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The Future of Dulles Airport [and Metro line]

The Future of Dulles Airport [and Metro line]

Old Jul 23, 21, 11:00 am
  #406  
 
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I wouldn't disagree on any of that; 99.99% of flights are not like that joke about some UA flights to China, where the outbound belly cargo to the U.S. made the inbound leg from the U.S. profitable. So my assumption is always that there are two ends to every flight by definition, even if it is nominally in an operational sense running "from" City A "to" City B.

The thing that I find interesting about the purported AA strategy is that they are leveraging this exact dynamic, and garnering some marginal loyalty at some of these outstations in the process. Side comment, but I have long felt UA has been missing out a bit by not doing the focus City thing that AA and DL do/did.
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Old Jul 24, 21, 6:53 pm
  #407  
 
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Originally Posted by M60_to_LGA View Post
Well, if you're bringing people to NY, then you presumably have to take them back FROM NY.

I don't think AA will ever try to be NYC's "hometown airline," and indeed as far as I can recall they've never really advertised that as a goal (unlike B6, where that's literally their main message, and DL/UA, which in the past have run massive local ad campaigns touting their destination networks via billboards, ads on the top of taxis, etc. I can't recall any similar AA marketing within the city at all.)

That said, AA is clearly trying to capture rich locals' money. They have lots of nonstops from JFK to Caribbean destinations - just looking at today's departures, there's Montego Bay, Punta Cana, St. Thomas, Antigua, Cancn... And during normal, non-pandemic times, they have a lot more flights to luxury resort destinations and the like.
those routes are also catering to international travelers thru jfk.
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Old Jul 24, 21, 8:47 pm
  #408  
 
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Originally Posted by djp98374 View Post
those routes are also catering to international travelers thru jfk.
Do international travelers really transit JFK to reach the Caribbean in large numbers?

I can see it making sense for Canadians in major markets, but otherwise I'm having a hard time seeing it. There are enough charter operators in Europe that travel to these kinds of destinations, plus BA/IB/AF, etc...
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Old Jul 24, 21, 8:55 pm
  #409  
 
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Originally Posted by M60_to_LGA View Post
Well, if you're bringing people to NY, then you presumably have to take them back FROM NY.
Of course that typically is the case, but cities on the east coast are so close that I have often flown into one city for meetings and then driven or taken the train to a different city or cities for more meetings and thus flew out of some city other than the one I arrived at.
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Old Jul 25, 21, 3:25 pm
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Originally Posted by M60_to_LGA View Post
Do international travelers really transit JFK to reach the Caribbean in large numbers?

I can see it making sense for Canadians in major markets, but otherwise I'm having a hard time seeing it. There are enough charter operators in Europe that travel to these kinds of destinations, plus BA/IB/AF, etc...
european travelers.

many countries fly to nyc and lax and maybe 1-2 other airports.

it makes sense to run these flights from jfk. Some split time seeing nyc and other spot.
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Old Jul 26, 21, 1:33 am
  #411  
 
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Different markets here, but similar working premises: the AF onward services offered at both MIA and LAX. Obviously these are somewhat akin to QF's LAX-JFK in that they explicitly target through travel (is it still the case that the QF transcon's still can't market local U.S. traffic?), but I figure if the market weren't of sufficient size, you wouldn't see AF operate those mini-bases. At least in MIA, they have one or a couple Airbii based there with (I would presume) at least a few aircrew nominally based down there to bounce around the Caribbean "triangle" they do (unless those trips are all done as rotations for TATL AF crews over a few days before heading back home, which seems complicated to me).
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Old Jul 29, 21, 2:12 pm
  #412  
 
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Originally Posted by Section 107 View Post
There is a ginormous, untapped cash cow at IAD, that would make the place super cost-competitive, and that is commercializing the completely unused historic tower. I was recently up in it, and it has so much potential (for restaurant, bar, observation lounge, etc.). Unfortunately, the existing elevator is not ADA compliant and making it compliant would require substantial alteration in violation of historic preservation regulations. Various ideas have been batted about, but pretty much, without an act of Congress (who also actually owns the place) nothing can/will ever happen. It's a huge shame.
Just how much cash can a restaurant generate? Enough to fund a C/D concourse in about 160 years?
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Old Jul 29, 21, 2:13 pm
  #413  
 
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Originally Posted by djp98374 View Post
those routes are also catering to international travelers thru jfk.
Originally Posted by M60_to_LGA View Post
Do international travelers really transit JFK to reach the Caribbean in large numbers?

