Feb 11, 2015, 11:49 am
Last edit by: drewguy
If you've never gone through this process read this before posting!
Note: Please consider that with high probability, United is monitoring this thread, so please pay attention on what you post!
DOT Investigation Updates
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According to USA Today, Ben Mutzabaugh:
Note that United has also accidentally cancelled "legitimate" tickets paid for in USD, purchased in USD from LHR... Please check your other tickets if purchased today to ensure they were not unilaterally cancelled.
However, there is no chance at all that you can have your tickets re-instated if you complain to DOT on the basis of DOT rule § 399.88:
Form for filing DOT complaint. File complaint as soon as your ticket is cancelled.
Link to PDF of enforcement bodies for European customers affected. File complaint as soon as your ticket is cancelled.
Tips for DOT Complaint:
Template For Complaint:
-----
Tips for retrieving your ticket number:
https://www.united.com/web/en-US/app...NRCD=2/11/2015
Freedom of Information Act Request
File #2015-147, Office of the Secretary of Transportation - Receipt acknowledged 3/13/15
http://www.dot.gov/individuals/foia/office-secretary-foia-information
Relevant excerpt from my request on 2/24/15. There no need for multiple requests for the same thing, though feel free to request more or different information obviously. I'll post any updates as I get them.
"Under the Freedom of Information Act, 5 U.S. C. subsection 552, I am requesting access to any and all records of correspondence, including electronic, between anyone working for, or on the behalf of, United Airlines and its subsidiaries, and with anyone working for, or on the behalf of, the Department of Transportation; specifically this would include only the date range beginning on February 11th, 2015 through and including February 24th, 2015.
In addition, I am requesting access to any and all internal records and correspondence in relation to coming to the decision made on February 23rd, 2015 regarding the Office of Aviation Enforcement and Proceedings Determination Regarding United Airlines Mistaken Fare, with the exception of any of the consumer submitted complaints via phone, email, website, or letter. Specifically, this would be any records beginning on February 11th, 2015 through and including February 24th, 2015."
Note: Please consider that with high probability, United is monitoring this thread, so please pay attention on what you post!
DOT Investigation Updates
- 02/23/15: DOT says UA does not have to honor the fare; link to DOT's full explanation (pdf)
- 02/12/15: DOT Statement
- 02/12/15: fox news mentions DOT investigation and mention update by 5:00 pm ET -- posted by xSTRIKEx6864
- 02/12/15: Fox news clip -- posted by FlyingLasse
- 02/12/15: Another clip on fox news interviewing the pointsguy -- posted by FlyingLasse
- 02/12/15: Person in charge at the dot is Alex Taday (don't bombard him with email - or we will all regret it) -- posted by sonofzeus
- 02/12/15: Fox News update: UA honoring fares will depends on complaints made at the DOT.... -- posted by synd
-------
According to USA Today, Ben Mutzabaugh:
United is voiding the bookings of several thousand individuals who were attempting to take advantage of an error a third-party software provider made when it applied an incorrect currency exchange rate, despite United having properly filed its fares. Most of these bookings were for travel originating in the United Kingdom, and the level of bookings made with Danish Kroner as the local currency was significantly higher than normal during the limited period that customers made these bookings.
However, there is no chance at all that you can have your tickets re-instated if you complain to DOT on the basis of DOT rule § 399.88:
§ 399.88 Prohibition on post-purchase price increase.
(a) It is an unfair and deceptive practice within the meaning of 49 U.S.C. 41712 for any seller of scheduled air transportation within, to or from the United States, or of a tour (i.e., a combination of air transportation and ground or cruise accommodations), or tour component (e.g., a hotel stay) that includes scheduled air transportation within, to or from the United States, to increase the price of that air transportation, tour or tour component to a consumer, including but not limited to an increase in the price of the seat, an increase in the price for the carriage of passenger baggage, or an increase in an applicable fuel surcharge, after the air transportation has been purchased by the consumer, except in the case of an increase in a government-imposed tax or fee. A purchase is deemed to have occurred when the full amount agreed upon has been paid by the consumer.
