Head

[QUOTE=flying_donkeys12;29139287]
No. I don't pay anything out of pocket. Our company card is paid monthly by the company. We have 60 days to submit the report. In this case, It took me about 45 days to file the report. Then after aproval it went to auditing. At that point it was sent back. We don't have to pay our expenses any longer. The company card is charged to company and paid by the company. The expense report is just to confirm the charges (for lack of a better term).

Back when we actually had to pay and be reimbursed I would only do one or two a year. Had a friend that called it his Christmas fund. Lol.

The only thing I am ever guilty of when it comes to expense reports is trying to take the whole 60 days to submit them.... I travel often and hate doing them. So I put them off. Concur made then simpler for me, but not quicker.

EuropeanPete

How do you differentiate that scenario vs. going to your friend's restaurant and asking for a $50 receipt for your dinner, while you pocket $30? It's the same thing. With the extra points rates you are simply buying hotel points for personal benefit packaged with your room night.

Kacee

Keep on believing that. Meanwhile, you might want to keep that resume updated.

DJ_Iceman

Well, I don't see that as the same thing. What you described is outright fraud. But let's said they had a menu offer open to any guest--either $30 for dinner, or $50 for dinner plus a $20 gift card back to you. And if the $50 was under my cap for reimbursement, then I would not feel guilty about eating the $50 dinner and getting the $20 gift card that I could use later with my family. In fact, I would see that as a smart move that maximized my benefit while making up (in a tiny way) for all the time I spend away from my family while traveling for business.

I wouldn't make fun of someone who ordered the $30 dinner, but again wouldn't feel the least bit unethical ordering the $50 dinner. It's possible I'm not as squeaky-clean as I thought? Or it's also possible that people who have a problem with this are bordering on McCarthyism?

JackE

The tax on a hotel room is less than the usual marginal tax bracket, so it actually makes financial sense to pay a deductible $25 plus hotel tax to get a nontaxable benefit of $25.

dayone

Two words: internal auditor.

466SHH

the name for this is situational ethics. If one scenario is “outright fraud,” the other one is too.

And FWIW, speaking as an employer, the gift card belongs to the business, not to you. There is no difference between the scenario you described and taking a $20 bill out of the petty cash drawer. This would get you fired in a heartbeat in my shop.

Call me old fashioned (I am sure someone here will) but the unemployment folks in my state will back me up on this- it would be a termination for cause here.

I expect I am going to need my flameproof overcoat after this post.

Marriott15

Woah! Just Woah! I was not expecting this when I posted this last night nor 35 messages by the time I looked at this. To answer your question when I got my bill today all it says is accommodation! Does not say anything about extra points, type of room or type of bed!

I am a Pharma rep and I travel about 105 nights a year! I was told by my district manager, and my president of my division that I can stay at any hotel and room type as long as it is under $200. I always stayed in the regular king bed and never got the suite because I never wanted to get into trouble!

One night my district manager and my president of my division flew in to ride around with me and I booked the Marriott for $160. After we checked in they came to my room to get ready to get dinner and they said why didn't you get the suite its $195? I said I just get the regular king room normally I don't want the word suite when I do my expense reports. The president of my division said "You can stay upwards of $200 no matter the room type as long as you don't exceed the $200 you are free to stay in the Suites."

Example: Marriott 1 king bed is $150 and and 1 king suite is $200 I am allowed to stay in the 1 king suite.

I am given $120 for food. For food purchases under $25 I do not have to send in a receipt! I won't even get into that here!

I spend about $31,000 a year between Hotels, Food and Gas. Yes my company pays for my gas no matter if its for business or leisure! When I do breakfast's or Lunches at doctors offices that is another $18,000 a year. Just for me they are spending about $50,000 in expense a year! Plus what ever the cost of my Car (New Car every 3 years) and Car insurance is. This is just me we have 120 reps in my division with these expenses. We have 3 divisions!


Something that one of my coworkers does that is unethical in my opinon is he will actually go to hotels, check in, use the $120 in food and leave that night. So he gets the free dinner and hotel points and doesnt even stay the night! That I would never do!

Obviously other companies are more strict them mine. I asked my district manager today if he knew about this with the points with IHG and he said he did not and he would have to start doing it!

After reading some of these replies I am grateful for the bosses I have! I would of been fired 10 times today!!!!!!!

CJKatl

Amen.

