dalm

I just came across this...don't know if it's been mentioned.....

"Cruise Awards — Redeem points for the cruise of your choice.
Reward Points Details
US $250 Cruise Certificate 70,000 View
US $500 Cruise Certificate 110,000 View
US $1000 Cruise Certificate 145,000* View



*Please note that beginning on August 1, 2012, the points needed for a $1,000 Cruise Certificate will increase from 145,000 to 190,000."

rcross23

Just terrible... I really wish Marriott would stop devaluing their points. Unfortunately I don't have much of a choice re: where I stay on business, but they are surely losing clientele at a rapid pace.

aaupgrade

They must be replacing them with clientele willing to pay more as REVPAR has been up over that past couple years and also the most recent quarter.

From a personal perspective, using points for cruises has never been a good return. Even $1000 for 145,000 points only yields 0.68˘ per point.

I personally won't use points unless I get a return of 1.5˘ per point or better. Now I pay for all of my stays personally, so I have to pick and choose which ones earn points and which ones burn points.

For those that do a lot of business travel, they are very lucky to earn not only a salary from their employer but also hundreds of thousands of MR points and airline miles as a result of business travel. Their threshold for use may be a lot lower. I have a friend who does a lot of business travel never pays for hotel rooms or airfare for personal trips. A luxury that just doesn't exist for me.

So for those like me, they would probably never be interested in the cruise certificate offers as it doesn't give a good return. For those at the other end of the spectrum, it just doesn't matter because they earn more points each year than they use.

For those in between, you will need to find your own comfort zone, and I would recommend it be somewhere closer to 1.5˘ per point. Keep in mind that I do a lot of leisure travel to places where $400-600/nt hotels are not uncommon (Europe/Hong Kong) which are great places to use points at a rate of 1.5˘ per point or better. Others may be at a point in their life where 1˘ per point might be a more realistic target considering their travel desires. Bottom line is budget them out and determine where the best places to pay cash or use points are.

I have friends that just started in MR. We are all going on an RTW trip and we have already determined that Hong Kong JW and Rome Grand Flora are the two places to use points as that will give us the best return on our points and we will pay for the other hotels on our trip to earn the points for those stays. About $6000 in savings for each of us by using our points wisely. This is using about 300000 points, which we could have gotten 2 $1000 cruise certificates for instead.

JMHO

apodo77

LOL at people leaving MR in droves over a cruise voucher.

A voucher that isn't even a good spend of your miles.

Sometimes I really wonder what people expect from MR.

DJ_Iceman

The old cruise awards, direct with selected cruise lines, were an amazing redemption value. In fact, when they replaced them with these new vouchers through the cruise consolidator site, I wrote to MR with a direct comparison of how me getting the same value would now require a full million more points than it did under the old program. I actually got a phone call back from a rep who said she was impressed with my analysis and shocked at the change, but that she doubted it would be enough to force a change. The cruise consolidator was basically forcing Marriott to abandon their relationships with cruise lines directly, and for whatever reason Marriott had chosen that path for their future cruise redemptions.

dalm

Very interesting information...how long ago were Marriott points so valuable for cruises?

Mort

Well, I'm one who will now change my spending pattern with Marriott.

Believe it or not, I switched from Hilton a few years back because they jacked up their cruise redemption rates. Marriott's were fairly reasonable. (I've never cared much about the exact cents-per-point rates; I base my redemption decisions primarily on enjoyment levels).

But a 30% increase in the points for a $1,000 voucher is just too much for me. So I'll go back to using Hilton more often and I'll cut way back on using my Marriott Visa. I'll switch to other cards.

apodo77

OK we got one. Anyone else leaving in droves?

rcross23

Nobody is leaving in droves SPECIFICALLY because of this cruise voucher - other than Mort, I guess. The point is that Marriott is continuously de-valuing their points. From increasing hotel categories, to discontinuing the all-inclusives, and now this, it just shows that Marriott is valuing their repeat customers less and less. This is a bad trend and if it continues, then yes, they are going to lose a lot of their loyal business travelers. Its a pretty simple concept really.

SkiAdcock

This.

Cheers.

aaupgrade

Why isn't anyone complaining about the massive increase in cost of rooms? Is it because none of you pay for rooms with money out of your own pocket? Sure, get irate because points for a cruise cert goes up, but squat is said about the meteoric rise in room rates. Am I missing something?

rcross23

I think you hit the nail on the head here... There seem to be a lot of consultants and accountants on these forums, amongst other professions, where the business travel is reimbursed. Personally, about 99% of my business travel is reimbursed to me; there are only rare instances where I have to pay out-of-pocket for a hotel room. Therefore, while I am price conscious, in that we always look for the cheapest decent hotel in the area, we are not necessarily price sensitive. The job still has to get done, and the client is paying for the hotel, so we are going to stay where we have to stay. Now I have only been travelling extensively for about a year and a half so I don't know that I have really observed a large increase in price changes, but I know you have stated that you pay for pretty much all of your travel, so you are obviously going to be more in touch with such price changes, as you are surely more price sensitive than a lot of us are.

As I mentioned above, it isn't just the points for a cruise cert that people are getting upset about, it's a combination of the devaluation of points re: all-inclusive, raising hotel categories, etc. It will eventually get to the point where it just makes a lot more sense to stay at a Hilton than a Marriott, especially when you combine these devaluations with the price increases you mentioned.

aaupgrade

The same thing happens at the other brands. Hotels change categories every year. That is nothing new. Some go up and some go down. This past year boat load of MR properties went from cat 4 to cat 5 because of all the cat 4 certs that were handed out from promos. FWIW, if you or anyone else new to MR and this forum hasn't stumbled onto this before, at Marriott category level is determined solely by award stay demand. I am sure many of those new cat 5s will drop to cat 4s in two years after all the cat 4 cert reservations made prior to the cat change are honored.

I agree that there are a number of benefits that have been withdrawn or devalued, but none have yet affected me as the best return on points is and always has been for hotel stays. I usually use points for cat 7 and 8 properties (I am at a stage in my life that I enjoy luxury), and in rare cases cat 6 - think Thailand, but for me usually rates are too good to justify using points. So with 7 and 8 props, the cat 8s aren't going up in value (yet) and while cat 7s might it is the nature of the business. Just like hotel room rates going up. I am really not that angry about hotel rates increasing, just surprised at those that are so upset about point inflation don't express the same disdain about price increases.

I figure sometime in the late 2010s we may see another major devaluation of the MR rewards program depending on the economy and other factors. I see an increase in number of points needed for stays and the addition of a new cat 9 level, much like the new cat 8 level was added back in Jan 2009 in conjunction with the last major devaluation. Fortunately competition will temper their desire to do this sooner. After all the last major MR devaluation happen a year after SPG and Hilton increased the points for their awards. People were leaving SPG and Hilton for Marriott back then. Life's a moving target and so are FS/FF programs. Just ask the UA 1Ks going to AA as EXP.

DJ_Iceman

I forget exactly when the change occurred--3-4 years ago, I think.

SiberianTiger

still it's bad that they the devaluation of Marriott is escatated