Jul 30, 2016, 4:21 pm
Last edit by: Slickw
LINK TO CHART
Legacy to New Travel Package Conversion (effective August 2019)
A Marriott supervisor can currently convert your legacy travel package into the new category mapping. If you hold a Category 6, 8, or Tier 1-3 legacy certificate, it's ideal to downgrade your certificate before converting so that points don't potentially get lost in the process.
The codes for the new partial packages are:
New Cat 1-4: QP83
New Cat 5: QP91
New Cat 6: QP99
New Cat 7:
The legacy certificates map to the new certificates as such:
Cat 1-5 => Cat 1-4
Cat 6 => Cat 1-4
Cat 7 => Cat 5
Cat 8 => Cat 5
Cat 9 => Cat 6
Tier 1-3 => Cat 6
Tier 4-5 => Cat 7
==================================================
If you are unsure where you will use your 7 night stay, when you request the package, just ask for a category 1-5 hotel. That way you are out of the least number of points. If later, you decide to book for a higher level category, then you can do so and pay the difference the travel package points. If you can't use your certificate within the year, then as close to the one year anniversary (without going over!) call to extend the certificate for one more year. That's as long as they will typically allow, one extension. There is an option to expedite the mileage delivery to within three business days (sometimes faster) for $15. There are reports that this fee may be waived for platinum members.
Effective April 1 2017 re: Southwest & the companion pass:
"Purchased points, points converted from hotel and car loyalty programs, and e-Rewards, e-Miles, Valued Opinions and Diners Club, points earned from Rapid Rewards program enrollment, tier bonuses, flight bonuses, and partner bonuses (excluding points bonuses earned on the Rapid Rewards Credit Cards from Chase) do not count toward Companion Pass."
************
Can I book SPG properties with my Marriott Travel Package? As of 9/1/2018 apparently not. see https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/30155836-post6529.html
Legacy to New Travel Package Conversion (effective August 2019)
A Marriott supervisor can currently convert your legacy travel package into the new category mapping. If you hold a Category 6, 8, or Tier 1-3 legacy certificate, it's ideal to downgrade your certificate before converting so that points don't potentially get lost in the process.
The codes for the new partial packages are:
New Cat 1-4: QP83
New Cat 5: QP91
New Cat 6: QP99
New Cat 7:
Originally Posted by Marriott Rewards Insider
Members who purchased a Category 6, Category 8 or Tier 1-3 certificate prior to 8/18 are able to request a one-time exchange for a Travel Package one category lower. This process will cancel your current Travel Package, reissue a Travel Package one category lower and result in a refund of 30,000 points to your account. To submit a request, follow these steps:
Source: https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/marr...es-update.html
- Select “Packages - Deals” from the “Topic” drop down menu
- Submit your request
Source: https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/marr...es-update.html
The legacy certificates map to the new certificates as such:
Cat 1-5 => Cat 1-4
Cat 6 => Cat 1-4
Cat 7 => Cat 5
Cat 8 => Cat 5
Cat 9 => Cat 6
Tier 1-3 => Cat 6
Tier 4-5 => Cat 7
==================================================
If you are unsure where you will use your 7 night stay, when you request the package, just ask for a category 1-5 hotel. That way you are out of the least number of points. If later, you decide to book for a higher level category, then you can do so and pay the difference the travel package points. If you can't use your certificate within the year, then as close to the one year anniversary (without going over!) call to extend the certificate for one more year. That's as long as they will typically allow, one extension. There is an option to expedite the mileage delivery to within three business days (sometimes faster) for $15. There are reports that this fee may be waived for platinum members.
Effective April 1 2017 re: Southwest & the companion pass:
"Purchased points, points converted from hotel and car loyalty programs, and e-Rewards, e-Miles, Valued Opinions and Diners Club, points earned from Rapid Rewards program enrollment, tier bonuses, flight bonuses, and partner bonuses (excluding points bonuses earned on the Rapid Rewards Credit Cards from Chase) do not count toward Companion Pass."
************
Can I book SPG properties with my Marriott Travel Package? As of 9/1/2018 apparently not. see https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/30155836-post6529.html
Marriott Travel Packages
Aug 18, 2018, 6:47 pm
#5641
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: UK
Programs: BA S, VS S, SQ G, HH D, IHG D/A, Marriott G, Radisson G, Hertz PC
Posts: 3,945
Quite baffled that Marriott think it is somehow appropriate to map multiple old certs onto the same new one without reimbursing the unnecessary extra that customers paid.
Also find it difficult that the hotel cat mapping (eg old 6 to new 5) wasn't applied to the vouchers too.
For those saying folks should just have attached to a redemption - that only applied to Marriott properties, in many locations there is only an SPG option!
Also find it difficult that the hotel cat mapping (eg old 6 to new 5) wasn't applied to the vouchers too.
