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Are bloggers ruining Flyertalk????

Are bloggers ruining Flyertalk????

Old May 14, 12, 7:11 am
  #466  
 
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This gap at Flyertalk could have been fixed, or largely fixed, at any time over the past few years by using a simple technique that almost all other forums use. MOST discussion forums have a process for closing threads after a certain period of time. Let's say three months. Flyertalk instead prefers the "hazing" model of endlessly and forever threads that can be brought back from the dead after many, many years or even just allowed to ramble on for hundreds, even thousands of posts...If you do start a new thread, sometimes, some moderator is there to move your post to the end of one of these overlong threads or to the end of some ancient thread full of outdated information.

Apparently, trying to stimulate extra clicks/page views one time is more important than trying to build a relationship with "findable" information that would encourage a newbie to keep reading, to start participating, and to return to the site. So whatever..Flyertalk can't really complain about bloggers coming in with easy to read and easy to find material when FT is unwilling to provide the material. They force newbies to the blogs, in my humble opinion. And, after a few years, you have to figure that it's intentional, since this problem could have been fixed in an hour or a day if they really wanted to fix it.

How many pages EVEN IN THE STICKIES have we ALL opened to find links, discussion, etc. that go back to 2007 or, ugh, just yesterday I stumbled on to links going back to 2004? Say what you like about the blogs that landed yesterday. You don't have to weed through that nonsense going back to dead deals. What is the purpose of old Expedia codes from 2009? Yank 'em. Deal is dead? Close the thread. And once everyone has flown the dead deal and posted their trip experience, close that thread too. You could make the site searchable and easy to use with very little effort...were there any will to do so. There are times when I poke through a sticky full of worthless links and tell myself I'm done here. If it were not for the sense of community, I would be done.

One of the links, from a STICKY, that I visited yesterday, ended up in a thread where people were fighting and the moderator did close the discussion, maybe only a mere 5 years ago. And the link is still in the sticky? There's an organization MESS here at Flyertalk and as long as people are unwilling to do anything about it, then FT has to accept that people in a hurry will look elsewhere. That doesn't mean that they're looking to b e spoonfed. But if they are noobs and have no investment in the community, and then they find that they're being "hazed" with endless posts and stickies full of useless, outdated garbage, can we really blame them for moving elsewhere? That doesn't prove laziness. It proves common sense.

If it takes a few bloggers taking the credit card affiliate income away from FT and putting it in their own pocket to get some changes made to make FT more accessible, then I don't see that it's all bad.

Search is broken, stickies are broken, threads that purport to be full of deals and codes are historical museums full of outdated garbage. Look at what the blogs are doing right, rather than assuming that Flyertalk is always right. Nobody's always right.







[QUOTE=oliver2002;18570042]What bloggers do is address a gap in FT: summarizing a current deal in a concise simple to understand way. Each day/hours thousands of people end up on FT because it ranks #1 for every travel related google search and only a fraction stays back because they find what they were looking for and another smaller fraction stays on to becomes member etc etc. Currently Google ranks content on wikis, forums and blogs etc higher than traditional webpages, the day that algorithm changes others will rank higher.

/QUOTE]
peachfront is offline  
Old May 14, 12, 7:21 am
  #467  
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Originally Posted by peachfront View Post
Search is broken, stickies are broken, threads that purport to be full of deals and codes are historical museums full of outdated garbage. Look at what the blogs are doing right, rather than assuming that Flyertalk is always right. Nobody's always right.
Now now, not all of FT is in shambles like described above ... over at M&M we kicked all reference threads to the curb because unless someone spends hours updating the reference thread with new info (in essence replicating what the content manager of the FFP website should do but with mucho crapo vb frontend for a CMS) the thread becomes irrelevant very quickly.