I can see it making sense for Canadians in major markets, but otherwise I'm having a hard time seeing it. There are enough charter operators in Europe that travel to these kinds of destinations, plus BA/IB/AF, etc...
Aren't those Caribbean routes out of JFK because LGA doesn't have FIS facilities?

As for European travelers, why wouldn't they fly via Miami?
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Old Jul 29, 21, 6:10 pm
  #414  
 
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Originally Posted by drewguy View Post
As for European travelers, why wouldn't they fly via Miami?
Why wouldn't they fly nonstop from Europe? You can get to pretty much any island you want via London, Paris, Madrid, or Amsterdam (likely on a nonstop), and you don't have to deal with US immigration nonsense.
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Old Jul 29, 21, 7:23 pm
  #415  
 
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Originally Posted by drewguy View Post
Aren't those Caribbean routes out of JFK because LGA doesn't have FIS facilities?

As for European travelers, why wouldn't they fly via Miami?
many vacationers als9 want to see nyc as part of their USA or Carribean trip.

many international carriers fly to nyc as main US entry point from Europe when trying to fly direct.

thise in partnerships like with say United usually fly to a few of their hub cities then connect with United flights. It’s hard for different airlines in Europe to fly everywhere.

then you have the cost issue of direct, where it’s outside of price range. In the US airlines offer east coast to hawaii directs. The prices are higher .it’s cheaper to say split book east to west open jaw Then west-hawaii open jaw.

earlier this year I flew on AA route of JFK-JAC. The plane was half full if that because if the international loss of travelers.

Last edited by djp98374; Jul 29, 21 at 7:29 pm
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Old Jul 30, 21, 7:31 am
  #416  
 
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Originally Posted by djp98374 View Post
european travelers.

many countries fly to nyc and lax and maybe 1-2 other airports.

it makes sense to run these flights from jfk. Some split time seeing nyc and other spot.
Yeah, if there is -one- city that a small/medium EU carrier is going to fly to the USA, NYC is usually that choice.
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Old Jul 30, 21, 9:05 pm
  #417  
 
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Originally Posted by drewguy View Post
Just how much cash can a restaurant generate? Enough to fund a C/D concourse in about 160 years?
It would be not just a restaurant but also observation deck, and club. Of course that wouldn't ever be enough to fund a new terminal, but what I was told is that informal estimates are that it would generate millions in net income to MWAA, especially if one can get to it without needing a boarding pass (which is firmly in the plans should it come to pass). I dont think it would get to the double digits, but even $2-5m would impact enplanement costs. It would certainly be a destination in and of itself, especially complementing a visit to Udvar-Hazy, which in turn could be combined with other shopping activities and other suggested/planned uses of airport land. And a new club is currently under development in the ground level areas below the tower which are also estimated to being in the seven-figure range per year so it is not unreasonable.
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Old Jul 31, 21, 12:08 am
  #418  
 
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This is it -- it wouldn't be a moneymaker in terms of profit off the steaks and burgers and wine, it would be an enthusiast/tourist trap at accompanying price points. I love the idea of offering a combo with Udvar-Hazy Center entrance (maybe a parking waiver or something)!
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Old Nov 4, 21, 4:41 pm
  #419  
 
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Construction complete on the Metro line! https://dcist.com/story/21/11/04/sil...ulles-loudoun/

But ~ 6 months of testing . . .
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Old Nov 5, 21, 9:17 am
  #420  
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6 months sounds about right for acceptance testing and training etc. Plus all those snagging lists to sort out.

Crossrail / Elizabeth Line in London is ts 6 months of testing etc as well.

https://www.ianvisits.co.uk/blog/202...rations-phase/
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