(a) It is an unfair and deceptive practice within the meaning of 49 U.S.C. 41712 for any seller of scheduled air transportation within, to or from the United States, or of a tour (i.e., a combination of air transportation and ground or cruise accommodations), or tour component (e.g., a hotel stay) that includes scheduled air transportation within, to or from the United States, to increase the price of that air transportation, tour or tour component to a consumer, including but not limited to an increase in the price of the seat, an increase in the price for the carriage of passenger baggage, or an increase in an applicable fuel surcharge, after the air transportation has been purchased by the consumer, except in the case of an increase in a government-imposed tax or fee. A purchase is deemed to have occurred when the full amount agreed upon has been paid by the consumer.
Link to PDF of enforcement bodies for European customers affected. File complaint as soon as your ticket is cancelled.
Tips for DOT Complaint:
- File on DOT for every ticket number affected.
- If you have one reservation with four people traveling (four tickets) file 4 DOT complaints, one per ticket.
- If you have separate reservations, file a DOT complaint for each.
- The DOT complaint website may take several minutes to load, depending on demand.
- When you go to upload a file, be careful as it will reset all your radio buttons. So, if you want a copy of the complaint, make sure you double check that "Yes" is still selected before submitting, especially if you upload a file.
Template For Complaint:
United has unilaterally cancelled my ticket without my consent.
Facts:
1. The ticket was ticketed (had a ticket number).
2. I received a confirmation number, ticket number, and emails stating both
3. The ticket was paid for and my credit card charged.
United must reinstate the ticket within its original cabin. This trip is for travel TO the United States.
At no time during the booking process was any other fare than the Danish Krone equivalent displayed. As a reasonable, prudent consumer, I believed I was paying the price displayed to me on the website. United never sent or displayed the equivalent fare in any other currency.
Trip Details
Ticket #: 016XXXXXXXXXX
PNR: XXXXXX
Routing: LHR-EWR-LAX-HNL
Attachments: Attached is a document showing the ticket, routing, and providing proof that the reservation was ticketed.
Filename: Cancelled - UA Reservation - LHR-EWR-LAX-HNL - XXXXXX - 016XXXXXXXXXX.pdf
+-------------------------------------------------------+
| Relevant Law |
| http://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/14/399.88 |
+-------------------------------------------------------+
§ 399.88 Prohibition on post-purchase price increase.
(a) It is an unfair and deceptive practice within the meaning of 49 U.S.C. 41712 for any seller of scheduled air transportation within, to or from the United States, or of a tour (i.e., a combination of air transportation and ground or cruise accommodations), or tour component (e.g., a hotel stay) that includes scheduled air transportation within, to or from the United States, to increase the price of that air transportation, tour or tour component to a consumer, including but not limited to an increase in the price of the seat, an increase in the price for the carriage of passenger baggage, or an increase in an applicable fuel surcharge, after the air transportation has been purchased by the consumer, except in the case of an increase in a government-imposed tax or fee. A purchase is deemed to have occurred when the full amount agreed upon has been paid by the consumer.
+-------------------------------------------------------+
| Relevant FAQ |
| http://airconsumer.ost.dot.gov/rules/EAPP_2_FAQ.pdf |
+-------------------------------------------------------+
Does the prohibition on post-purchase price increases in section 399.88(a) apply in the situation where a carrier mistakenly offers an airfare due to a computer problem or human error and a consumer purchases the ticket at that fare before the carrier is able to fix the mistake?
Section 399.88(a) states that it is an unfair and deceptive practice for any seller of scheduled air transportation within, to, or from the United States, or of a tour or tour component that includes scheduled air transportation within, to, or from the United States, to increase the price of that air transportation to a consumer after the air transportation has been purchased by the consumer, except in the case of a government-imposed tax or fee and only if the passenger is advised of a possible increase before purchasing a ticket. A purchase occurs when the full amount agreed upon has been paid by the consumer. Therefore, if a consumer purchases a fare and that consumer receives confirmation (such as a confirmation email and/or the purchase appears on their credit card statement or online account summary) of their purchase, then the seller of air transportation cannot increase the price of that air transportation to that consumer, even when the fare is a “mistake.”