Instead we have a flame free newbie thread like many other sections of FT that has become a welcome success: http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/miles...ions-here.html with newbies and oldies alike: newbies can ask and oldies can respond. Often the regular topics are far too complex for people to post an opinion about.
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Old May 14, 12, 11:29 am
  #468  
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Originally Posted by oliver2002 View Post
What bloggers do is address a gap in FT: summarizing a current deal in a concise simple to understand way.
I agree — and that is the main specific purpose of The Gate.
Originally Posted by peachfront View Post
This gap at Flyertalk could have been fixed, or largely fixed, at any time over the past few years by using a simple technique that almost all other forums use. MOST discussion forums have a process for closing threads after a certain period of time. Let's say three months. Flyertalk instead prefers the "hazing" model of endlessly and forever threads that can be brought back from the dead after many, many years or even just allowed to ramble on for hundreds, even thousands of posts...If you do start a new thread, sometimes, some moderator is there to move your post to the end of one of these overlong threads or to the end of some ancient thread full of outdated information.

Apparently, trying to stimulate extra clicks/page views one time is more important than trying to build a relationship with "findable" information that would encourage a newbie to keep reading, to start participating, and to return to the site. So whatever..Flyertalk can't really complain about bloggers coming in with easy to read and easy to find material when FT is unwilling to provide the material. They force newbies to the blogs, in my humble opinion. And, after a few years, you have to figure that it's intentional, since this problem could have been fixed in an hour or a day if they really wanted to fix it.

How many pages EVEN IN THE STICKIES have we ALL opened to find links, discussion, etc. that go back to 2007 or, ugh, just yesterday I stumbled on to links going back to 2004? Say what you like about the blogs that landed yesterday. You don't have to weed through that nonsense going back to dead deals. What is the purpose of old Expedia codes from 2009? Yank 'em. Deal is dead? Close the thread. And once everyone has flown the dead deal and posted their trip experience, close that thread too. You could make the site searchable and easy to use with very little effort...were there any will to do so. There are times when I poke through a sticky full of worthless links and tell myself I'm done here. If it were not for the sense of community, I would be done.

One of the links, from a STICKY, that I visited yesterday, ended up in a thread where people were fighting and the moderator did close the discussion, maybe only a mere 5 years ago. And the link is still in the sticky? There's an organization MESS here at Flyertalk and as long as people are unwilling to do anything about it, then FT has to accept that people in a hurry will look elsewhere. That doesn't mean that they're looking to b e spoonfed. But if they are noobs and have no investment in the community, and then they find that they're being "hazed" with endless posts and stickies full of useless, outdated garbage, can we really blame them for moving elsewhere? That doesn't prove laziness. It proves common sense.

If it takes a few bloggers taking the credit card affiliate income away from FT and putting it in their own pocket to get some changes made to make FT more accessible, then I don't see that it's all bad.

Search is broken, stickies are broken, threads that purport to be full of deals and codes are historical museums full of outdated garbage. Look at what the blogs are doing right, rather than assuming that Flyertalk is always right. Nobody's always right.
You are more than welcome to help the Hilton HHonors forum moderators further improve the organization of information in the Hilton HHonors forum via posting your constructive thoughts and comments one of the following open discussions:

If I do not receive constructive feedback, I have to assume that the status quo is acceptable to the majority of the FlyerTalk members who frequent the Hilton HHonors forum.
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Old May 14, 12, 11:34 am
  #469  
 
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Originally Posted by peachfront View Post
So whatever..Flyertalk can't really complain about bloggers coming in with easy to read and easy to find material when FT is unwilling to provide the material. They force newbies to the blogs, in my humble opinion.
Well said. That is the place where blogs far exceed FT and in a very, very helpful way.

What if FT would integrate wikis into the forum?
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Old May 14, 12, 11:51 am
  #470  
 
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Originally Posted by peachfront View Post
This gap at Flyertalk could have been fixed, or largely fixed, at any time over the past few years by using a simple technique that almost all other forums use. MOST discussion forums have a process for closing threads after a certain period of time. Let's say three months. Flyertalk instead prefers the "hazing" model of endlessly and forever threads that can be brought back from the dead after many, many years or even just allowed to ramble on for hundreds, even thousands of posts...If you do start a new thread, sometimes, some moderator is there to move your post to the end of one of these overlong threads or to the end of some ancient thread full of outdated information.
Thank you. Exactly my sentiment.

