Dec 4, 2018, 10:44 am
Last edit by: HHQX888
Ambassador Service general email address: [email protected]
Ambassador Service general phone line (USA): (866) 924-9885
Europe: +353-21-4861 222
USA: +1-866-924-9885
Asia : +86-20-38157156
Ambassador Service general phone line (USA): (866) 924-9885
Europe: +353-21-4861 222
USA: +1-866-924-9885
Asia : +86-20-38157156
Marriott Bonvoy ‘Ambassador Elite’ Level : experiences (2020 and earlier)
Nov 26, 2018, 9:41 am
#1381
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: PHX
Programs: AS 75K; UA 1MM; Hyatt Globalist; Marriott LTP; Hilton Diamond (Aspire)
Posts: 56,448
It depends on the property. I have been consistently shortchanged by SPG properties in Asia, which are only counting room spend. (And are not awarding points on incidental spend, either.)
Nov 26, 2018, 10:01 am
#1382
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Minneapolis: DL DM charter 2.3MM
Programs: A3*Gold, SPG Plat, HyattDiamond, MarriottPP, LHW exAccess, ICI, Raffles Amb, NW PE MM, TWA Gold MM
Posts: 100,399
Of course, and I say French champagne with emphasis to indicate that I want only the real French stuff and not just some sparkling wine. A lot of my wine drinking is on airplanes and there's always a risk of being served the awful ground stuff, usually Italian Prosecco but sometimes worse, by a FA who can't tell the difference.
Nov 26, 2018, 10:12 am
#1383
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Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Southern California, USA
Programs: Marriott Ambassador and LTT, UA Plat/LT Gold, AA Gold
Posts: 8,764
Nov 26, 2018, 10:59 am
#1384
Join Date: Mar 2018
Location: SG
Programs: Marriott Plat Amb, oneworld Ruby
Posts: 132
I really hope, as you say, that an exception will be made for those of us who travel predominantly in low-cost destinations, or a further benefit is introduced for crossing 100 nights as an added incentive for us to reach that goal.
Nov 26, 2018, 11:33 am
#1385
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Posts: 8,764
You may be right, but that's little consolation when we leave Asia and get lumped in with the million other Plat Premiers competing for upgrades in "desirable" hotels.
I really hope, as you say, that an exception will be made for those of us who travel predominantly in low-cost destinations, or a further benefit is introduced for crossing 100 nights as an added incentive for us to reach that goal.
I really hope, as you say, that an exception will be made for those of us who travel predominantly in low-cost destinations, or a further benefit is introduced for crossing 100 nights as an added incentive for us to reach that goal.
For legacy Marriott customers who stay more than 75 nights and don’t reach the $20K Ambassador spending, the new Plat Premier/Titanium benefits still vastly outstrip those enjoyed under the old Marriott Rewards program before the SPG purchase. And those are still better than anything offered by Hilton or IHG or Accor. Hyatt offers the same and even more, but it is much harder to get 60 nights in the tiny Hyatt portfolio.
I believe few or no exceptions should be made for anyone traveling to lower-cost destinations for exactly the same reason that I believe few or no exceptions should be made for anyone staying in lower-cost hotels anywhere.
Your logic follows that exceptions therefore also should be made for those unlucky enough to not travel much in the first place—100 nights being so difficult to attain in such circumstances. Let’s provide exemptions to people who don’t travel for work and therefore can’t reach 50 or 75 or 100 nights? I don’t think so.
If one wants to qualify for Ambassador service, one needs to stay a lot and spend a lot. If one stays more often in lower-cost Asia, then one needs to spend more on food/beverage or more expensive rooms or otherwise find ways to reach the $20K spending like everyone else.
Traveling to lower-cost Asia already provides the obvious “benefit” of having less expensive stays with better service in the first place. Not to mention a lot less competition than N America and Europe for upgrades and other perks associated with being elite. So chances are good that a Plat Premier/Titanium in Asia might proportionally be as elite or more elite than many if not most Ambassador guests who largely stay in N America or Europe.
I’m also surprised when people complain about not getting additional incentives after reaching the final threshold in any loyalty program. If you stay more, you actually get to enjoy the benefits you’ve earned. My incentive for staying 235 nights and counting in 2018 is the actual enjoyment of my Ambassador elite status for the last 100+ nights. Getting more suite upgrades. Getting elevated treatment. Having my Ambassador available to help when needed. Getting to enjoy the types of hotels I actually prefer. I could have switched to Hyatt, but then I’d have had trouble finding the upscale and luxury hotels I like in the places I travel. It doesn’t much help me to switch and spend 55-60 nights in hotels that don’t make me as happy. I could have switched to Hilton, but I’d have had even more trouble finding upscale let alone luxury hotels I like in the places I travel.