Facts:
1. The ticket was ticketed (had a ticket number).
2. I received a confirmation number, ticket number, and emails stating both
3. The ticket was paid for and my credit card charged.
United must reinstate the ticket within its original cabin. This trip is for travel TO the United States.
At no time during the booking process was any other fare than the Danish Krone equivalent displayed. As a reasonable, prudent consumer, I believed I was paying the price displayed to me on the website. United never sent or displayed the equivalent fare in any other currency.
Trip Details
Ticket #: 016XXXXXXXXXX
PNR: XXXXXX
Routing: LHR-EWR-LAX-HNL
Attachments: Attached is a document showing the ticket, routing, and providing proof that the reservation was ticketed.
Filename: Cancelled - UA Reservation - LHR-EWR-LAX-HNL - XXXXXX - 016XXXXXXXXXX.pdf
+-------------------------------------------------------+
| Relevant Law |
| http://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/14/399.88 |
+-------------------------------------------------------+
§ 399.88 Prohibition on post-purchase price increase.
(a) It is an unfair and deceptive practice within the meaning of 49 U.S.C. 41712 for any seller of scheduled air transportation within, to or from the United States, or of a tour (i.e., a combination of air transportation and ground or cruise accommodations), or tour component (e.g., a hotel stay) that includes scheduled air transportation within, to or from the United States, to increase the price of that air transportation, tour or tour component to a consumer, including but not limited to an increase in the price of the seat, an increase in the price for the carriage of passenger baggage, or an increase in an applicable fuel surcharge, after the air transportation has been purchased by the consumer, except in the case of an increase in a government-imposed tax or fee. A purchase is deemed to have occurred when the full amount agreed upon has been paid by the consumer.
+-------------------------------------------------------+
| Relevant FAQ |
| http://airconsumer.ost.dot.gov/rules/EAPP_2_FAQ.pdf |
+-------------------------------------------------------+
Does the prohibition on post-purchase price increases in section 399.88(a) apply in the situation where a carrier mistakenly offers an airfare due to a computer problem or human error and a consumer purchases the ticket at that fare before the carrier is able to fix the mistake?
Section 399.88(a) states that it is an unfair and deceptive practice for any seller of scheduled air transportation within, to, or from the United States, or of a tour or tour component that includes scheduled air transportation within, to, or from the United States, to increase the price of that air transportation to a consumer after the air transportation has been purchased by the consumer, except in the case of a government-imposed tax or fee and only if the passenger is advised of a possible increase before purchasing a ticket. A purchase occurs when the full amount agreed upon has been paid by the consumer. Therefore, if a consumer purchases a fare and that consumer receives confirmation (such as a confirmation email and/or the purchase appears on their credit card statement or online account summary) of their purchase, then the seller of air transportation cannot increase the price of that air transportation to that consumer, even when the fare is a “mistake.”
Tips for retrieving your ticket number:
- paste(right click copy link location first) following link into your web browser
- change XXXXXX next to COPNR= for your reservation number and LASTNAME next to LN= for you SURNAME
- go to the webpage address you have just created
https://www.united.com/web/en-US/app...NRCD=2/11/2015
Originally Posted by MatthewLAX
Originally Posted by MatthewLAX View Post
R E L A X
Breathe deep.
Congrats on all who got in.
Now comes the fun part.
1. Discovery - mistake fare is posted on FT. Novices frantically checks how much vacation time they have and if the dates of availability mesh with their schedules. Experienced FTers just book it and worry about contacting spouses or their boss later. Word spreads like wildfire.
2. Excitement - Tickets purchased, confirmation emails received and dates of travel shared with other FTers. Discussions of what to see and do and where to stay crop up in other threads. Novices contact source to change seats or inquire about upgrades, Seasoned FTers sit back and enjoy reading the discussion threads.
3. Stress Stage 1 - Concern over paper ticket delivery - Novices Frantically check otheFedEx website every few hours, constant monitoring of driveway for FedEx truck. Seasoned FT veterans sit back and relax.
4. Glee and happiness - Paper tickets in hand, vacation request submitted, spouses finally informed, hotel reservations made and bragging to friends and co-workers begins. Both novices and experts get very excited.