For those saying folks should just have attached to a redemption - that only applied to Marriott properties, in many locations there is only an SPG option!
Aug 18, 2018, 6:51 pm
#5642
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 62
This all could have been avoided if they had just published the information that they already had in their pocket. Now they have tons of angry customers because they thought withholding information was the right way to go. What kind of morons ever thought this was a good idea? "Let's make sure our best customers who are obviously loyal to the brand due to their large point balances have no way to anticipate it when we pull the rug out..."
Also, a marriott platinum rep told me, over and over, that I would be able to upgrade or downgrade like usual after the merger. Now, I knew that wasn’t true because I read some blogs. What about those that didn’t read blogs, ie normal customers that trust what customer service reps tell them to be accurate rather than blogs and forums?
Aug 18, 2018, 6:55 pm
#5643
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Jakarta
Programs: *wood & marriott plat, Hyatt, Accor
Posts: 410
So that is the reasons why no downgrade or upgrade allowed after Aug 18?
HOW SLEAZY Marriott has become.
I understand it does not want to let the bloggers fanned speculation got paid off, but in doing such conversion and not allowing downgrade for those holding the ESSENTIALLY BEING DOWNGRADED INVOLUNTARILY Cat 6 owner to get back the 30K over payment is not the right way to keep people whole.
THIS.IS.NOT.RIGHT.
HOW SLEAZY Marriott has become.
I understand it does not want to let the bloggers fanned speculation got paid off, but in doing such conversion and not allowing downgrade for those holding the ESSENTIALLY BEING DOWNGRADED INVOLUNTARILY Cat 6 owner to get back the 30K over payment is not the right way to keep people whole.
THIS.IS.NOT.RIGHT.
Aug 18, 2018, 6:55 pm
#5644
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Florida
Posts: 29,755
Totally agree about the blog frenzy. I was so tempted to get one after reading through all the blogs. Ultimately decided against it because I have plenty of miles and would rather have the points to book hotels in the combined program. Maybe I could’ve made out big with the Cat 9 certs. But i wouldn’t have known and prob wouldn’t ended up with 7 nights in Cat 1-4 that I don’t really want to stay at. So in the end, I didn’t gamble so no win here. Or loss.
But I don’t really understand the anger. People here decided to take on the gamble knowing that it’s completrly up to Marriott to map these categories. Marriott never promised to make these certs MORE valuable after the transition. Having been on the mileage train for years, I expect devaluation over time and with each transition.
The whole handling has one goal in mind - to create the most breakage and to reduce as much as possible the liability of carrying the redemption value, at the least cost possible, regardless how the members are screwed now that we have so many properties, many would have no choice but still stay at our properties. This is it.
Aug 18, 2018, 7:05 pm
#5645
Suspended
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Kan@da
Programs: Anything with sweet spots
Posts: 1,790
No more loyalty to Marriott. To take revenge at Marriott, I will complain about slightest thing during my future award certificate stays and demand compensation in the form of refund or points.
Aug 18, 2018, 7:07 pm
#5646
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: IL
Posts: 270
Some observations of implications beyond the cat mapping:
1) Floaters become the same as new TP certs - good, simple, no 'peak' blackouts by doing a points based cert or 'standard rates' only cert.
2) Converted certs can book SPG properties - assumed, but good to confirm
3) These new TPs are now bookable and usable immediately, but the converted equivalent certs are blacked out for a month. Attaching a cert if a manual process, and the backend for the new certs must exist if they are bookable and usable as Marriott has communicated. Floater mapping presumably finalized (although not through official communications to affected members). So why the blackout if the instrument, mapping and manual reservation process are effectively all in place? Block all the aspiration SPG properties while others swoop them up? Provide time to assess the blowback and change course if necessary? Strange in retrospect.
No specific official advanced notice of a devaluation, and the presumably unnecessary blackout are a bad look, very un-Marriott from past precedent. No need for the 'Lurker said X' or 'That's what you get for gambling on a windfall' responses. Marriott's only communication did not insinuate any devaluation, only "conversion". I'm just "still trying to plan that perfect trip".
I'm going to speculate that this isn't over.
1) Floaters become the same as new TP certs - good, simple, no 'peak' blackouts by doing a points based cert or 'standard rates' only cert.
2) Converted certs can book SPG properties - assumed, but good to confirm
3) These new TPs are now bookable and usable immediately, but the converted equivalent certs are blacked out for a month. Attaching a cert if a manual process, and the backend for the new certs must exist if they are bookable and usable as Marriott has communicated. Floater mapping presumably finalized (although not through official communications to affected members). So why the blackout if the instrument, mapping and manual reservation process are effectively all in place? Block all the aspiration SPG properties while others swoop them up? Provide time to assess the blowback and change course if necessary? Strange in retrospect.
