Is Points.com the ONLY point exchange out there?
 

Does Points.com have any competition? I was hoping that we could compile a list of sites that do points exchanges! Thanks!

No meaningful competition
 

There are other transfer options like to/from Amtrak, but no other exchange site like points.com

I think they do a good job - I don't think they are charging unnecessarily but rather the airlines are only willing to give a little cash in exchange for miles, so exchange ratios will never be in the consumer's favor.

Exchanges into Asia Miles are very favorable though.

AA/UA convert to Diners to XXXX. You lose 50% (unless DC has a promo going), but that's still much better than via points.com! You can also transfer points via Hilton HHonors, but the conversion rate is pretty bad.

Points.com is a big ripoff.

They have promotions once in a while that are halfway decent.

Otherwise I would avoid them

agree w/ the above post.. points.com is a bad deal.

So, Points.com is the only points exchange?
 

I agree it's a rip-off, but it's the only exchange out there, more or less, where you can take lost points that don't amount to anything and trade them in for something (besides buying magazines).....

But I was really hoping there were other points exchanges out there (who were more fair)....anyone?

[QUOTE=deadreader]you can take lost points that don't amount to anything and trade them in for something (besides buying magazines).....
QUOTE]

there is no such thing as "lost points that don't amount to anything". keeping in mind redemption rates and a number of a partners loyalty programs have nowadays, with a little planning one can always collect enough points/miles/whatever for an award, redeem it and close an account - beats any redemption options offered at points.com.

Yes. :)

anything points to AA miles
 

I find it quite nice for ebay anything points that I accumulate by using the priceline link on ebay. 1500 ebay points for each 4 star stay. As a premium member you get a 25% bonus after transfer. Back when they had the double special this was especially great. Right now its just ~ 450 miles to 1000 anything points. I've accumulated ~80k AA miles this year from it.

Does anyone have any better used for ebay anything points than converting them to miles through points.com?

There are some limited point exchange opportunities that can be had by laundering miles through the Hilton HHonors program. The loss isn't as severe as points.com, but the only drawback is that there are relatively few ways to get miles/points into HHonors in the first place.

There are close to thirty airlines that you can transfer your HHonors points to (most at 10k HH:1k miles, but some at 10k HH:1500 miles, and WN at 10k HH: 1 RR credit), but only a handful (Midwest, AA, MX, HA, Amtrak, and a few others) allow transfers into HHonors.

Mike

This one is a key interest to me... Those who know me well or who know of the long since done deal involving AA miles, Ebay Anything points and the ways of Points.com will certainly agree.

In my opinion, this is the Microsoft of points--the evil version of MS, that is. Draw your own conclusions here, but consider that we REALLY need a better way and yet as long as everyone still plays their game, it may not ever end for a long long time. Kinda like paying high gas prices because, well, it's only gone up to $1.50/gal... it's only gone up to $1.75/gal... it's only gone up to $1.95/gal... it's only gone up to $2.50/gal...

Get the idea? We feed the fire here and we should not! People's continued use of Points.com are helping them gain their increased power. The company, in the opinions of many, has vastly ABUSED that power!

MY ADVICE: DO NOT PLAY.

Now, I have had some "wow, it worked!" success with them in the past--I have transferred miles between members in Northwest and Delta, and I had even gotten my points in the aforementioned AA thread, but I don't trust them in business whatsoever and neither should you. You see, the big issue is this:

WHEN (not if, but when) you have a problem with that company, YOU ARE IN FREAKIN' TROUBLE!!!!!!!!!

They so badly suck at fixing issues or glitches that they should basically be avoided for all future business any half way decent, mile transfer pondering soul should ever know about! DO you feel the passion I have on this subject here, or what?

If something goes amiss with your transfer, or there are computer or email problems, or your missed something in the fine fine print, or you misread the rules and made and honest mistake, or your are waiting for points that have yet to post for whatever reason, GOOD LUCK getting solid results from these guys! They have yet to show they can fix problems or really care about the customer! They rely too much on automation that often fails, and have no way to manually intervene. Sure, they have a "Customer Service" dept and it's called "Customer Delight" of all things, but the personnel only sound professional. Can they actually DO the job? No! Well, I really have come to demand services that are almost better at doing the job than merely sounding all professional during today's all too common phone voice. Ya know what I mean? (I so hate the phrases and so common CS garble: "We are working to serve you better... our computer is down and our options have changed. Please press 1-2-4-6-*# Para Englese, numero Dos!--Playin' with the Queen of Hearts..." These guys at Points.com are the Kings! )

And speaking of phones, I happen to know the email and phone numbers and fax numbers and addresses of a few execs up there and lemme tell ya, they are the EXPERTS at the slimy spin! I have come up against these slippery Pete's a few times too many and they are crafty souls, lemme tell ya!