5. Stress Stage 2 - Rumors of fare not being honored, discussion threads about the airline and ticketing agency ensue. Rumors crop up like crabgrass at this stage. Many FTers begin to worry excessively about whether or not the trip will happen. Novices make non-refundable and financial committments to their trip. Seasoned FTers make mixed drinks (and maybe a sandwich) and is patient.
6. Reality Check - Accurate information is obtained - usually takes place a week to 10 days after mistake fare is published. Confirmed information from the source as to whether or not tickets will be honored.
7a. Pure Joy (Icelandair style- Fare is Honored) - Lots of happy people, FT threads on shared information regarding hotels, restaurants, tours, etc. Jealousy from others sets in. First "FT guinea pigs" embark, post confirmation threads that all is ok.
7b Hostile Feelings (Copa Airlines Style - fare is not honored) - Many angry and disappointed FTers. Refunds are issued. Novices have multiple discussion threads of lawsuits and hostile correspondence, FT pros mutter "c'est la vie" and look for the next fare mistake.
8a Success (Honored) - Trip Report thread becomes very active
R E L A X
Breathe deep.
Congrats on all who got in.
Now comes the fun part.
1. Discovery - mistake fare is posted on FT. Novices frantically checks how much vacation time they have and if the dates of availability mesh with their schedules. Experienced FTers just book it and worry about contacting spouses or their boss later. Word spreads like wildfire.
2. Excitement - Tickets purchased, confirmation emails received and dates of travel shared with other FTers. Discussions of what to see and do and where to stay crop up in other threads. Novices contact source to change seats or inquire about upgrades, Seasoned FTers sit back and enjoy reading the discussion threads.
3. Stress Stage 1 - Concern over paper ticket delivery - Novices Frantically check otheFedEx website every few hours, constant monitoring of driveway for FedEx truck. Seasoned FT veterans sit back and relax.
4. Glee and happiness - Paper tickets in hand, vacation request submitted, spouses finally informed, hotel reservations made and bragging to friends and co-workers begins. Both novices and experts get very excited.
5. Stress Stage 2 - Rumors of fare not being honored, discussion threads about the airline and ticketing agency ensue. Rumors crop up like crabgrass at this stage. Many FTers begin to worry excessively about whether or not the trip will happen. Novices make non-refundable and financial committments to their trip. Seasoned FTers make mixed drinks (and maybe a sandwich) and is patient.
6. Reality Check - Accurate information is obtained - usually takes place a week to 10 days after mistake fare is published. Confirmed information from the source as to whether or not tickets will be honored.
7a. Pure Joy (Icelandair style- Fare is Honored) - Lots of happy people, FT threads on shared information regarding hotels, restaurants, tours, etc. Jealousy from others sets in. First "FT guinea pigs" embark, post confirmation threads that all is ok.
7b Hostile Feelings (Copa Airlines Style - fare is not honored) - Many angry and disappointed FTers. Refunds are issued. Novices have multiple discussion threads of lawsuits and hostile correspondence, FT pros mutter "c'est la vie" and look for the next fare mistake.
8a Success (Honored) - Trip Report thread becomes very active
Freedom of Information Act Request
File #2015-147, Office of the Secretary of Transportation - Receipt acknowledged 3/13/15
http://www.dot.gov/individuals/foia/office-secretary-foia-information
Relevant excerpt from my request on 2/24/15. There no need for multiple requests for the same thing, though feel free to request more or different information obviously. I'll post any updates as I get them.
"Under the Freedom of Information Act, 5 U.S. C. subsection 552, I am requesting access to any and all records of correspondence, including electronic, between anyone working for, or on the behalf of, United Airlines and its subsidiaries, and with anyone working for, or on the behalf of, the Department of Transportation; specifically this would include only the date range beginning on February 11th, 2015 through and including February 24th, 2015.
In addition, I am requesting access to any and all internal records and correspondence in relation to coming to the decision made on February 23rd, 2015 regarding the Office of Aviation Enforcement and Proceedings Determination Regarding United Airlines Mistaken Fare, with the exception of any of the consumer submitted complaints via phone, email, website, or letter. Specifically, this would be any records beginning on February 11th, 2015 through and including February 24th, 2015."