Last edited by bhrubin; Nov 26, 2018 at 11:47 am
Nov 26, 2018, 12:39 pm
#1386
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Join Date: Jun 2005
Programs: Delta Diamond, Marriott Ambassador & Lifetime Titanium, Hertz President's Circle, United Silver
Posts: 6,334
And, technically, some California sparkling wine is called "California champagne."
I'm willing to bet that 99% of Americans would call anything sparkling "champagne."
Nov 26, 2018, 1:16 pm
#1387
Join Date: Mar 2018
Location: SG
Programs: Marriott Plat Amb, oneworld Ruby
Posts: 132
I couldn’t disagree more about exceptions to the $20K spending requirement. The cost of offering Ambassador service should be met with spending concomitant to that cost. Marriott decided that $20K spending was the threshold to offer the Ambassador service—both to justify the cost of Ambassador services and benefits and to cull the number of Ambassador guests in the elite ranks.
For legacy Marriott customers who stay more than 75 nights and don’t reach the $20K Ambassador spending, the new Plat Premier/Titanium benefits still vastly outstrip those enjoyed under the old Marriott Rewards program before the SPG purchase. And those are still better than anything offered by Hilton or IHG or Accor. Hyatt offers the same and even more, but it is much harder to get 60 nights in the tiny Hyatt portfolio.
I believe few or no exceptions should be made for anyone traveling to lower-cost destinations for exactly the same reason that I believe few or no exceptions should be made for anyone staying in lower-cost hotels anywhere.
Your logic follows that exceptions therefore also should be made for those unlucky enough to not travel much in the first place—100 nights being so difficult to attain in such circumstances. Let’s provide exemptions to people who don’t travel for work and therefore can’t reach 50 or 75 or 100 nights? I don’t think so.
If one wants to qualify for Ambassador service, one needs to stay a lot and spend a lot. If one stays more often in lower-cost Asia, then one needs to spend more on food/beverage or more expensive rooms or otherwise find ways to reach the $20K spending like everyone else.
Traveling to lower-cost Asia already provides the obvious “benefit” of having less expensive stays with better service in the first place. Not to mention a lot less competition than N America and Europe for upgrades and other perks associated with being elite. So chances are good that a Plat Premier/Titanium in Asia might proportionally be as elite or more elite than many if not most Ambassador guests who largely stay in N America or Europe.
I’m also surprised when people complain about not getting additional incentives after reaching the final threshold in any loyalty program. If you stay more, you actually get to enjoy the benefits you’ve earned. My incentive for staying 235 nights and counting in 2018 is the actual enjoyment of my Ambassador elite status for the last 100+ nights. Getting more suite upgrades. Getting elevated treatment. Having my Ambassador available to help when needed. Getting to enjoy the types of hotels I actually prefer. I could have switched to Hyatt, but then I’d have had trouble finding the upscale and luxury hotels I like in the places I travel. It doesn’t much help me to switch and spend 55-60 nights in hotels that don’t make me as happy. I could have switched to Hilton, but I’d have had even more trouble finding upscale let alone luxury hotels I like in the places I travel.
You ignore the fact that many of these hotels are cheaper because the cost of doing business in those countries is far lower. I don't know, I may well be more profitable to the company with my 100 nights and 15k USD spend than another 100-nighter who breaks the 20k USD threshold.
You say the cost of providing Ambassador services needs to be justified. Well, the cost of hiring Ambassadors in these countries is significantly lower than hiring them in North America or Europe. I'm pretty sure the profit Marriott makes from my "cheap" 100 nights would justify the cost of a local Ambassador. It would make far more sense for me to have a local Ambassador anyway (which I now do), rather than one based in a vastly different timezone.
For every benefit you mention of travelling in low-cost Asia, there is an equal disadvantage. Whither my MAGC, which hasn't been live in Asia for a few years now? Or my SPG or Marriott credit card, which never existed? I would have loved a few bonus nights here and there, and hundreds of thousands of bonus points. But nope, I sucked it up and proved my loyalty to the company by putting my head 100+ times in their beds a year.
And your comparison to Marriott Plat Premier is fallacious. I came in to this merger from the SPG side. I was gunning for SPG benefits. I stayed 100+ nights, not 75.
