What constitutes "a daily choice of breakfast"?
May 15, 2017, 8:32 am
#31
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What next, criteria for spelling "center" as Center verses centre because that's the way the Brits spell it !!
Crap, there's a sticky. If they can't find it or know about it this is not kindergarten......
Crap, there's a sticky. If they can't find it or know about it this is not kindergarten......
Yet it seems since this sentiment has been posted there has been a doubling down on its usage of "brekkie" instead of breakfast. Putting aside what someone might think of the word itself, an infrequent user coming to the site might search for a specific hotel and narrow the search for breakfast, not knowing there is a dedicated sticky. Using the term "brekkie" will make it impossible for someone to find the information. If we care about helping fellow travelers, we won't use the unusual term. The fact there has been increased and what seems gratuitous use of the term is mystifying.
May 15, 2017, 9:49 am
#32
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For the amount of time & effort Sharon puts into this board for the benefit of complete strangers, she can call breakfast whatever she wants, just don't call me late for brekkie! 
Actually I am not a breakfast fan but sometimes travel with girl friends who are and it cringes me to pay $40+ for the tiniest of breakfasts with crappy service, ala JW Marriott San Francisco.
Her contributions are priceless.
Actually I am not a breakfast fan but sometimes travel with girl friends who are and it cringes me to pay $40+ for the tiniest of breakfasts with crappy service, ala JW Marriott San Francisco.
Her contributions are priceless.
May 15, 2017, 10:35 am
#33
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At increasing number of Marriott properties at least have Dannon Oikos Greek yogurt, which is a little better quality than the $0.85 tiny containers of Dannon yogurt flavored with artificial ingredients.
May 15, 2017, 10:37 am
#34
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Well, here's another thing, has Marriott ever defined "continental breakfast"? 
IMHO, "continental breakfast" in the hotel industry at large is such an overused and misused term that it's pretty meaningless. I think it originally meant the standard southern European breakfast of toast and jam and coffee. (It certainly didn't mean the lavish standard Scandinavian breakfast, even though technically the Scandinavian peninsula is still part of the "continent".)
There are budget hotel chain aplenty all across the US (not sure about other parts of the world) where "continental" breakfast might mean only donuts or bagels and maybe cereal for the kids.
OTOH, at "lower midscale" properties with a free breakfast, "continental" breakfast means whatever is on the buffet, even if it includes one or two token hot food items.
Finally, at those few Marriott-program properties where I've been given it, "continental" breakfast simply means the cold buffet, as opposed to the hot buffet. But what is on the cold buffet of course varies. At a better hotel, it's hopefully got at least sliced cheese/meats you can put on your bread for a bit more substantial breakfast than just bread alone.
Anyway, back to Europe, Europe is big place, with lots of different countries. As I already mentioned, putting Marriott aside for a moment, the standard across other indie or small chain hotels for breakfast is completely different in Italy versus Norway. It's as different (in variety, though not quality) as the difference between a Days Inn and the buffet at a Ritz, in that in Italy it's just a few breads and jams on your table, while in Norway it's often a multi-room buffet that beats any other free buffet I've had in hotels anywhere else in the world by a mile.
IMHO, "continental breakfast" in the hotel industry at large is such an overused and misused term that it's pretty meaningless. I think it originally meant the standard southern European breakfast of toast and jam and coffee. (It certainly didn't mean the lavish standard Scandinavian breakfast, even though technically the Scandinavian peninsula is still part of the "continent".)
There are budget hotel chain aplenty all across the US (not sure about other parts of the world) where "continental" breakfast might mean only donuts or bagels and maybe cereal for the kids.
OTOH, at "lower midscale" properties with a free breakfast, "continental" breakfast means whatever is on the buffet, even if it includes one or two token hot food items.
Finally, at those few Marriott-program properties where I've been given it, "continental" breakfast simply means the cold buffet, as opposed to the hot buffet. But what is on the cold buffet of course varies. At a better hotel, it's hopefully got at least sliced cheese/meats you can put on your bread for a bit more substantial breakfast than just bread alone.
Anyway, back to Europe, Europe is big place, with lots of different countries. As I already mentioned, putting Marriott aside for a moment, the standard across other indie or small chain hotels for breakfast is completely different in Italy versus Norway. It's as different (in variety, though not quality) as the difference between a Days Inn and the buffet at a Ritz, in that in Italy it's just a few breads and jams on your table, while in Norway it's often a multi-room buffet that beats any other free buffet I've had in hotels anywhere else in the world by a mile.