I mentioned it before but even to try gathering information from a thread that is a couple hundred pages and has thousands of entries... it's simply discouraging.
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Old May 14, 12, 11:54 am
  #471  
 
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Today's Frequent Miler is a prime example of a blogger going above and beyond. He contacted TopCashBack and got them to double the Radisson cash back (from 5%-10%) during the upcoming Big Night promo.

Quality stuff and a nice change from the travel porn/flyertalk regurgitation that's become the norm on the other blogs.

http://boardingarea.com/blogs/freque...disson-rebate/
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Old May 14, 12, 12:55 pm
  #472  
 
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[QUOTE=peachfront;18570863]This gap at Flyertalk could have been fixed, or largely fixed, at any time over the past few years by using a simple technique that almost all other forums use. MOST discussion forums have a process for closing threads after a certain period of time. Let's say three months. Flyertalk instead prefers the "hazing" model of endlessly and forever threads that can be brought back from the dead after many, many years or even just allowed to ramble on for hundreds, even thousands of posts...If you do start a new thread, sometimes, some moderator is there to move your post to the end of one of these overlong threads or to the end of some ancient thread full of outdated information.

Apparently, trying to stimulate extra clicks/page views one time is more important than trying to build a relationship with "findable" information that would encourage a newbie to keep reading, to start participating, and to return to the site. So whatever..Flyertalk can't really complain about bloggers coming in with easy to read and easy to find material when FT is unwilling to provide the material. They force newbies to the blogs, in my humble opinion. And, after a few years, you have to figure that it's intentional, since this problem could have been fixed in an hour or a day if they really wanted to fix it.

How many pages EVEN IN THE STICKIES have we ALL opened to find links, discussion, etc. that go back to 2007 or, ugh, just yesterday I stumbled on to links going back to 2004? Say what you like about the blogs that landed yesterday. You don't have to weed through that nonsense going back to dead deals. What is the purpose of old Expedia codes from 2009? Yank 'em. Deal is dead? Close the thread. And once everyone has flown the dead deal and posted their trip experience, close that thread too. You could make the site searchable and easy to use with very little effort...were there any will to do so. There are times when I poke through a sticky full of worthless links and tell myself I'm done here. If it were not for the sense of community, I would be done.

One of the links, from a STICKY, that I visited yesterday, ended up in a thread where people were fighting and the moderator did close the discussion, maybe only a mere 5 years ago. And the link is still in the sticky? There's an organization MESS here at Flyertalk and as long as people are unwilling to do anything about it, then FT has to accept that people in a hurry will look elsewhere. That doesn't mean that they're looking to b e spoonfed. But if they are noobs and have no investment in the community, and then they find that they're being "hazed" with endless posts and stickies full of useless, outdated garbage, can we really blame them for moving elsewhere? That doesn't prove laziness. It proves common sense.

If it takes a few bloggers taking the credit card affiliate income away from FT and putting it in their own pocket to get some changes made to make FT more accessible, then I don't see that it's all bad.

Search is broken, stickies are broken, threads that purport to be full of deals and codes are historical museums full of outdated garbage. Look at what the blogs are doing right, rather than assuming that Flyertalk is always right. Nobody's always right.

Originally Posted by oliver2002 View Post
What bloggers do is address a gap in FT: summarizing a current deal in a concise simple to understand way. Each day/hours thousands of people end up on FT because it ranks #1 for every travel related google search and only a fraction stays back because they find what they were looking for and another smaller fraction stays on to becomes member etc etc. Currently Google ranks content on wikis, forums and blogs etc higher than traditional webpages, the day that algorithm changes others will rank higher.

