I'm with Dawn on this one... Priority Club doesn't have enough breadth in the midrange level to handle my run-of-the-mill urban business stays. The two Crown Plazas I've stayed in in the past 3 years did not measure up to the Marriott/Renaissance/W/Westin level. They felt more like an average Doubletree or Sheraton...sort of the low end of the HH/MR/SPG full-service range.

I know PC has great promotions and someone with a lot of rural stays can parlay comparatively few HIX nights into an IC vacation. I just don't do enough volume of those to acquire the points to add up to that level.

I've had good experiences at CY's -- suite upgrades, a few comped brekkies -- but overall I prefer SHS or FI's when traveling for business, due to spacious rooms and early am eats.

I avoid the TownePlace and RI's for same reason as others: b/c you only get 1/2 the points.

I do stay at RI's on points, b/c we have pets.

Didn't mean to offend. You did the rankings. And no. 5 is is the bottom half of nos. 1-8. Or maybe, to put it more positively, you ranked Courtyard in the second highest half.

Courtyard isn't for me.

yeah it is way out there, staying in the Springhill in Sioux Falls, SD tonight it is brand new and the layout/room is incredible, honestly looks like a suite at a vegas hotel in South Dakota, highly recommended. New room designs here put SHS on the top of my personal list for mid-range.

I can deal with teal for this much room and 100% points

I used the "stick my tongue out" smiley to indicate that I wasn't offended. :D :D :D Just having fun with you. And who says those rankings are equally spaced?

Some people have given me "rah rah" status over Courtyard because I've defended Marriott from time to time. Certain others seem to come to this board specifically to bash Courtyard every single chance they get - it's like an obsession with them. Oh well.

Courtyard was first to the scene of the entire "not quite full service" segment of hotels. Without Courtyard, you don't have HGI, or Four Points, or Holiday Inn Express, or Hyatt Place, or most of what Hampton Inn is today. Courtyard was the "seed" product for an entire market segment in the hotel business.

Being first was a great advantage for them in the 80s and 90s. In the 2000s, it's been somewhat of a disadvantage, because as others have noted, Courtyard kind of rested on its laurels and didn't respond to changing market conditions and competition. They also focused on international growth and almost ignored their domestic portfolio. Their recent renovations seem about seven years too late. It will be interesting to see if they can get back ahead of the curve.

Given the economy, I've been surprised they haven't capitulated and started including breakfast in the room rate - it would be logistically easy to implement with very little capital cost. But Courtyard has a 25-year history of using that as a differentiator, and as many of us know, Marriott in general is conservative in how it moves its properties forward.

Lots of people like to attack Marriott for this conservative approach, but given the trouble that "hip/cool" brands like W are facing in this economy, Marriott's strategy is probably the most profitable for the long term. And they have been doing the hotel thing for 50 years.

SpringHill Suites is my current favorite Marriott brand but when you really analyze it, it's my favorite because the average age of the properties is much newer and it simply feels like the "freshest" of the Marriott brands.

I agree with most of what you are saying. I still remember the first time I stayed at a CY (1985 - Atlanta/Executive Park) and was astounded at the nice room without the whole hotel attached. You're right. We take that for granted now.

Like you, SHS is a favorite for me. Unlike you, though, I don't think it's necessarily because it's newer. I like having a distinct sitting area where I can do work, watch TV and have a snack without feeling like I'm in a bedroom. If I need to meet with a coworker, we're not tripping over the bed.

Another thing that keeps me from CYs is the layout of the hotel. The older properties often have quite a hike from the front desk to your room, there is only one elevator at many of the properties, and half the rooms face each other and the pool, which can get loud. Often the hotels are right on the highway, too, which gives a whole other bank of noise. Many rooms are ground floor and offer easy views in from the parking lot or courtyard. Not much can be done about that. SHS are mostly mid-rise with two or three elevators, so it's easy to get from the lobby to the room and I never feel like someone is standing right outside the room looking in. (Have you ever been sitting on a CY balcony and realized someone is looking in the room windows from another balcony?)

So what would it take for CY to be current? Lots of people have said free breakfast. That would be good, but include some quick options. It's not just that breakfast isn't included, it's that the only breakfast option is to sit down and take time. With CL lounge or free breakfast, you can grab a couple things and take them back to your room or run out the door. It's fast and easy.

I think some sort of technology advantage would be a good idea, too. Maybe some sort of easy docking station where you could have a large screen, keyboard and mouse wired and waiting in the room would be a big advantage to those of us who have to sit in a hotel room squinting at our 10" screens, cramming our fingers on a small keyboard to type. For some people, a docking station would let you use your Blackberry or IPhone and leave your computer at home.

Knock the linens up a notch. Make them FS-worthy. Right now, I know I'll get good sheets/pillows/towels at SHS, FI and most RIs. Go plush on the linen and now people see an advantage to staying at a CY.

Just my $0.02.

Now that makes sense. The CY Properties are aged a bit but they have some really great locations that are convenient and low cost, although I prefer a SHS I do 20-30 nights/yr at CY and have no real reason to complain. Location is more important to me than free breakfast.

I do agree that it is time for a linen upgrade for the whole chain.

