and go work for the Tollways or Chicago Department of Aviation or Water department ... and make out even better than she's doing now. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/wink.gif

I LOVE CHICAGO!!!!!!

Wrong on both counts. I don't know how you could get that if you read the thread above.

Anyway, I'm done with this topic. In case anyone cares, I advised the "person in charge" that this had occurred but that it *may* be a legitimate practice among meeting planners (based on some of the responses I got here, thank you). Now he's got the info and will act according to his sense of fair play.

I still don't see how this is any different than my negotiating a kickback from my vendors, but so be it.

Mike

PS. I love the observation about Chicago. This town is full of criminals and thieves.

FWIW, I just received in today's mail a brochure from Wyndham targeted to meeting planners. Book a meeting of 100 room nights or more and pick from: $500 credit towards the meeting, a Herman Miller Aeron chair, a Palm m500, 25,000 frequent flyer miles, or $500 donation to Susan Komen Breast Cancer Foundation. Pick 2 if booked on a "Value Date".