This is an interesting illustration. What occurred to me though was the question of how many Platinum/Titanium elites habitually book anything other than the cheapest room either with cash or points - the Deluxe room in your illustration. Certainly, I only ever choose the cheapest room when booking on marriott.com. I'm generally either alone or with the better half so we don't actually need the space of a suite and wouldn't consider splashing the cash on one. I am invariably upgraded and mostly to suites but this is highly dependent on the location. Thailand and Malaysia are pretty reliable for suites. Singapore and Hong Kong not so much but you'll get a better room.

I wonder if there'a any data on which room categories Platinum or higher guests tend to book vs non-Bonvoy guests. My instinct is that we would tend to book the cheapest rooms with the expectation of some sort of upgrade. We make up for this lower revenue by staying 50 nights or more though of course that revenue is not all accrued by the individual hotel that's trying to make a business case out of upgrading you. On the other hand, non-Bonvoy guests probably booked through an OTA and (should) have no expectation of an upgrade so may book a greater proportion of higher room categories because they actually want those better rooms though the hotel will have to pay the OTA commission so non-Bonvoy guests may not end up bringing in more revenue even if the data shows they tend to book higher room categories.

Back to your illustration: if the majority of Bonvoy Platinum or higher elites are all booking the Deluxe room then - without getting into the specifics of an individual hotel's room inventory - clearly they are not all going to get the Junior Suite and the hotel must come up with its own SOP to prioritise upgrades among the elite guests when they check in otherwise it's a nightmare for the front desk staff every day. It's that SOP that's a black box to us paying guests and I imagine it's highly dependent upon the attitude of the GM who signs off on policies on these things - hence why hotels in the Marriott portfolio are so variable on this and we enjoy discussing the issue so much on FT. One thing I know: if you're a frequent elite guest at a hotel then this criteria certainly increases your chances of a suite over the other Bonvoy elites. I have very reliable data to prove this from Le Meridien Bangkok where I'm upgraded on the app within days of making a reservation sometimes months in advance.

do you remember the name of this thread? I did some searching but couldn’t seem to pin it down.

An update:

I decided to email Bonvoy with the screenshots and let them know that I was not pleased.

They let me know that the reason the suites are still available are that they are “pre-allocated” to 2 Ambassadors that will be checking in, but are not “pre-assigned,” so that a cash booking or upgrade booking could still get the suite.

They agreed the way the hotel handled it was not optimal and asked the hotel to reach out to me with a gesture of good faith.

The hotel emailed me and let me know they are adding a $150 F&B credit to my reservation.

As much as I would love the suite, I respect the hierarchy of benefits and know the ambassadors have earned those suites. The explanation satisfies me. And the F&B credit is a nice bonus!

It's great that CS gave you a full explanation. Platinum doesn't appear to be all that rare these days and with the higher tiers on top too it's probably not worth getting too worked up about stuff like this. It's always far more likely that there are a bunch of others ahead of you in the queue than to be some sort of penny pinching, benefits avoiding, conspiracy type anti-plat plot. On that basis, I'd say $150 is a pretty big win. I wouldn't have expected anything. Enjoy it.

yeah I overreacted, but it’s the only time I’ve sent a marriott CS email in my whole Bonvoy career, so not a horrible track record 😂

I will be Titanium next year, so maybe that will translate to more upgrades.

yes I am quite pleased about the $150

I can only speak for my experiences. I am generally upgraded to a suite. I generally don't consider anything else to be an upgrade. Generally, my travels take me to major markets with lots of hotels, both Marriott and others. This often incents the hotel to treat their guests well as the guests have options. For example, I love the Westin Bonaventure in Los Angeles. It competes with dozens of other hotels. Accordingly, it treats its guests well. By contrast, the Sheraton in Greensboro treats its elite guests like crap. I've been going there since 2004 and I have yet to receive a pre-assigned upgrade, even when the parking lot is empty. It happens to be one of the only two or three full-service Marriotts in the entire city. There are no Hiltons or Hyatts. It's also a convention hotel. The lounge breakfast is devoid of any hot food, full of cheap sugary snacks. They know that there is little competition and they act accordingly.

The other thing is that I will ask for what I want. Initially, it annoyed me that I had to ask for an upgrade. Then I thought about it from the hotel's perspective. Given a limited number of upgrades, the squeaky wheel gets the grease. Be the squeaky wheel. What pisses me off is when I ask the FDC for a suite upgrade and they tell me "You've been upgraded to a nice room". This means I didn't get a suite and they are hoping I don't notice the verbal legerdemain.