Of course, the company has a right to impose new rules. But in doing it this way, it places a fair number of us in a position where we are disincentivised to go for the 100 nights. And that is what may cost Marriott in the long-run.
Nov 26, 2018, 1:26 pm
#1388
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Join Date: Jun 2005
Programs: Delta Diamond, Marriott Ambassador & Lifetime Titanium, Hertz President's Circle, United Silver
Posts: 6,334
So you agree that the new Marriott Ambassador requirements are in some way more equitable or beneficial than the old SPG requirements.
You ignore the fact that many of these hotels are cheaper because the cost of doing business in those countries is far lower. I don't know, I may well be more profitable to the company with my 100 nights and 15k USD spend than another 100-nighter who breaks the 20k USD threshold.
You say the cost of providing Ambassador services needs to be justified. Well, the cost of hiring Ambassadors in these countries is significantly lower than hiring them in North America or Europe. I'm pretty sure the profit Marriott makes from my "cheap" 100 nights would justify the cost of a local Ambassador. It would make far more sense for me to have a local Ambassador anyway (which I now do), rather than one based in a vastly different timezone.
For every benefit you mention of travelling in low-cost Asia, there is an equal disadvantage. Whither my MAGC, which hasn't been live in Asia for a few years now? Or my SPG or Marriott credit card, which never existed? I would have loved a few bonus nights here and there, and hundreds of thousands of bonus points. But nope, I sucked it up and proved my loyalty to the company by putting my head 100+ times in their beds a year.
And your comparison to Marriott Plat Premier is fallacious. I came in to this merger from the SPG side. I was gunning for SPG benefits. I stayed 100+ nights, not 75.
Of course, the company has a right to impose new rules. But in doing it this way, it places a fair number of us in a position where we are disincentivised to go for the 100 nights. And that is what may cost Marriott in the long-run.
You ignore the fact that many of these hotels are cheaper because the cost of doing business in those countries is far lower. I don't know, I may well be more profitable to the company with my 100 nights and 15k USD spend than another 100-nighter who breaks the 20k USD threshold.
You say the cost of providing Ambassador services needs to be justified. Well, the cost of hiring Ambassadors in these countries is significantly lower than hiring them in North America or Europe. I'm pretty sure the profit Marriott makes from my "cheap" 100 nights would justify the cost of a local Ambassador. It would make far more sense for me to have a local Ambassador anyway (which I now do), rather than one based in a vastly different timezone.
For every benefit you mention of travelling in low-cost Asia, there is an equal disadvantage. Whither my MAGC, which hasn't been live in Asia for a few years now? Or my SPG or Marriott credit card, which never existed? I would have loved a few bonus nights here and there, and hundreds of thousands of bonus points. But nope, I sucked it up and proved my loyalty to the company by putting my head 100+ times in their beds a year.
And your comparison to Marriott Plat Premier is fallacious. I came in to this merger from the SPG side. I was gunning for SPG benefits. I stayed 100+ nights, not 75.
Of course, the company has a right to impose new rules. But in doing it this way, it places a fair number of us in a position where we are disincentivised to go for the 100 nights. And that is what may cost Marriott in the long-run.
Nov 26, 2018, 1:44 pm
#1389
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Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Southern California, USA
Programs: Marriott Ambassador and LTT, UA Plat/LT Gold, AA Gold
Posts: 8,764
Too many legacy SPG Ambassador guests who probably didn’t spend as much as others were so often complaining here on FlyerTalk and elsewhere about their lack of Ambassador benefits and perks. I’d always believed SPG provided better Ambassador treatment to those who spent more and/or stayed at the nicer hotels in the portfolio. Many took offense to that belief. Yet that belief was born out as likely true with Marriott’s $20K spending requirement.
Marriott took care of the complaints from those who didn’t spend as much—so that only those who spend enough qualify for Ambassador service.
Marriott also likely did the math and found a spending threshold that gives it the rough number of Ambassador elites it actually wants. As well it should.
And your comparison to Marriott Plat Premier is fallacious. I came in to this merger from the SPG side. I was gunning for SPG benefits. I stayed 100+ nights, not 75.
For 2020 Ambassador status, of course, you and everyone else needs to meet the $20K spending requirement or be waived at Marriott’s discretion. Marriott’s new terms actually do permit Marriott to award Ambassdor status to anyone not meeting the $20K spending threshold—at Marriott’s discretion, of course.
Of course, the company has a right to impose new rules. But in doing it this way, it places a fair number of us in a position where we are disincentivised to go for the 100 nights. And that is what may cost Marriott in the long-run.