/QUOTE]

I agree with you on this and I think FT has become bloated. Do moderators get some sort of compensation ? I am asking b/c I don't know. If they did I think they would collectively come up with a better system that would appease most everyone. Again the main problem is not bloggers per se, but people that take without giving back.
As for the bloggers, I think the ones mentioned in this thread are not the offenders and give as much useful information as they take. Actually the ones mentioned probably produce more useful information on a variety of topics for public consumption than almost anyone. They practice sustainable forestry the ones I think most people have problems with are the slash and burn kind. The slash and burners find a really useful jumbo then broadcast it for short term gain. Yes, they will probably die out over time but at what cost and FT be able to recover if everyone decides to manage their own little patches. Couldn't a well managed FT forum prevent this kind of poaching with out the skullduggery that goes on now?
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Old May 14, 12, 1:45 pm
  #473  
 
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[QUOTE=jeautk01;18564123]Exactly!



I think priceline and hotwire are two areas most bloggers overlook because there is no payback for them. Also, a lot of status hounds ignore them b/c they want the biggest and best room possible so they generally overpay for a room to get upgrades or free breakfast. I have found that if I just save the money from the other room nights that aren't important and spend it on those upgrades I come out ahead far ahead.


Usually, but no one wants to talk about it because that's no fun.


The promotion on Hotels.com with their 5 star program "un-loyalty promotion" was something that only flyertalk would have mentioned. Last year when I was in Palma de Morica, I was happy with the free room night there, as none of my programs (Hyatt, Priority Club, Raddison, or Wyndham) offered any hotels.

Its good to have a online discount booker, that you can earn rewards based on the amount you spend. This gives you flexability and saves you money, with a nice "bonus" that few people know about.
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Old May 14, 12, 5:41 pm
  #474  
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All - I've been getting a slew of PMs about my credit card program (in my signature). I'd better just post here and save the future PMs.

It's with regret that I must inform you the program will be ending this week (basically as soon as my web guy gets it done) as I've been asked to end the practice of incentivizing applications. They really didn't need to give me a reason why, as it's quite apparent.

I will continue to explore possible new ways to do things on Hotel Magician with regard to the card deals, but I'm quite sure that nothing similar will return.

If you still have questions, feel free to PM.
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Old May 14, 12, 6:21 pm
  #475  
 
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And yet again one of the "major" "bloggers" is talking up Avios like crazy again...
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Old May 14, 12, 6:49 pm
  #476  
 
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Originally Posted by belfordrocks View Post
And yet again one of the "major" "bloggers" is talking up Avios like crazy again...
once again belfordrocks is dissing avios
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Old May 14, 12, 6:51 pm
  #477  
 
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As far as I know, moderators are unpaid. I don't think it's a problem with moderators. Mods come and go. I think it's a policy matter that for whatever reason, it was believed to be better to add to existing threads than to close old threads and create new ones. Why? Say I want to find out if I can rely on getting a pre-departure cocktail in domestic first class on Delta. Do I care that a WHOLE bunch of us had trouble getting pre-departure cocktails in late 2009? Nope. I care about experiences reported from 2012...Lock the bit of that thread that goes back to prehistory and start over with 2012 would be my vote. Or consider the "hotels deal" thread with expedia codes going back to the day Al Gore invented the internet. C'mon. Delete, archive, lock all that stuff. My opinion only, of course. And I realize the mods are just trying to be helpful and doing what is requested. Flyertalk has an over-arching culture that values history, which is really weird on a site where we are looking for deals. The history of deals, codes, great fares etc. is pretty specialized. Most people are looking for info that's live right now.




Originally Posted by jeautk01 View Post
I agree with you on this and I think FT has become bloated. Do moderators get some sort of compensation ? I am asking b/c I don't know. If they did I think they would collectively come up with a better system that would appease most everyone. Again the main problem is not bloggers per se, but people that take without giving back.
As for the bloggers, I think the ones mentioned in this thread are not the offenders and give as much useful information as they take. Actually the ones mentioned probably produce more useful information on a variety of topics for public consumption than almost anyone. They practice sustainable forestry the ones I think most people have problems with are the slash and burn kind. The slash and burners find a really useful jumbo then broadcast it for short term gain. Yes, they will probably die out over time but at what cost and FT be able to recover if everyone decides to manage their own little patches. Couldn't a well managed FT forum prevent this kind of poaching with out the skullduggery that goes on now?
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Old May 14, 12, 8:46 pm
  #478  
 
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My very 1ST post in any forum since 1999, other than the obligatory and ubiquitous facebook page and this is the ideal thread to take that step as I believe I can provide a different perspective to this debate.