No specific official advanced notice of a devaluation, and the presumably unnecessary blackout are a bad look, very un-Marriott from past precedent. No need for the 'Lurker said X' or 'That's what you get for gambling on a windfall' responses. Marriott's only communication did not insinuate any devaluation, only "conversion". I'm just "still trying to plan that perfect trip".
I'm going to speculate that this isn't over.
Aug 18, 2018, 7:09 pm
#5647
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: NY Metro
Programs: SPG Titanium, United Premier 1K
Posts: 1,601
If they do refund 30k then I hope they do for everyone, even those that have certain attached and they decide to later cancel (thereby making them floaters again). Otherwise you are punishing those customers who actually listened to you and attached to a reservation.
Aug 18, 2018, 7:09 pm
#5648
Join Date: Aug 2018
Posts: 6
I think Marriott has lost a ton of goodwill over their handling of this aspect of the transition. There is no reason why they could not have informed us on how they were going to handle the packages rather than trickle down bits of conflicting and ambiguous information. What is puzzling to me is how the executives in management determined this was in their own best interest? One would think that carefully communicating to those that presumably are their most valued customers would be a priority. Maybe the thought was that since they effectively have such a disproportionate advantage in market share that they could simply get away with this decision because it would affect such a small proportion of their overall customer base. If that were the case, I think that this was short sighted of them. It wouldn't have cost much to be generous to make up for the operational mistakes in failing to communicate effectively - and I think that would have less of an impact on future revenue growth but this is clearly going to be a driver of customer attrition. Even this latest communication is flawed, because if they do go make people whole for their 30k losses, it still will always be remembered for their handling of the situation and at bare minimum lead to less customer engagement.
Aug 18, 2018, 7:10 pm
#5649
Join Date: Mar 2016
Posts: 67
1. The speculation that Marriott didn't disclose because there would be windfalls to be had turned out to be true.
2. The casual Marriott member who was not looking to how to game the system sees absolutely no loss across the board. None lost value. Some received windfalls.
3. The windfalls were: (i) Old Cat 1-5 (with hotel point value of 150k) being bumped to New Cat 1-4 (with hotel point value of 180k), (ii) Old Cat 7 (210k) to New Cat 5 (240k), (iii) Old Cat 9 (270k) to New Cat 6 (360k), and (iv) T1-3 (300k) to New Cat 6 (360k).
4. The complaints come from people who were looking to maximize value. I think Marriott can live with that. "I paid 300k points for 360k points in value, but someone else paid 270k points to get the same deal." Marriott can legitimately say "We were generous to both of you. The certificate Old Cat 8s were given costs 60k more than the certificate they had. We were more generous to someone else. So what?"
5. To those who do not think it is "fair" to use peak pricing, there is no basis for the complaint. As of today (and as announced for some time), new travel packages are based on peak pricing. Old certificates are being converted to new certificates. The peak pricing is consistently applied.
6. Outrage really shouldn't be directed at Marriott but at bloggers who fueled unreasonable expectations. All the gamblers knew that, as mentioned in point 1, the speculation that turned out to be true was that windfalls were to be had, which explains the timing of the announcement. Had people been on the right side of the gamble, they would have understood the reason for and excused the timing. The speculation that was proved fantasy (and unreasonable, in my opinion, to begin with) was to promote "Old Cat 7 equals New Cat 7" or baseless "C-2" theories.
Has there been any announcement as to how attached certificates for subsequently cancelled reservations will be handled?
2. The casual Marriott member who was not looking to how to game the system sees absolutely no loss across the board. None lost value. Some received windfalls.
3. The windfalls were: (i) Old Cat 1-5 (with hotel point value of 150k) being bumped to New Cat 1-4 (with hotel point value of 180k), (ii) Old Cat 7 (210k) to New Cat 5 (240k), (iii) Old Cat 9 (270k) to New Cat 6 (360k), and (iv) T1-3 (300k) to New Cat 6 (360k).
4. The complaints come from people who were looking to maximize value. I think Marriott can live with that. "I paid 300k points for 360k points in value, but someone else paid 270k points to get the same deal." Marriott can legitimately say "We were generous to both of you. The certificate Old Cat 8s were given costs 60k more than the certificate they had. We were more generous to someone else. So what?"
5. To those who do not think it is "fair" to use peak pricing, there is no basis for the complaint. As of today (and as announced for some time), new travel packages are based on peak pricing. Old certificates are being converted to new certificates. The peak pricing is consistently applied.
6. Outrage really shouldn't be directed at Marriott but at bloggers who fueled unreasonable expectations. All the gamblers knew that, as mentioned in point 1, the speculation that turned out to be true was that windfalls were to be had, which explains the timing of the announcement. Had people been on the right side of the gamble, they would have understood the reason for and excused the timing. The speculation that was proved fantasy (and unreasonable, in my opinion, to begin with) was to promote "Old Cat 7 equals New Cat 7" or baseless "C-2" theories.
