Have you started flying less?
 

sorry to rant, but....

I fought it as long as I could, but the time has come to start flying less.

I was determined to keep going as much as possible, but those who feel security mean submission will be filling my seat more, or it'll just be flying empty.

I've adjusted to 2 hour check-ins and long waits at security only to watch in amazement as the "security personnel" looked for everything in general and nothing in particular. i've been forced to unbuckle my belt, SURRENDER A NEEDLE AND THREAD, and be told to stand back as some undertrained security agent who i would've had a problem with touching me, got to feel up my wife.

now i can expect to be told to place my shoes on the belt, in addition to all the other indignities that come as a pre-requisite of post 9/11 travel. and i get to listen to the great unwashed tell me to accept it, all in the name of "security".

i for one feel less secure, because so many people feel the need to abdicate responsibility to the government.

so i've decided to start driving on trips of 8 hours or less. Toronto next week, Chicago the following. I'll still fly to Orlando at the end of the month. But it's gotten to the point that the time in line and aggrivation has made me reach a breaking point.

as i said, i'm sorry to rant, but enough is enough. i wouldn't take the "guilty until proven innocent" treatment anywhere else, either.

I've slowed down my flying more from shenanegans of the airlines.

I refuse to book flights far in the future when fares are supposedly lower, because of the cancellations and schedule changes that invariably occur by then. But if the passenger needs to make a change (even on a free ticket) it's a $75-$100 minimum fee. The airlines get to molest me even before I make it to the airport.

I can't wait until the security goons are government employees ACCOUNTABLE TO NO ONE. Then you'll get to see passengers treated like maximum security inmates.

Air travel today isn't what it used to be. Even before 9/11 I'd started to take road trips to destinations I would have flown to in the past. It's been a refreshing change.

If it hadn't been for the post 9/11 bonus qualification mileage on CO I'd only have met the requirements for Silver Elite. (I'm Infinite)

A whole lot of places are more than a day's drive away from here in the great northwest (SEA) so I'll continue to fly. But I'm more hesitant about booking short trips due to the increased hassle at the airport. If I have to spend 6 hours sitting in airports for a weekend trip with a layover (which is anywhere east of PHX), it makes the trip less worthwhile IMHO.

And all the delays are in the name of perceived security, which is even more frustrating. If I felt confident that the FAA/DOT were actually interested in getting serious about security, then I might feel differently. (e.g., professionals who know how to profile people and tell if they're telling the truth by looking and listening - NOT my 70 year old grandmother getting the full frisking)

I wonder when the day will come when we will have to put everything into our checked luggage and fly in airline issued paper jumpsuits with travel socks.

Flying has always been a necessity for me. It's not something that I particularly care to do more than I have to.

If I need to fly to get somewhere, then I'll do it. If I don't, then I won't.

But that's the way I've always operated, and so there's been no change in the way I operate pre and post September 11.

If there's a trade show on the west coast, well, I gotta fly there. If someone wants me to pop up to New York for the day, I'm flying there. And if I want to go skiing at Whistler, I have to fly to Vancouver, so I'll do it.

i used to think like you, MDTony, but i'm reevaluating. i had no problem hopping on a plane, even after 9/11, not at first. but as i watch the "sheeple" accept the current realities, i realize that i don't want to be one of them!

DC? 6 hours. Chicago or Toronto? about the same. I used to drive in a radius of about 3 hours (buffalo, pittsburgh, detroit), but i've widened it. it's just not worth it, otherwise.

i'd understand it if i was told why i'm the current favorite of the rubber glove crowd. is it because i like to pay cash for my tickets? maybe, but i can't get an answer. is it because my travels took me to khazakstan and turkmenistan earlier this year? maybe, but again, nobody can say.

tino makes an excellent point. all the taxpayer bailout did was enable the airlines to make themselves even less customer friendly. how is it that CO needs to charge me $100 to change a NR ticket, yet WN simply asks for the fare difference? it's all about passenger processing now. we should be happy that the airlines take our money!

they'll be getting less of mine, no doubt. and then they'll go out and spend all kinds money to try and get me back, when with less work, they could've kept me!

Wouldn't a passenger rail system be handy about now?

depends. self-supporting, or taxpayer subsidized? maybe now is the time for the feds to look at selling off amtrak? sell it off route by route, and let the private market build a product that would actually get used.

my only options here leave from either cleveland or akron at 3 or 4 in the morning. i'm not doing that to be in chicago in the morning.