Ohh, I shouldn't have even gotten started here!

A bit back to earth here:
United Airlines lets you transfer miles between accounts using some other marketing firm I have yet to have problems with. Many here know of Amtrak and I know for a while there, CO was letting people do a transfer with no third party partner. But partnerships have their all too common downside that the customer remains widely uninformed about and thus, having no control over as well. Miles in general get a bit sticky when there are problems. Anyone who doesn’t know that is either new, or has been extremely lucky. My beef in the world of miles and points--and promotions or rebates or deals all over--has been with accountability and systematic customer service. You need to keep all records on everything all the time because, well, the onus IS on YOU!. Ever had a partner of some promotion tell you to contact the other partner? Ever had a computer tech help line tell you, "sorry sir, that's user error. It must be YOUR computer, not our product!" Same thing. Points.com, like much of what pisses a lot of techies off about Microsoft, is too big to handle the “what if’s” or the one-off issues. They have neglected the common man and the very people who were or are the base of what they are all about or started out as! Points.com fails you when something does not work out as planned and you are left out in the cold.

When something goes wrong with your intended miles or it just does not post, you should have a place to get answers. There should be independently commissioned entities who help get us our missing miles & points, or rebates and promos and there needs to be more accountability in the world of airline and hotel pricing and bonus promotions or coupons. Standards help us all but these large companies teetering on bankruptcies do not listen and Points.com reaps the benefits on both sides--ours being the hardest hit today! Kinda like how there should be a way to find out WHY 911 happened. (yeah right--I forgot whose running the show these days--and yet, maybe that bullish and negative style of doing world business without feeling the need to show accountability is an attitude that has somehow trickled down into business and the arena of customer service and people's general good will. It is eroding fast.)

Anyway, there should be a way to still get your miles or points without having to wait 4-6, 6-8, 8-10, etc weeks and then have to dig up old files they know you don’t have copies of and fax them in only to have to wait 8-100 weeks MORE for any sort of results! (if those even materialize)

I even devoted a Web site to the above problem and I did not finish updating results on it because Points.com never really finished what they promised.

Check it out:
www.theothersideoftraveling.com

…and you shall see the horrors of doing business with groups like Points.com

However, if you feel like taking a risk and being extremely careful in the world of trading miles between accounts (say, NWA or DL where you need 5,000 miles and are willing to fork over $75 to do this and you have memorized every fine detail) and you are cool with balancing on I-beams of shaky high-rise buildings in foreign cities while holding two cups of boiling water and balancing a washing machine on your nose, go ahead and use them! I had used my inner mile-wanting soul to be this person and like I said, I had some success, but every stunt man takes his fall. I am so reluctant to try again! I mean, they HAVE come thru with a few of their most highly advertized things because, well, that obviously seems to be all they concentrate on while leaving the rest up to some supposed automation process that doesn't always work. But no one's watching all the internal processes up there, so whatever... They'll spend more time on grabbing new business rather than servicing old customers even if they are only as old as last month. Again, if it works for you, you are probably lucky or desperate. I have been both, and I have been duped by them too, as have many others in here and beyond.

Trust me here--and spread the word until such time as they get their act together in all areas: Whatever you political views may be or who your favorite baseball team is, do whatever it takes to AVOID POINTS.COM.

:)MM

PS: Someone/some company should take the hint and start a viable competitor up NOW. We should not have to be held hostage just because there seems to be no other way right now. I show some pride on the issue: I would rather not do certain things with my points & miles than to have to bow to these jokers all the time. Seemingly unthinkable things CAN be done if you/we work hard at it, I mean, the Red Sox won the World Series after all, right? Why can't FlyerTalk become or have within its vastness a better version of Points.com? I put that to those who run this entire site! I'd pay into it, that's for sure!

You mean besides using them to buy things on Ebay? ;) 1000 anything points = $10, which is usually more valuable to me than their converted equivalent in airline miles.

First off - the best use of eBay Anything Points for most people is transfer them to Asia Miles.
55,000 eBay Anything Points = 60K Asia Miles = BA Business Class ticket to Europe and back

Secondly, MM, How do you know all the missing points were credited buy the third parties who were supposed to pay for them? I took advantage of the promotions you speak of for myself and four others - all cases of missing points were because the third parties did not post and pay for them correctly in a timely manner. Just because say Netflix didn't keep their end of the bargain doesn't mean Points.com necesarily has to make up for them.