For all the noise about people talking about leaving Marriott because of the massive IT fiasco, Marriott’s numbers have done as well or better than those of Hilton, IHG, Accor, and even Hyatt. There has been no mass exodus to any hotel competition despite much protest to the contrary—revealed as such by Marriott’s Q3 numbers as by those of all of its competitors. I suspect we will see the same for Q4 as the IT fiasco is slowly resolved and the various IT problems are slowly reined under control.
I suspect the same will be true for unhappy elites who cannot meet the $20K threshold. I suspect the cost you assume for the long run doesn’t actually exist.
Nov 26, 2018, 3:55 pm
#1390
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: La Jolla, CA
Programs: Marriott Ambassador, Lifetime Titanium, Delta Plat, Hilton Diamond , Hyatt Globalist
Posts: 2,615
BHR said: Marriott’s new terms actually do permit Marriott to award Ambassdor status to anyone not meeting the $20K spending threshold—at Marriott’s discretion, of course.
Conversely, Marriott can also award Ambassador status to someone who (for instance) stays fewer than 100 nights but spends over $20000.
They actually can award it to anyone — Decision makers who bring a lot of business to Marriott, VIPs etc
Conversely, Marriott can also award Ambassador status to someone who (for instance) stays fewer than 100 nights but spends over $20000.
They actually can award it to anyone — Decision makers who bring a lot of business to Marriott, VIPs etc
Nov 26, 2018, 4:14 pm
#1391
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: In the air
Programs: Hyatt Globalist, Bonvoy LT Plat, Hilton Gold, GHA Tit, BA Gold, Turkish Elite
Posts: 8,717
That’s the great thing about running a loyalty programme. You can give or take anything from anyone...
Nov 26, 2018, 4:15 pm
#1392
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Location: Southern California, USA
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To remind everyone from the actual new Marriott terms and conditions:
https://www.marriott.com/loyalty/terms/default.mi#elite
Clearly, the new Marriott terms allow some discretion for Marriott to invite whomever it wants to Ambassador service/status.
The good news is that Marriott could decide to invite someone who stays a lot more than 100 nights but doesn’t reach the spending threshold. Marriott also could decide to invite someone who spends a lot more than $20K but perhaps doesn’t reach the 100 nights.
I assume Marriott might be more inclined to invite someone if ever it sees a drop in people qualifying. Not unlike a college admitting someone from its waitlist or an airline upgrading its elites from economy to business or from business to first. I also assume Marriott might be inclined to do this for special VIP customers and other influencers—as has been done by every hotel brand since the dawn of time.
https://www.marriott.com/loyalty/terms/default.mi#elite
4.1 Elite Membership General
4.1.a. Elite membership is an exclusive privilege of Loyalty Program Membership. All Program Rules apply to Elite membership. The Loyalty Program has the right to terminate the Elite recognition program (the “Elite Program” or the “Elite Membership Program”) at any time by providing advance notice to Members in accordance with section 1.7.d. The Loyalty Program has the right to change, limit, modify or cancel the Program Rules for the Elite Program at any time, with or without notice, pursuant to section 1.7.c. Participating Properties outside the United States may provide alternative services and benefits to the Elite membership benefits set forth in these Program Rules, depending on local law and policy. The ambassador service is a benefit of the Loyalty Program available to select Loyalty Program Platinum Premier Elite Members exclusively by invitation or by meeting the requirements outlined in section 4.2.b. Participation in the ambassador service will be evaluated on an annual basis.
4.1.a. Elite membership is an exclusive privilege of Loyalty Program Membership. All Program Rules apply to Elite membership. The Loyalty Program has the right to terminate the Elite recognition program (the “Elite Program” or the “Elite Membership Program”) at any time by providing advance notice to Members in accordance with section 1.7.d. The Loyalty Program has the right to change, limit, modify or cancel the Program Rules for the Elite Program at any time, with or without notice, pursuant to section 1.7.c. Participating Properties outside the United States may provide alternative services and benefits to the Elite membership benefits set forth in these Program Rules, depending on local law and policy. The ambassador service is a benefit of the Loyalty Program available to select Loyalty Program Platinum Premier Elite Members exclusively by invitation or by meeting the requirements outlined in section 4.2.b. Participation in the ambassador service will be evaluated on an annual basis.
The good news is that Marriott could decide to invite someone who stays a lot more than 100 nights but doesn’t reach the spending threshold. Marriott also could decide to invite someone who spends a lot more than $20K but perhaps doesn’t reach the 100 nights.