Most of my travel is of the type where driving really isn't an option. I can't get to California or Denver or Chicago from DC without devoting a full day or more to it. I suppose I could drive to New York or take the train, but that's a hassle.

So I'll continue to fly. Do I like the new system? No, I do not. I think it's absurd but we have to remember that most of the population flies three or four times a year and doesn't really see this as the problem that we do. Those folks are the ones that Congress is responding to, not us.

And I am tired of the "surveys" they take asking non flyers if they are concerned, or if the delays and hassles are okay with them. Like asking a blind person what they think of the latest colors on your favorite airline. Stupid surveys.

Maybe they should reword them to ask:
"Is it okay that we feel up your wife, make you take off your belt and shoes, steal your nail clippers and sewing needles... as long as we tell you it will make your flight safer, even if it really makes little if any difference?"

Q: Have You Started Flying Less?
A: Nope. I think now is the time to support your airline. 80,358 miles in the air for chexfan since 9/11. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/eek.gif

I'm driving if it's less than 6 hours. Houston, San Antonio. The difference for me is that I'm planning more. I used to run to DFW to zip away for a 3 day weekend. Now I plan what I really want to do and likely it's a very long trip overseas.

Traveling light and zipping around isn't fun any more.

I have not flown since 9/11 because of absolute disgust with the way "security" is being handled. There seems to be no rhyme or reason for many proceedures. Ordinary personal items we've flown with for years are now being confiscated "because". What will we do when the airports get machines that see inside our bodies and they want to inspect that, too? People profess to feel safe because the illusion is perpetrated on every level. The FAA issues some new edict AFTER an incident, not before. The airlines need to come up with prescreening safeguards
to simplify air travel. How many times have we heard that the FBI, CIA or INS had "concerns" or lost track of known terrorists before 9/11 but failed to act? It will be a long time before I fly again because I fear for my freedom.

Despite my personal feelings otherwise, my travel for the period October through January (three trips ticketed for next month) is about double my historic norm. I'd love to cut back if I could. It's just not going to work.

Business is growing beyond what our staff can handle, I inherited four direct reports 2,050 miles from my home three months ago, and my company is "assimilating" 300 people (50% head count increase) in a merger effective 1/1/02. There is just no way to cut back anytime soon. I'm going to end this year with nearly four weeks of vacation time that I haven't taken. Unfortunately I'm real close to even losing the ability to accrue more.

Even if I had the time to take some vacation, the thought of flying somewhere has little appeal. Overcoming the massive airport hassles and the paranoid airline employees has taken all the enjoyment out of business travel. Up until 9/11 I still got a thrill (albeit minor) out of any business or pleasure trip by air. And this was after 19 years of playing road warrior.

[This message has been edited by Craig6z (edited 12-26-2001).]

good for you, chexfan. but let me ask you this, would you be dining at your favorite restaurant if they made it similarly difficult to get to the table? or getting you car serviced? i don't fly to "support an airline", as you put it. i fly because i need an easy way to get from point A to point B in a reasonable period of time, at a reasonable price, and without an unreasonable amount of hassle. the same standards i apply to just about any consumer product i purchase.

I heard a rumor of August 15th -- but the source wasn't completely reliable!

why don't they just start using that full body scanning system from total recall? the technology must exist by now...and the long waits would be eliminated.

total recall the movie??

I thought that was fiction http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/wink.gif

[QUOTE]Originally posted by texana:

Traveling light and zipping around isn't fun any more.

Ditto

Fair enough. In my case it's easier to get from the west coast to the east coast by flying than any other way.

i understand your point, chexfan. there are still places that I am going to HAVE to fly to. but until recently there were places that I CHOSE to fly to, when I could have driven. The hassles and extra time it now takes for a short flight makes me reconsider what I CHOOSE to fly.

Let me give you an example in your area. Prior to the last few weeks, I would have flown SEA-PDX for a quick biz trip. Now I'd drive the 3 hrs each way. It takes no less time to drive now, and I avoid the agravation of have my briefcase inspected for needles, etc....

As stated many times, the choice to drive vs. fly for 2-5 hour trips is swinging towards driving. Coast to coast is another story. But, of those people that used to take multiple trips in a month, how many now take less and consolidate them, since they lose so many hours in the process? And how many had a trip that was not REQUIRED, but instead was a good idea, then they opted to just not bother? Airlines get less business, especially the high end fares. Less business gets accomplished. Trickle down economy continues.