I agree Points.com seems to have promised you more than they delivered in their conversations with you, but I still think all they did was NOT MAKE UP FOR others failures to credit points properly.

Anyhow, as someone who has moved aprox 1.5 million points with points.com they have done me no wrong. I appreciate their very fast posting times - glitch free.

How is doing business with Asia Miles ?
Do they do electronic ticketing or is it paper for BA redemption ?
I know the miles expire in the program regardless of useage every 3 years.
I was told NY to London in Business class is 60,000 Miles which certainly sounds like a great deal. Thanks

Well I think that mileage problems have little to do with 911. In fact, maybe someone can find out why the same terrorist group attacked the WTC in 1993 (with only 40% of the required explosives to take down the towers from the bottom). There is a long history here that is beyond the scope (and relevance) of this thread ....

Honestly, I think that customer service in the US, almost across the board, has been degrading over the last 10 years. The "customer is always right" is a long extinct phrase. Undoubtedly, this is fueled in part by customers who try to find loopholes to screw the company, but it is mainly due to cost cutting. As far as I am concerned, I do not prefer to deal with any company that cannot resolve issues with a human being. I would rather pay more and have good service, but maybe I am in the minority. It is a more pleasant experience than having to constantly fight with people who could care less if your business came or left.

As to points.com, I have never dealt with them, it seemed that their conversion rates and/or fees seemed to be a raw deal. Kind of like CO's regular "transfer miles from one account to another" - and pay as much in cash as the miles are worth (to me).

I think that MM's website is a good idea. The points (no pun intended) on the website are accurate. Sometimes I do get tired of calling numerous times asking for points to be posted and waiting it out. As much as I hate to waste time calling again and again, I think some of these companies figure that you will give up before they do. Probably the best solution is to stop dealing with a partner who does not fulfill the request without a fight - and let them know it and post it here on FT.

Mileage Conversion Tool
 

Check out the site below. It seems to be a good resource for mileage conversions.

http://www.webflyer.com/programs/mileage_converter/

Works very well!
 

Not only is NYC-London 60K return on BA, but most USA destinations-Europe are a 60K redemption. Any routing under 5K each way costs 60K to redeem in J.

I just redeemed 4 BA F tickets SEA-LHR for 90K per person next summer.

Asia Miles CS is pretty good - they have a toll free US number with generally low wait times but a long string of options to work through each time you call - tickets usually take about 2 weeks to get issued though - they won't do it fast. You can request e-ticket or paper for BA redemption - they do both. BA availability has been identical to BA.com

Every 50K I spend on SPG and every 55K I spend on my MBNA MasterCard = 60K Aisa Miles - thats 60K for Business to Europe on good carriers - a great deal!

Yes, miles expire....but make it one of your primary programs and your set (use the miles before they expire).
Transfer from SPG and if you spend a lot at not Amex places get a Ebay Anything Points MBNA card - no annual fee - and 1.15 Asia Miles/$ after you convert with points.com

Wannaflyforless,

Could you direct me to the webpages where you are able to find the 60K amount for business class flights on BA to Europe from NYC?

I have gone on the Asia Miles website and have done the conversion in miles from their mileage calculator from JFK to LHR and it comes out to a bit less than 7,000 miles. Then, by the AsiaMiles Award chart, that comes out to 100,000 miles for a business class tix and from the OneWorld award chart that can also be found on their site, it seems to indicate that it would "cost" 80,000 miles for that trip in business class -- that is award zone # 5. It does appear that it would cost 60,000 miles in that award zone, but that would be for ECONOMY CLASS seating.

Therefore, I am certainly confused as to where you and others have indicated that it would only be 60,000 miles per tix?

The reason I am asking is because I am thinking of tranferring out 250,000 Membership Rewards points into Marriott before the curtain is brought down on that deal. Once in there, I think I could redeem those points for a 7 night award plus 120,000 FF miles into Asia Miles -- you don't have to be flying to the destination that you are using the hotel reward at. Therefore, I could then wind up staying for 7 nights in London and placing the miles into Asia Miles and redeem for 2 Bus tix to LHR for the 120,000 miles -- but I just don't see where these great convesions are coming from!!

Thanks in advance for your help!

NJ


----------------------

EDITED TO ADD: NEVER MIND!!

My mistake was not hitting the earn tab in the OneWorld Redemption form to the SPEND tab -- if you do it pops up right away! 60,000 miles it is!!