May 15, 2017, 11:10 am
#35
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I always understood "continental" to mean cold food items - breads, hard-boiled eggs, cured meats - along with cold or hot beverages. In the US, particularly, these can be pretty bleak with more cellophane than any meal should include.
"Full" I take to mean table service with a complete menu of hot or cold choices.
"Buffet" means Sterno and chafing dishes and hope for the best. These have often been questionable in terms of quality.
"Full" I take to mean table service with a complete menu of hot or cold choices.
"Buffet" means Sterno and chafing dishes and hope for the best. These have often been questionable in terms of quality.
May 15, 2017, 11:30 am
#36
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Honestly, when I hear the term "continental breakfast", I think of a hard roll, toast, jams, butter, hot tea, and coffee. *Maybe* a cheese plate - a real simple one. I used to stay in pensiones or other small (budget) hotels that had this offering, and to this day it's the definition that comes to mind.
To the OP: the benefit at European hotels very much reads like the guest can choose two breakfasts in the restaurant. I can't think of any way to parse it differently, and the fact that the following sentence specifically references continental breakfast at U.S. hotels only enhances my belief that it's intended to be any two breakfasts, guests' choice. Regardless of whether you think U.S. hotels limiting guests to "continental" breakfasts (of any definition) is nonsensical, the fact is they *don't* call out the same limitation for non-U.S./Canada hotels.
Think about it: if you booked a rate that included "dinner for two in the restaurant", with no further modifiers or fine print, you'd be very upset if you got there and saw a full menu, but were told you only get cold items from the appetizer/salad list. You might expect booze or dessert to not be included, but you'd expect the core menu.
Given that Marriott doesn't seem to be purposely trying to pull a fast one here, it seems like they should correct the behaviors of this Autograph Collection hotel as soon as possible.
Starwood's terms and conditions are immaterial. The programs haven't been merged yet.
To the OP: the benefit at European hotels very much reads like the guest can choose two breakfasts in the restaurant. I can't think of any way to parse it differently, and the fact that the following sentence specifically references continental breakfast at U.S. hotels only enhances my belief that it's intended to be any two breakfasts, guests' choice. Regardless of whether you think U.S. hotels limiting guests to "continental" breakfasts (of any definition) is nonsensical, the fact is they *don't* call out the same limitation for non-U.S./Canada hotels.
Think about it: if you booked a rate that included "dinner for two in the restaurant", with no further modifiers or fine print, you'd be very upset if you got there and saw a full menu, but were told you only get cold items from the appetizer/salad list. You might expect booze or dessert to not be included, but you'd expect the core menu.
Given that Marriott doesn't seem to be purposely trying to pull a fast one here, it seems like they should correct the behaviors of this Autograph Collection hotel as soon as possible.
Starwood's terms and conditions are immaterial. The programs haven't been merged yet.
May 15, 2017, 1:11 pm
#37
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However, as I noted up thread (quoting myself now)
Found this:
http://www.marriott.com/hotel-promot...d-breakfast.mi
"There's more on the menu. Any time the lounge is closed, or if you’re staying at a hotel in Europe without a lounge, you'll have a choice of continental breakfast for two in the hotel restaurant or 750 Rewards points. If you’re outside of the U.S. or Canada, you’ll also enjoy a complimentary continental breakfast daily."
So the T&Cs aren't matching. The above specifically says continental in Europe, as well as outside of US/Canada.
So, while the majority of properties outside the US/Canada provide full brekkie, it's not a given per T&Cs (aka, dif T&Cs have dif wording).
Cheers.
Found this:
http://www.marriott.com/hotel-promot...d-breakfast.mi
"There's more on the menu. Any time the lounge is closed, or if you’re staying at a hotel in Europe without a lounge, you'll have a choice of continental breakfast for two in the hotel restaurant or 750 Rewards points. If you’re outside of the U.S. or Canada, you’ll also enjoy a complimentary continental breakfast daily."
So the T&Cs aren't matching. The above specifically says continental in Europe, as well as outside of US/Canada.
So, while the majority of properties outside the US/Canada provide full brekkie, it's not a given per T&Cs (aka, dif T&Cs have dif wording).
Cheers.
May 15, 2017, 1:56 pm
#38
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Why are you limiting this to a specific Autograph Collection prop ?
Ever been to the Ghent Marriott? Brekkie is your former continental nightmare without even a coffee refill !!
Ever been to the Ghent Marriott? Brekkie is your former continental nightmare without even a coffee refill !!
