joshua362

I think only this is certain: The will be losers and there will be big losers. And more than half will fall into the latter. Marriott was minting elites like candy over the last 10 years and eliminated its biggest quality (rewards) competitor while overpaying for Starwood. Why would there be any winners?

SF1K

I know this is speculation - but that would have very little difference between Gold and Platinum, which would be weird for requiring double the amount of nights per year.

jeanie

This is really not worded very well. There is a possibility is that the phrase "for now" might not be a literal statement meaning this exact moment. Since they mentioned the changes would be in August in the previous sentence, for now could actually refer to the changes being announced for August. If this was a translation from a statement originally written in Chinese, that could explain some of the awkwardness. But I could read the statement as stating that there will be changes taking place in August that will make the 3 programs function as one, but the programs themselves will remain separate until a later date.

The wording is so bad here, though, this statement could also mean the programs are being merged in August.

Looking back at the email they sent last year announcing the end of rollover nights, the wording in that notice was poor as well. It would be interesting to know if Marriott is just bad at press releases or if they are keeping it intentionally vague for some reason.

HHonors OUTSIDER

"For now, programme names will remain the same" is just stating that the programme name may change in the future. Too me whe whole statement is very clear. What doesn't make sense is someone participating in SPG pursuing Platinum with 25 stays has the requirements changed after 7 months invested in SPG.

aCavalierInCoach

If the category elimination rumor is true, the TPs are going to have to change materially.

pinniped

Basically, Marriott/SPG are driving the entire product to a pure commodity state. It's a bed, toilet, and shower. Do not expect anything more. There will be a transactional program with some rewards to effectively lower your cost, but ultimately the decision is pretty simply going to be one of price. Is Marriott 5% cheaper than Hilton after I take into account the simple Southwest-style rebate? Are these brands cheaper than Airbnb, Booking.com, VRBO, etc. for my leisure stays? Who has the cheapest functionally acceptable hotel for my business stays?

Starwood did an effective job of making me consider loyalty, human interactions, relationships, and soft product in addition to just the firmness of the bed and the quality of the toilet paper. The SPG program caused me to pay extra to stay at Starwood. In this new model, I'll just stay wherever is cheapest for my basic stays. If I want a true luxury experience, I'll seek out a property that has *no* program - or a very limited in-house one.

I guess this is where the industry wants to go. Hilton did it. Marriott and Starwood are doing it. They're just renting beds and toilets, and I guess they might as well drive as much uniqueness and human interaction out of that as possible.

Boraxo

People should not underestimate the value of lounge access. It's huge for most of the elites I know (across all programs) even those of us who can expense pricey meals. It's a huge convenience and even bigger for family stays. Mark my words messing with this perk will have serious repercussions! It is one of the main reasons I favored Marriott over SPG & Hyatt even though SPG often had the nicer properties. (And why Hyatt was smart to add 4 lounge upgrade certs to its mid-tier status)

Interesting as SPG had the worst ROI for spend - as detailed in several studies. SPG Plats did a bit better particularly with stay bonus but for most the SPG Amex was the best way to earn points and actual hotel spend was more richly rewarded at Marriott. In addition Marriott provided Gold with lounge access, something that was never avail to SPG Golds. And of course there were several easy routes to MR Gold, but none to SPG Plat. The result created a dilemma for mid-tiers: do I stay at Westin/St.Regis which usually has nicer rooms or do I stay at Marriott where I get better perks and ROI?

That being said it is disappointing to see MR use the program merge (which is necessary and inevitable) as an excuse to downgrade the mid-tier experience. The smarter move would be to offer a carrot to SPG Gold (which was basically worthless under the pre-merger program) and many more carrots to Plats along with the difficult new qualification requirements. As it stand Marriott Plats will be happy with guaranteed upgrades (something I never saw in 2 years of MR Plat) but SPG elites are mostly shafted.

CJKatl

Agreed, until the next time the market heads south and they need us again and they start offering free nights in Paris if you stay two nights at an FI, etc. But then people will feel entitled to easy free nights in Paris and act as though their parents cut them off when Marriott retreats on the benefits. It is a business relationship where we each need to evaluate what is being offered at the time and make a decision that is best for us in that moment. It is not a familial relationship. It is not a loyalty program, despite the name. It is a Marriott marketing tool. They can make whatever offer and we can accept that offer or reject it.

On a couple other posts above...

I've been to Asia enough times and seen enough weak translation and telephone game messages that I'm not putting credence into the paper shown above until we hear something else. The best cooking class I ever took in Thailand was Cooking with Poo, which is her name, it means flower, but she won an international worst named book award when she used that for her book title.

While some things may be combined soon, like the ability to make reservations at all hotels on a single website and maybe even the points currency used, I don't expect changes on qualification points or nights needed until the start of the new year. People are already working towards next year's qualification based on the present rules so it is unlikely those will be changed midstream.

Does anyone think that maybe LT qualification in the new program might be based on present nights/points totals instead of the label presently attained? In other words, given we know there will likely be more LT tiers, might the present LTP who would qualify for LT-50 (or whatever they decide to call it) get that label and those who qualify for LT-75 get that label? Of course that might mean some present SPG LTPs might be LTG in the new program, so maybe there will be a LT-50 floor to avoid that... Obviously we don't know for sure but might that be the solution?

lexdevil

Off topic, but I'm pretty sure poo means crab in Thai. Chan pad poo = spicy rice noodles with crab.

cfischer

If the 75 nights for lounge access is true ... I am out. I can't see them going through with this. They need to stop the nonsense with UA for sure but really with 50 nights ... no lounge access? That makes no sense to me. Of course there is also no longer any rollover and I am sure CC nights are not counting either ... either way, there better be a complete update asap. What a mess. Glad I maintained Hilton Gold.

CJKatl

You are likely correct. IIRC her name was more than on syllable, the last syllable was "poo" and the whole name meant some sort of rose. Everyone calls her Poo. Her story which she tells as part of the class is inspiring. It is held in the slum where she used to live and several of the people in the slum work for her.

cova

I would have to image that the Platinum levels would get lounge access (Plat @ 50 nights, PP @ 75, and Amb @ 100).

The new Gold at 25 nights likely would not get lounge access - maybe breakfast or other benefits.

If United / Marriott continued their program then United would likely match to the new Marriott Gold (without lounge access).

The Marriott / United hookup has been weighted towards United. United Gold+ Elites get Marriott Lounge Access, but Marriott Gold only gets United Silver - and no lounge access at the airport for international.

The lounges have gotten way too crowded - too many people are eligible.

margarita girl

C17PSGR

The couple of Westin lounges I have been in are pretty embarrassing. Certainly below the average Marriott/Renn. Folgers coffee and no protein!

LPCJr