[PREM FARE GONE] UA: NCL-EWR 600 DKK (mistaken fare) DOT ruled; see wiki for link
Feb 11, 2015, 11:11 am
#1051
Join Date: Feb 2015
Posts: 3
Just had a look at Expertflyer checking fare conditions on my itinerary, Spotted an interesting line in it which I presume has been added in the last few hours.
FARE RULE
ORIGINATING UNITED KINGDOM -
TICKETS MAY BE ISSUED BY PTA. PTA CONSTITUTES
TICKETING.
TICKETS MAY NOT BE SOLD IN DENMARK.
TICKETS MAY ONLY BE SOLD IN AREA 1/AREA 2/AREA 3.
FARE RULE
ORIGINATING UNITED KINGDOM -
TICKETS MAY BE ISSUED BY PTA. PTA CONSTITUTES
TICKETING.
TICKETS MAY NOT BE SOLD IN DENMARK.
TICKETS MAY ONLY BE SOLD IN AREA 1/AREA 2/AREA 3.
CHECK FARE NOTE;CPH POS END
Any idea what this means?
Feb 11, 2015, 11:11 am
#1052
Join Date: Feb 2015
Posts: 31
If you live in Denmark and have taken advantage of this mistake fare (it's clearly not a legitimate promotion like the previous sale a few months ago), then UA might honor it. It's plausible that you just happened upon this fare by chance and booked the ticket in good faith.
But if you changed your MP address to a DK one to get this price, or if you fudged with the credit card info, then UA will not only have grounds to void your ticket, but could perhaps even press charges. Also, they might close your Mileageplus account and confiscate your miles.
And I hope they do! This is obviously not a real fare, it is obviously a mistake, and you are taking advantage of that, full knowing that it is a mistake. Your intentions are to steal a ticket from UA, and I hope UA tries every trick in the book to get out of honoring it. Perhaps they'll fail and will be forced to honor the ticket. Good for you I guess for getting away with it.
But in that case, UA is legally allowed to cancel your MP account (the terms and conditions are one-sided), I do hope they do that. You are hurting the airline that I fly with, the Frequent Flyer Program that I use, and me, since I pay for my tickets and my ticket prices might go up because of this nonsense.
But if you changed your MP address to a DK one to get this price, or if you fudged with the credit card info, then UA will not only have grounds to void your ticket, but could perhaps even press charges. Also, they might close your Mileageplus account and confiscate your miles.
And I hope they do! This is obviously not a real fare, it is obviously a mistake, and you are taking advantage of that, full knowing that it is a mistake. Your intentions are to steal a ticket from UA, and I hope UA tries every trick in the book to get out of honoring it. Perhaps they'll fail and will be forced to honor the ticket. Good for you I guess for getting away with it.
But in that case, UA is legally allowed to cancel your MP account (the terms and conditions are one-sided), I do hope they do that. You are hurting the airline that I fly with, the Frequent Flyer Program that I use, and me, since I pay for my tickets and my ticket prices might go up because of this nonsense.
Feb 11, 2015, 11:11 am
#1053
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Londinium
Programs: BAEC
Posts: 929
Feb 11, 2015, 11:12 am
#1054
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: BHX
Programs: BA GGL CCR GfL, SQ Gold, Hyatt Glob, HH Diamond, Marriott Plat, Cafe Nero Loyalty Card (7 Stamps)
Posts: 7,323
I am just writing what I think. I did see the mistake fare this morning but I'm reasonably law abiding (except jaywalking). I do not usually take United's side and am often frustrated by them, but what people here are doing, and then bragging about, is fraud as far as I'm concerned.
Remember a few years ago when there was a trick to open two browser windows and switch back and forth? I seem to remember that the people who used this trick got their accounts closed.
If you can claim that you happened upon this by chance, for example if your address is actually in Denmark, then you might be ok.
But I hope UA presses charges if they can, or closes the accounts if they can't.
Remember a few years ago when there was a trick to open two browser windows and switch back and forth? I seem to remember that the people who used this trick got their accounts closed.