I completely agree. Your example is a very legit one for the industry as a whole. But then again, you can use the special security line in SEA if you are flying to PDX. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/wink.gif

So to get back on topic, due to 9/11 I have missed one r/t and that was from EWR to SEA on 9/14 (and the subsequent return). This has amounted to about 12 trans-cons from SEA to BDL or EWR (most w/ a 3-5 day advance purchase), a trip to SFO and a run to SIN.

exactly, my long haul stuff won't change much at all. i'll still need to go to europe, so i have no real option. doesn't look like i'll be going back to khazakstan or turkmenistan in 2002 (that was an experience, lemme tell ya!), but hopefully i can get my contacts to meet me in London instead when I'm over there. But until a more "common sense" approach to security is taken, I'm going to avoid the rubber gloves whenever I can.

no stress -

do you think less business will really get accomplished, or will people look more local for both customers and suppliers?

i know i'm looking at a smaller catch area to find new customers. i might have to work a little harder, drive a little more, but in the long run it might pay off into more business without as much travel.

I am seriously considering 'stop flying more'! After the Paris AA fiasco, and getting searched and exrayed the past 24 hours on a return flight, the fun is gone.

In some cases, you are correct. Sometimes we think there is more business in ANOTHER city, and drive by the obvious down the street. But, in some cases, you can only do business with certain companies in remote cities. Quite often, especially with the bigger deals, national accounts type stuff.

because i only fly for personal reasons, there should not be any reason to stop. however, i've delayed a trip to antarctia that i wanted to do to see how this weekend trip dfw-lga will come out. how much hassle!

My experiences since 9/11 have not been that bad. A couple of long waits at SEA. STL was pretty hienous last Friday. Overall, I still enjoy the experience. I fly 1st or business a lot and have been AA elite for several years. I suppose my experience is just destined to be good.

The flying will probably increase next year. With customers in Europe, Southwest Asia, and Australia, I just have to go.

While going, I have to stay positive and enjoy it to the best of my ability. I am not sure I feel more, or less, safe. Just more aware of the threat, perhaps.

I'm flying as much as ever with one exception: I'm now taking Amtrak instead of American Eagle to Washington and Boston.

I passed up a far cheaper airfare on commuter flights to and from BWI and took the train in order to avoid BWI and the hassles of a non-elite check-in line, but with that exception, I've been flying pretty steadily since 9/14. My patience for foolishness is never very deep, however, and it is definitely getting to me.

CO seems to have dropped the ball on the Elite screener checkpoints. Even NW figured it out, whats up with that? NW being proactive, and CO not? Has the world gone mad? Nothing is as it seems anymore!

2 new checkpoints here in CLE, dedicated to the great unwashed!

I will no longer condone the search processes at airports. I will not fly until I can do so once again as a free US citizen. Yes, it now takes three days to get from Indiana to the west coast and three more days to get back. I will not give permission for my rights to privacy to be infringed.

Also read: www.jimduensing.com/open_letter.html

An open letter to American Airlines from another disgruntled passenger. The airlines will go out of business or become government owned if they don't stand up to them now to stop this treatment to their customers.

See ya on the freeways............until they begin illegal searches there!




[This message has been edited by GDIW (edited 12-28-2001).]

GDIW -

great post! and the link is incredible! the writer of the letter is the real patriot, and would have been among the first to stand up on the airplane had there been a treat. thanks for sharing that!

If most of us feel this way to some degree or another, Why haven't we started a letter writing campaign? I for one am going write both my Senators and my Congressman.

are there enough of us to make a point yet? i'm afraid most americans will still prefer to trade freedoms for security.

i'd rather make my point by taking the revenue away from the airlines. their lobbyists will have much more pull when thaty are worried about the decline in revenue from their road warriors....

I am flying substantially less since the long lines began. Flying is no longer a fun thing. (I'm sure many would say it never was.)

I haven't read many of the posts on this thread and don't know if this question has been addressed. But has anyone heard of anymore talk about the possibility of them coming out with domestic passports? Supposedly, if you were to buy one, there would be special lines to speed you through. I heard talk of this on the news just one time well over one month ago.

Points Scrounger

Do you have a link for the source of that article that states the jumpsuits will be ready by August 15th! :-) I had heard that they were going to ban the socks so that footprints could be kept on file.

[This message has been edited by GDIW (edited 12-29-2001).]