My last company, one of the handful of largest on the planet, did not require receipts except for hotel stays and cash over $25. No limits, no per diems. Employees charged to the company card and used a quick check-off system to confirm expenses, which were paid by the company. Expense reports were randomly audited, which meant the company called to verify each expense. In ten years of pretty large weekly expense reports I may have had five or six randomly audited and one that was audited because it triggered something which I knew was likely ahead of time. (A $900 one night hotel room in NYC the day before Veteran's Day) When you submitted the expense report the system would let you know if the report was going to be audited and the auditor would send you an email when it was finished. A couple times the auditor also emailed asking questions. Choosing a high hotel rate was okay when necessary, but choosing a rate that put extra points in your pocket would have been unacceptable.

nacho

Of course the IHG bill said "accommodation", it's like the pay-tv billed as "communication charge" - if it said bonus points package I doubt that they can sell many of those, as no one can really expense buying points/Gift card/gas card for personal use.

Now I know why medicine cost so much in the US - apparently part of the cost is to fund luxurious style corporate travel and leisure travel (via points purchased using company's dime).

Orange County Commuter

Actually I made lifetime Platinum only saying at Marriott when they were NOT higher then the other alternatives. (I admit it helped that for 7 years I commuted to an office where the only real option was a Courtyard across the parking lot)


And my entire career has been in healthcare or healthcare consulting. Paying extra to get "points" would have been a reason to have a long discussion with my staff on "why this was a bad idea" followed by "Do it again and you will not be here"

Trust me most healthcare providers watch travel expenses like a hawk!


And the assumption that it's not CPAs working on your expense report is correct. But it is CPAs that audit them. I just started an audit and there are already some really unhappy people who thought that they got away with something last year

hockeyinsider

I would call it "situational" because morality and ethics are in flux today. What you could consider wrong may be considered perfectly acceptable by someone else.

For example, one of my clients places no restrictions on the type of wine or the price of wine that may be purchased in group dinners with prospects. I went with the business development director for my client, who was taking some prospects out to dinner. He had no qualms about ordering $500 bottle of wines for a 5-person dinner.

Another consultant I know builds into his contract that he is entitled to domestic first-class or international business-class on any flight with a published flight time over 5 hours and 59 minutes. Often the domestic first-class ticket is cheaper or within $100-$150 for flights of 3, 4 or 5 hours. He will buy the economy-class ticket, print the receipt, cancel the ticket, and then buy a first-class ticket on the exact same flight. He submits the receipt for the economy-class ticket and then pays the difference himself. Is that wrong? I don't think so. I think it would only be wrong if the first-class ticket was cheaper and he pocketed the difference.

pinniped

At my previous employer, it was contractors in India who were paid to look at things closely. They rejected all sorts of stuff and we always assumed they were paid to find unusual things.

They'd reject very small amounts for odd reasons - like a $10 parking receipt that didn't have the YEAR on it. Think about it: you're on a personal trip on December 6, 2017 and incur a $10 parking charge. You think "I'm going to hang on to this receipt in case, years in the future, I'm back in this city on a business trip on December 6th. Then, I'm totally sticking this ten bucks to my client!" That's what the auditors were basically accusing me of doing. (I found the matching credit card charge, included and image of it with the whole date, and got reimbursed.)

So yeah, they're detectives and they care. I think they actually enjoy it.

CJKatl

Exact same here.

hockeyinsider

So, for example:

The Marriott in Teaneck, New Jersey, has a public rate of $136. If you pay $189, you get 2,500 bonus points on top of the regular points and bonus points you would receive as a platinum.

The Marriott in Auburn Hills/Pontiac/Bloomfield Hills, Michigan, has a public rate of $109. If you pay $149, you get 5,000 bonus points on top of the regular points and bonus points you would receive as a platinum. Alternatively, for $149 you could get dinner consisting of an appetizer, entree and a glass of house wine. That's a decent value if you price a glass of wine at $8-14, an appetizer at $8-12 and an entree at $12-20.

The Renaissance in Novi, Michigan, has a public rate of $142. If you pay $199, you get breakfast for two in the restaurant (as opposed to a continental breakfast or points as a platinum), two cocktails, and a $50 coupon for the Twelve Oaks shopping mall (Nordstrom, Macy's, and Lord & Taylor are among the stores).

The Marriott Maida Vale in London has a public rate of 117 pounds/$156. If you pay 156 pounds/$208, you get 10,000 bonus points on top of the regular points and bonus points you would receive as a platinum.