If you can claim that you happened upon this by chance, for example if your address is actually in Denmark, then you might be ok.
But I hope UA presses charges if they can, or closes the accounts if they can't.
With all the media attention, there's no way on earth UA would penalise people here. They either a) honour all fares and look like kings in the media for a few months, or b) decide the cost of honouring is too high and tell everyone to go jump.
Your precious UA account should be largely unaffected.
Feb 11, 2015, 11:12 am
#1057
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 845
I am just writing what I think. I did see the mistake fare this morning but I'm reasonably law abiding (except jaywalking). I do not usually take United's side and am often frustrated by them, but what people here are doing, and then bragging about, is fraud as far as I'm concerned.
Wow, you should get a gold star from United for being such a good customer.
Feb 11, 2015, 11:12 am
#1058
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 462
Fare Breakdown
Airfare: 5,214 GBP
Equivalent Airfare: 53 DKK
U.K. Air Passenger Duty: 2
U.K. Passenger Service Charge: 1
U.S. Customs User Fee: 37
U.S. Immigration User Fee: 47
U.S. APHIS User Fee: 33
U.S. Federal Transportation Tax: 234
September 11th Security Fee: 37
International Surcharge: 4
U.S. Passenger Facility Charge: 30
Per Person Total: 478 DKK
eTicket Total: 956 DKK
Form of Payment:
AMERICAN EXPRESS
Last Four Digits XXXX
The airfare you paid on this itinerary totals: 106 DKK
The taxes, fees, and surcharges paid total: 850 DKK
lol
Airfare: 5,214 GBP
Equivalent Airfare: 53 DKK
U.K. Air Passenger Duty: 2
U.K. Passenger Service Charge: 1
U.S. Customs User Fee: 37
U.S. Immigration User Fee: 47
U.S. APHIS User Fee: 33
U.S. Federal Transportation Tax: 234
September 11th Security Fee: 37
International Surcharge: 4
U.S. Passenger Facility Charge: 30
Per Person Total: 478 DKK
eTicket Total: 956 DKK
Form of Payment:
AMERICAN EXPRESS
Last Four Digits XXXX
The airfare you paid on this itinerary totals: 106 DKK
The taxes, fees, and surcharges paid total: 850 DKK
lol
Feb 11, 2015, 11:13 am
#1059
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Austin, Texas
Programs: Airline nobody. Sad!
Posts: 26,062
UA has done that on every single ticket I've ever booked with them. Heck, half the time it ends up with "THEBMR MAN", if my name were THE BOS MAN as first, middle, and last, using middle initial, appending the abbreviation for "Mister" onto the end of it as well.
Feb 11, 2015, 11:13 am
#1060
Ambassador: LATAM
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: PNA
Programs: BAEC Silver
Posts: 4,626
Feb 11, 2015, 11:14 am
#1061
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: HNL <-> BOS
Posts: 382
Super bummed I missed this. The one night I don't check FT before going to bed haha oh well. Would have cost a great deal getting to Europe from US first anyway ^^ (trying to rationalize myself from being sad for missing out :P)
Congrats to everyone that got a ticket(s)!
Congrats to everyone that got a ticket(s)!
Feb 11, 2015, 11:15 am
#1062
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Seattle, WA, USA
Programs: AS MVPG, Hyatt Diamond
Posts: 983
Most people who booked these fares won't have a UA account; or certainly won't have been foolish enough to enter their details if they do have an account they actually care about.
With all the media attention, there's no way on earth UA would penalise people here. They either a) honour all fares and look like kings in the media for a few months, or b) decide the cost of honouring is too high and tell everyone to go jump.
Your precious UA account should be largely unaffected.
With all the media attention, there's no way on earth UA would penalise people here. They either a) honour all fares and look like kings in the media for a few months, or b) decide the cost of honouring is too high and tell everyone to go jump.
Your precious UA account should be largely unaffected.
Feb 11, 2015, 11:15 am
#1064
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Austin, Texas
Programs: Airline nobody. Sad!
Posts: 26,062
There's disagreeing, and then there is wishing people get brought up on criminal charges. The former is not trolling. The latter is what occurring here, and is really unfortunate.