A bit of a primer
 

Some corrections...

Unfotunately YBH only (Starting from 1 September 2004).

1 eBay point/$ - converts to 1.125 Asia Miles through Points.com

Thanks for the corrections...I see I was a little off on the conversion ratio - not enough to make a huge difference though.

Too bad about the upgrade restrictions - but the best deal still remains: free premium transatlantic tickets.

Sorry, I might be a little picky. I agree with you, this minor difference is not big deal. Your post is well-informed. Thank you for your post.

Okay, this may be a dumb question. But if Asia Miles is so good, why is this the first I'm hearing about it? :)

Seriously, it sort of looks like oneWorld, I'm not sure what the differences are, and I don't see a section for it in the Alliances forum.

Is there a section on FT where Asia Miles info resides? :confused:

There sure is: under the airlines section see "Cathay Pacific Asia Miles"

Asia Miles is the frequent flyer program of Cathay Pacific Airways - one of the eight OneWorld airlines.

Generally, non Cathay Pacific FTers have ignored the program because they don't realize how good of a program it is for US residents.

As an aside - don't get confused between the Marco Polo club and Asia Miles. Some people get confused thinking Cathay Pacific has two frequent flyer programs...not really. They just chose to separate the "frequent flyer benefits" from the "loyalty program currency." Asia Miles is the loyalty program currency and you can sign up for Asia Miles never flying Cathay but earning lots of points and redeeming them for flights. You only want to sign up for the Marco Polo Club (and pay a small sign up fee) if you want to be rewarded for your loyalty to Cathay (and Oneworld) as you credit your flights to Asia Miles. The Marco Polo club tracks your Asia Miles flights and grants elite status. Their top tier provides some of the richest benefits of any program (they will regularily open up premium revenue seats for miles redemtion, outstanding customer service, etc) - but it is also one of the hardest status' to attain.

Tclin - I will edit my above post to correct the minor inaccuracies - thanks for pointing them out.

more on why bad CS is bad for business!
 

thanks.
my point about 9/11/01 had to do with acountability and how I felt that those who should be revealing to us all a bit more on why and how this happened are too hush hush about it to save their own butts. Yes, it is for another subject elsewhere but in keeping with you said, I totally agree: Customer service is either automated (and therefore, not covering all the real issues that could possibly take place in life) or it is handled with less care than it should be. I have run into issues with places like Amazon.com who cannot even put you thru to managers! Ebay has no way to talk live or even to mail or fax them! Everything is email! Everything is low-level personnel and all of it comes back with these annoying "happy to serve you" and "we're working hard to make this a better consumer experience"

in the case of points.com, the manager who went on vacation twice during a long drawn out period of several months when one of her own promos fell apart affecting over 100 people, does not reply anymore to the emails coming from those patiently waiting customers. Her autoreply says her title is "manager-customer delight"

what is delightful about that?

The onus is on us, and so I have actually become one of those people who refuses to do business with several companies all across the board. (Wow, and my choice doesnt even have to do with environmental problems caused by some company or political issues like that, but it may as well be the same thing! I chose to stop doing commerce with companies because they have bad CS policies in place!)

Now if a lot more people started to do like I have done, what do you think would happen to our economy--or to the businesses that affect you negatively in this way?

(Gee, over zealous CS manager, have any ideas? Hmmm, I wonder if THIS is somehow tied to it!)

All I want is some accountability and someone willing to try to fix it and work outside the box.

The only thing I can equate this to where it DOES work is this:

When I worked as a bartender years ago, we had many locals come in who kinda deserved a break once and a while. It was a ski town and there is a sub economy in places like those. Beach towns can be similar. Anyway, we decided to have a sort of comp list that was loosely held by the owner and the bar staff and manager. We could, as bartenders, use our position to give a drink here or there and have the establishment pick up the tab on it once and a while. We did this with discretion and none of us abused it. Granted we were a smaller group of co-workers (and maybe that too is the key to making sure good service takes place!) but we tried to take care of people, and that list could modify over time to be fair to all who we dealt with on this level.

The reason I bring this up is because I think that when company policy prevents the fixing of extenuating circumstances, someone in there should have the power to override it once and a while and employ some sort of "comp" or adjustment (manually performed) for a customer who can show that something beyond the norm has in fact occurred. The key is also to try to take care of existing customer and not just blow them off like they dont matter after you have the money. Points.com has done this all too often. I have said in another thread that I dont tolerate stupid companies and they WILL ultimately go out of business if I have any hand in making sure this can happen.

:)MM