Appreciate the debate here

Agree with DenverBrian's knowledgeable post and CJKatl's suggestions. Instead of comping breakfast, it looks like the CY redesign (I've haven't been to a redesigned or new CY) upgrades the restaurant to more like a diner. It also looks to me like the new lobbies are a little hipper. I also really liked CY at first, but felt they were left standing still by competitors years ago. Now, CY is rarely a choice for me unless there is absolutely nothing else. (I much prefer the new Fairfields to the standard (not redesigned) CY's.

Like others, it would make a difference to me if CY comped breakfast (at least for plats).

This is interesting. You're describing the "courtyard" view rooms - when they were built, these were considered to be the "quiet" rooms because they faced an interior courtyard, sometimes with an outdoor pool but often with the pool inside, and the ubiquitous signature gazebo. All the even-numbered rooms face the courtyard, and all the suites in early generation Courtyards face the courtyard. This was considered swank!
Have you ever noticed that the newer the CY you stay in, the fewer the balconies? In the 80s this was a key "designed by business travelers for business travelers" point - business travelers in the 80s wanted to relax when on the road, and the cool place to do that was on your own private balcony. How times have changed - today I'd venture to say that business travelers place far more importance on connectivity in the room, "getting work done" in the room, and for relaxing, doing it with other people in a conversational setting like an active lobby.

Gen 1 Courtyards have balconies/patios for 100% of the rooms. Gens 4 and 5 began to remove them. These days it's typical for a new build Courtyard to have zero balconies. You could say this is an example of Courtyard "keeping up" with the times; but of course you can't lop off balconies from an existing older generation.

I have stayed at the CY Bellevue (not the one in downtown Bellevue). The breakfast was quite overpriced, but I got it for free since I booked a weekend gas card package. That property is only 2 stories, and I was fortunate that my room was not too far away from the lobby one morning when I underestimated the potency of the Dannon Activia yogurt. Let's just say, you really need only container, but I was hungry and they didn't have any regular yogurt.

The newest CY prototype is the CY Fair Oaks in Fairfax, VA. The CY Dulles Town Center is relatively new and they did a remodel a few years ago (when they put the 37" HDTV in the rooms). The CY Herndon Reston is probably two or three generations behind the Fair Oaks one and maybe one or two generation(s) behind the Dulles Town Center. The CY Dunn Loring is about the same generation as the CY Dulles Town Center (with an active restaurant for dinner during weekdays).

The CY by the Richmond Airport is tired and needs some serious refurbishment. Having said that, you can leave your car there for a few days for free if you need to catch a flight. I have no idea what their breakfast is like since I have stayed there only for 6-7 am Saturday flights, and they don't start breakfast until 7 am on weekends. This property does have a free washer and dryer for guest use (definitely some older machines but they work fine). The shuttle to and from the airport is by request, and they will pick you up if your 11 pm flight arrives at 3 am. I would rather stay at this property for a night and leave my car in their lot for a 3-6 day trip. Recent weekend rates have been below $100, and this is a better deal especially if you have an early morning flight and/or can use the free parking (since daily parking is $12/day at RIC for parking right by the terminal).

The CY Seattle Southcenter does not give free breakfast, but they offer a free shuttle within a 3-5 mile radius. This is nice if you don't want to rent a car for a night before flying out of SEA. Also, this property is not close to rail tracks like some other limited service Marriott and Hilton properties in the Seattle metro area.

Interesting Rankings. Thanks

You both are very knowledgable and thanks for your rankings. Im my newbie opinion I would just like to say that the Hyatt Place I stayed at in Ontario, CA was VERY nice for less than $100 this last winter. I really liked their low key coffee shop like cafe feel and the room was impressive. Granted I think this hotel is very recent, but I was impressed with the staff as well, which as we all know can make or break a stay.

Yeah, me too. But given that we've been raising this issue for the past couple of years in these threads, I don't see it happening. Obviously, Marriott doesn't see the need to offer that or they'd have done it by now. As I've said for years, "in business, if there's no penalty for NOT doing something....why do it?"

Also despite the other shortcomings many of us see with it, the CY brand appears to be doing quite well.

My mistake on my previous good/bad list...didn't realize there were two CYs in Bellevue. The one I like is downtown, but have never been to the other so cannot comment on it.


I forgot about this CY. It is very, very nice. This property and the CY in Shaumburg are similar, with the cool vibe and the plasmas and the dark wood... Unfortunately, I cannot stay at the Fairfax CY at Fair Oaks anymore after the incident.... My Hertz car alarm would not stop. Everyone at the hotel tried to get it to stop, but something funky happened. Eventually someone disconnected the battery. Hertz brought me a new car! Seriously, the staff at this hotel helped so much when this happened. One guy even offered to drive me back to the airport when he got off work if I needed to go there to get a new car.

Additional good CY: Chapel Hill. It is a pretty good sized hotel that almost feels more Ren than CY. It fits in with what you would expect in Chapel Hill. To be avoided: CY Winston-Salem University. The gas station next door is so close they can't even put a picture of the hotel on the Web site without showing the Shell. It's smack on a busy intersection with just a few feet between you and the road. It's pretty dated.

The non downtown CY Bellevue looked like a first generation CY to me. I was shocked that there was no elevator (although 2 floors isn't a big deal). It isn't that far from the Microsoft campus. I don't think I will stay there again since I found another CY in the Seattle area that actually gives platinum members free breakfast (and is closer to more restaurants and malls).