I assume Marriott might be more inclined to invite someone if ever it sees a drop in people qualifying. Not unlike a college admitting someone from its waitlist or an airline upgrading its elites from economy to business or from business to first. I also assume Marriott might be inclined to do this for special VIP customers and other influencers—as has been done by every hotel brand since the dawn of time.
Nov 26, 2018, 5:53 pm
#1393
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Programs: Delta Diamond, Marriott Ambassador & Lifetime Titanium, Hertz President's Circle, United Silver
Posts: 6,334
... do whatever it wants. The terms and conditions are so contradictory and full of loopholes. It's a joke. There is no referee. I'm in a fight right now because I'm at a property that refused to upgrade me, despite ambassador status, to a suite. After I called my ambassador, they upgraded me to the entry-level suite even though four, higher-level suites are available. I called them out on any speciality suite exemption since all of the suites are (1) bookable through normal Marriott booking channels and (2) all are eligible for Marriott suite night award certificates. If they're going to claim the speciality suite exemption then those suites should only be bookable through the property's sales office, which is what properties like the Marriott Detroit Airport, Marriott Livonia, Marriott Troy, Marriott Auburn Hills/Pontiac/Bloomfield Hills and others have long done to avoid complimentary upgrades.
Nov 26, 2018, 5:57 pm
#1394
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: In the air
Programs: Hyatt Globalist, Bonvoy LT Plat, Hilton Gold, GHA Tit, BA Gold, Turkish Elite
Posts: 8,717
Indeed, the new terms only specify “Suites” which can either be read as:
1. All suites (the optimist view)
2. Select base suites as per under SPG (the SPG convert view)
3. Any suites that the property might feel like giving you, or not (the pessimist view)
At the moment there is no actual way to know which perspective is 1. in line with the spirit of Marriott’s intent and/ or 2. what a property will do and get away with.
1. All suites (the optimist view)
2. Select base suites as per under SPG (the SPG convert view)
3. Any suites that the property might feel like giving you, or not (the pessimist view)
At the moment there is no actual way to know which perspective is 1. in line with the spirit of Marriott’s intent and/ or 2. what a property will do and get away with.
Nov 26, 2018, 6:15 pm
#1395
Suspended
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Southern California, USA
Programs: Marriott Ambassador and LTT, UA Plat/LT Gold, AA Gold
Posts: 8,764
... do whatever it wants. The terms and conditions are so contradictory and full of loopholes. It's a joke. There is no referee. I'm in a fight right now because I'm at a property that refused to upgrade me, despite ambassador status, to a suite. After I called my ambassador, they upgraded me to the entry-level suite even though four, higher-level suites are available. I called them out on any speciality suite exemption since all of the suites are (1) bookable through normal Marriott booking channels and (2) all are eligible for Marriott suite night award certificates. If they're going to claim the speciality suite exemption then those suites should only be bookable through the property's sales office, which is what properties like the Marriott Detroit Airport, Marriott Livonia, Marriott Troy, Marriott Auburn Hills/Pontiac/Bloomfield Hills and others have long done to avoid complimentary upgrades.
I am pleased to hear that your Ambassador did at least force the issue enough to help you get the initial suite upgrade you deserved.
I don’t blame you for wanting a nicer suite, but I should caution us all that any suite upgrade (especially from an entry level room) is something for which we should be grateful.
In this case, however, where you had to fight to get the suite upgrade you deserved in the first place, it is not at all inappropriate to expect service recovery to include an even nicer suite upgrade and/or some other compensatory action. I dare say that this is a poorly managed hotel when it behaves so badly—and shows so little recognition for an Ambassador guest, no less. I’m guessing it’s a legacy Marriott.
Perhaps we might consider starting a new thread for unfulfilled suite upgrades at hotels that don’t seem to live up to the spirit of Ambassador status. Just like threads about suite upgrades...but with wikis to make it more obvious when certain hotels seem to fail an Ambassador guest or Ambassador suite upgrade despite ample suite availability online. (I realize online availability isn’t the current delineation for whether a suite is available, but perhaps this might push Marriott for more transparency in that regard.) Regardless, it might shame some hotels into better recognition and treatment.
The only way way to really improve these scenarios is to shame the hotels by sharing the poor experiences on FlyerTalk, TripAdvisor, and Twitter, hoping that enough other people stay elsewhere, too. Only when it hits the hotel’s bottom line does change usually happen.