Has there been any announcement as to how attached certificates for subsequently cancelled reservations will be handled?
Aug 18, 2018, 7:11 pm
#5650
Moderator: Chase Ultimate Rewards
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: SFO
Programs: UA 2P, MR LT Plat, IHG Plat, BW Dia, HH Au, Avis PC
Posts: 5,452
I look forward to Marriott refunding the 30k points I wasted on a Cat 6 cert. Or bumping it up to new Cat 5 so it's useful.
...they would never be so underhanded as to intentionally leave their most loyal customers with such a negative impression, right? Because that would be foolish in the middle of a merger that already has so may people grumbling... and Marriott leadership is not short-sighted, is it? ...........
EDIT: In fact, I personally think the conversion chart is logically fair for the most part, but as so many on FT demonstrate every day, loyalty has an emotional component as well...
...they would never be so underhanded as to intentionally leave their most loyal customers with such a negative impression, right? Because that would be foolish in the middle of a merger that already has so may people grumbling... and Marriott leadership is not short-sighted, is it? ...........
EDIT: In fact, I personally think the conversion chart is logically fair for the most part, but as so many on FT demonstrate every day, loyalty has an emotional component as well...
Aug 18, 2018, 7:12 pm
#5651
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: SNA/LAX
Programs: Hertz PC, Hilton DMD, IHG Spire Amb, Bonvoy Titanium Elite & WoH Globalist
Posts: 8,076
Glad that I kept all my TPs at 1-5 category. The hotels I have in mind migrated from category 5 to 3 and 4 respectively in the new program, meaning no-loss and no-gain here but 14 nights at my favorite hotels. 
Aug 18, 2018, 7:16 pm
#5652
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: a hotel room, somewhere...
Posts: 962
The MAJOR unfairness is Marriott is using PEAK pricing on the conversion table when peak pricing is not even in effect until early 2019. Those who intend to use their certs THIS YEAR could have spent 30K LESS for their hotels if Marriott is forthcoming in its communication to their members.
The whole handling has one goal in mind - to create the most breakage and to reduce as much as possible the liability of carrying the redemption value, at the least cost possible, regardless how the members are screwed now that we have so many properties, many would have no choice but still stay at our properties. This is it.
The whole handling has one goal in mind - to create the most breakage and to reduce as much as possible the liability of carrying the redemption value, at the least cost possible, regardless how the members are screwed now that we have so many properties, many would have no choice but still stay at our properties. This is it.
this is our future. us spg people knew from the start. it's like the app and website. marriott thinks they 'marriott way' is the right way even when confronted with overwhelming facts to the contrary. the hubris to throw away a very good spg app that is light years ahead of the marriott app; simply because 'it's marriott. it's better' mentality. you can't even book a room in the app ffs! i can have a room booked within 30 seconds of launching the spg app. same with the desktop sites.
3 levels of platinum where the new criteria to be platinum makes everyone platinum. even if the upgrade verbiage changes back- it's the hilton problem of when everyone is diamond, nobody is. i'd posit that marriott is quite fine with that. they know we have nowhere else to go- and THAT is exactly why they bought starwood. hotels are the new airlines...
Aug 18, 2018, 7:22 pm
#5653
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 49
I have one attched for next Jan trip. It was cat 8 and will be cat 6 later. Do I need to worry about it?
Aug 18, 2018, 7:23 pm
#5654
Join Date: Aug 2018
Posts: 2
docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/18FzZIgto3Ms8CrV3caJOpuhbMFIiWtcYldO5Uon31ec
Aug 18, 2018, 7:23 pm
#5655
Suspended
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Watchlisted by the prejudiced, en route to purgatory
Programs: Just Say No to Fleecing and Blacklisting
Posts: 102,095
This is a disgrace, do you think after all the backlash marriott will reconsider.
If marriott sticks to this I will do everything in my power to avoid all marriott properties going forward.
Between the outright lies about the suite upgrades to this bait and switch, I really hope they get crushed in earning this upcoming year. The choices we make with our wallets are the best way to show them.
If marriott sticks to this I will do everything in my power to avoid all marriott properties going forward.
Between the outright lies about the suite upgrades to this bait and switch, I really hope they get crushed in earning this upcoming year. The choices we make with our wallets are the best way to show them.
I am not surprised by this approach by Marriott, dislike it as I do.
Marriott could announce some customer-friendly adjustments, but I’m not holding my breath waitiing for that when it comes to the TPs. Customers are lambs for fleecing or slaughter in the current marketplace, and Marriott is going to do what it can under the market conditions applicable at the time.
Last edited by GUWonder; Aug 18, 2018 at 7:36 pm