Honestly, when I hear the term "continental breakfast", I think of a hard roll, toast, jams, butter, hot tea, and coffee. *Maybe* a cheese plate - a real simple one. I used to stay in pensiones or other small (budget) hotels that had this offering, and to this day it's the definition that comes to mind.
.....
Given that Marriott doesn't seem to be purposely trying to pull a fast one here, it seems like they should correct the behaviors of this Autograph Collection hotel as soon as possible.
.
.....
Given that Marriott doesn't seem to be purposely trying to pull a fast one here, it seems like they should correct the behaviors of this Autograph Collection hotel as soon as possible.
.
Last edited by Srisarin; May 15, 2017 at 2:13 pm
May 15, 2017, 1:57 pm
#39
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There's nothing worse than ordering off a menu only to have them bring you something from the buffet.
At increasing number of Marriott properties at least have Dannon Oikos Greek yogurt, which is a little better quality than the $0.85 tiny containers of Dannon yogurt flavored with artificial ingredients.
At increasing number of Marriott properties at least have Dannon Oikos Greek yogurt, which is a little better quality than the $0.85 tiny containers of Dannon yogurt flavored with artificial ingredients.
Outside of the Essex House in NYC, it's rare for me to find a breakfast buffet in a major downtown, there was none at the JW SF and the wait (for her) was horrible. Oakland, on the other hand was quite nice and well worthy of the $5 upcharge.
May 15, 2017, 2:38 pm
#40
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Of course, even as I write this I realize the easier thing is to just change the benefit to be "continental breakfast" everywhere. Especially if they have conflicting T's & C's to begin with. A few edits and we will have the least-customer-friendly version, and no need for corporate to have difficult conversations with hotels.
May 15, 2017, 2:48 pm
#41
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However, as I noted up thread (quoting myself now)
Found this:
http://www.marriott.com/hotel-promot...d-breakfast.mi
"There's more on the menu. Any time the lounge is closed, or if you’re staying at a hotel in Europe without a lounge, you'll have a choice of continental breakfast for two in the hotel restaurant or 750 Rewards points. If you’re outside of the U.S. or Canada, you’ll also enjoy a complimentary continental breakfast daily."
So the T&Cs aren't matching. The above specifically says continental in Europe, as well as outside of US/Canada.
So, while the majority of properties outside the US/Canada provide full brekkie, it's not a given per T&Cs (aka, dif T&Cs have dif wording).
Cheers.
Found this:
http://www.marriott.com/hotel-promot...d-breakfast.mi
"There's more on the menu. Any time the lounge is closed, or if you’re staying at a hotel in Europe without a lounge, you'll have a choice of continental breakfast for two in the hotel restaurant or 750 Rewards points. If you’re outside of the U.S. or Canada, you’ll also enjoy a complimentary continental breakfast daily."
So the T&Cs aren't matching. The above specifically says continental in Europe, as well as outside of US/Canada.
So, while the majority of properties outside the US/Canada provide full brekkie, it's not a given per T&Cs (aka, dif T&Cs have dif wording).
Cheers.
May 15, 2017, 3:14 pm
#42
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, and it probably gives hotels an out. The link works (below):http://www.marriott.com/hotel-promot...d-breakfast.mi
Good luck w/ getting the Glasshouse to switch to a full breakfast, but since day 1 they've been doing the cont'l w/ the up charges for full or room service I don't think you'll get very far. But your choice on whether to argue/discuss it w/ them when you check in.
Cheers.
Last edited by SkiAdcock; May 15, 2017 at 3:22 pm Reason: provide working link...
May 16, 2017, 7:09 am
#43
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By far the most realistic outcome here is they update the T&C to specify 'Continental'at all properties globally......followed some time later by enforcement of brand standards which will leave us all worse off.
May 16, 2017, 7:40 am
#44
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Sad...especially since most properties have buffets, and offering the buffet to elites is a damn near free way to make most guests happy.
May 16, 2017, 8:55 am
#45
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I know when we stayed at the Crystal City Marriott (in Virginia) although it was supposed to just be a continental brekkie (since the lounge was closed), it was the guys in the restaurant who said we could have anything and the omelettes were delicious! I presume that was done with the full knowledge of TPTB!
For the record, my definition of a continental breakfast is a piece of bread, something to smear on it, and coffee or juice. Maybe a cold cereal with milk.
I also vote to ban the use of "brekkie". I had never heard of the term before FlyerTalk and it's an annoying one.
Last edited by catocony; May 16, 2017 at 9:02 am