Until 2 weeks ago, I had never heard of FlyerTalk or any blog dedicated to travel. Point in fact, if I stumbled onto any Blog by following a link from some story and I was greeted with animated versions of credit cards, saying " Me.., Pick Me...", I would simply close the tab and never return.

Wow, My intro to this post was written just a few days ago but due to other commitments I was unable to complete my thoughts and post. Since then, the tone of this thread has morphed to the point the title has nothing to do with the trend of the conversation. THIS IS WHAT’S WRONG WITH FLYERTALK
It has nothing to do with bloggers.. it has all to do with FTers. The sad part is that this attitude is only ubiquitous in "FD" (and yes, I know what FD is and how to work it) and “How can I abuse the system to get my CC spends up” threads. How petty as, FT is so much more. Has everyone forgotten what Randy’s original vision was? Does anybody know who Randy is?

What a shame and this thread held such promise at the beginning. So, yes, add my voice to those to say "close it". Never came close to 5 pages, did it?
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Old May 14, 12, 9:03 pm
  #479  
 
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Originally Posted by F105ThudDriver View Post
My very 1ST post in any forum since 1999, other than the obligatory and ubiquitous facebook page and this is the ideal thread to take that step as I believe I can provide a different perspective to this debate.

Until 2 weeks ago, I had never heard of FlyerTalk or any blog dedicated to travel. Point in fact, if I stumbled onto any Blog by following a link from some story and I was greeted with animated versions of credit cards, saying " Me.., Pick Me...", I would simply close the tab and never return.

Wow, My intro to this post was written just a few days ago but due to other commitments I was unable to complete my thoughts and post. Since then, the tone of this thread has morphed to the point the title has nothing to do with the trend of the conversation. THIS IS WHAT’S WRONG WITH FLYERTALK
It has nothing to do with bloggers.. it has all to do with FTers. The sad part is that this attitude is only ubiquitous in "FD" (and yes, I know what FD is and how to work it) and “How can I abuse the system to get my CC spends up” threads. How petty as, FT is so much more. Has everyone forgotten what Randy’s original vision was? Does anybody know who Randy is?

What a shame and this thread held such promise at the beginning. So, yes, add my voice to those to say "close it". Never came close to 5 pages, did it?
You know, when a newcomer jumps in with criticism and knowing all the answers, the truth of their statements matter little in determining the emotional response. There is something to be said for being a constructive, helpful member of a community before you earn the right to criticize it. Anytime you're in a new group of people that has been hanging out together for a while, it is essential to remember that you are there as their guest; insulting your hosts at your first dinner party is hardly the way to have an enjoyable or productive time.

But moving beyond the questionable wisdom of criticism being a first post, I'm afraid the merits of your post don't fare much better. It's somewhat incoherent. What are you trying to say? Bloggers are the problem with their CC ads? FTers are also the problem? The FT and CC spend sections of FT is the problem? One gets the impression that the only consistent train of thought through your post is that everyone except you is the problem and you're not afraid to SHOUT that opinion from the rooftops with your first post after discovering the FF community two weeks ago.

I believe there is one place in which we can find common ground. You said, "I believe I can provide a different perspective to this debate." You've certainly demonstrated a different perspective.
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Old May 14, 12, 9:12 pm
  #480  
xp0
 
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I am not sure if this was discussed, but how many bloggers do you think would continue posting if there were no referral per CC applications? While many of these bloggers would say they would be doing it anyway... I dont think as many would be. The ones that would continue are probably the blogs I like reading. Yes, some have been doing the blog scene well before the surge of referrals, but many new blogs have really picked up (many with worthless content) just because the referrals are so high. There are many subliminal messages in these posts that promote specific credit cards which happen to be giving the most $$$ per referral at the time.
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