• Me: Did I get a suite?
• FDC; You've been upgraded to one of our nicest rooms
• ME: Thanks, but is it a suite?
• FDC: It's a really nice room.
• Me. Since you're not answering my question directly, I can only assume it's not a suite.
• FDC: It's a corner room on the top floor.
• Me: Thanks, but I'd like the one-bedroom suite please?
• FDC: Checks and reluctantly upgrade me to the suite.

I posted one here (#111).

https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/marr...-thread-8.html

IME, Asian, some European, and Middle Eastern hotels usually complies with upgrade benefit without issue.
These hotels usually value repeat customer even better.

Some hotels in Asia that somehow try to skimp on elite benefits usually doesn't care about their frequent guests as well.


As for booking category, I wouldn't surprised if majority of elites book the cheapest room for their stays.
As Bonvoy tier qualification system didn't provide incentive for elites to book higher category room.
(The spending become more relevant when someone try to reach ambassador tier though)
A $50/night Moxy room and $2k Al Maha tent both give us the same 1 night credit.
The pattern might change if Bonvoy use spending as alternative qualification.

Also if elite book higher category room, I would say their upgrade chance is actually decrease. The suite upgrade chance however, might increase marginally.

I'm Platinum and received this from the Marriott (former Le Meridien) Chiang Mai: As a sincere gesture since we may not be able to upgrade your room to a suite may we request you to choose any one from the following amenities listed below for this stay. Please let us know your selection for our preparation by simply replying to this email.

• 2,500 Bonus Points per stay.

• Hotel Credit value of THB 500 net per stay.

• Complimentary a bottle of house wine (red / white) per stay.

• Complimentary 4 bottles of local beer per stay.

I know they had no obligation to upgrade me. I picked the hotel credit.

Some things to keep in mind:

- Many elites become elites from business travel on corporate rates. Corporate rates are generally below the member rate and/or convey additional benefits that cost the hotel money or diminish their incremental revenue opportunities (cancellation fees, parking, breakfast in restaurant, etc). Yet, despite that, hotels may want to woo these guests more than full-rate guests because they can rely on these guests to fill rooms year-round (incl. off-peak travel seasons when tourists are all gone) and they want you to return / tell your colleagues to stay there / effevt any control you have over corporate travel and spending to make this property the preferred property over others for people in your company. Putting you in a suite over a full-rate tourist who won't be returning in the next 5 years may be much more prudent for the property if it means you or your colleagues may return again in 6 months when the property is in low occupancy.

- There is definitely diminishing upgrade opportunity the higher the room category that you originally book, as potential inventory for upgrades decreases. This is especially true if you pay for a suite, since bigger or more premium suites are almost certainly not in the standard upgrade pool and upgrades are only likely in special circumstances (e.g., they overbooked standard suites, you have a strong relationship with the property so the manager gives you a special presidential suite surprise, etc).

- There are some hotels that limit available upgrades based on your initial room booking, e.g., if you book a room in the cheaper tower, you cannot be upgraded to any of the suites as they are all in the nicer tower, etc. This is fairly rare approach though.

- In practice, most hotels either arrange upgrades in advance (usually the night before or morning of arrival) or at check-in. Post-COVID, my experience has been that more hotels are moving to the latter approach. When they arrange upgrades in advance, they can prioritize based on status, loyalty to the specific property, loyalty of your company to the property, your rate, desire to attract your repeat business, special occasions being celebrated, etc, in whatever relative ranking or order of priority the property wishes to prioritize such factors, if at all. In contrast, for upgrades at check-in, it's not uncommon for any priority of factors to be thrown out the window and it can instead come down to a binary "are they eligible for a free upgrade? if yes, see what's available", your time of arrival relative to which rooms are ready, whether the front desk agent is in a good mood / has time to search for upgrades vs has a long line behind you / personally likes you and wants to find you a nice upgrade / is well-trained and experienced vs under-trained new hire or intern uncomfortable changing the automatically assigned room, and whether you're a squeaky wheel asking for a suite upgrade vs happy taking whatever they give you. At many properties, it is certainly possible for an Ambassador member who overpaid a last minute rate for their room to forgo a suite upgrade because a platinum member paying a discounted rate arrived 5 minutes earlier and explicitly asked if any suite was available. That's the downside (for higher tier elites) and upside (for lower level elites) of a "we assign the best available room in the upgrade pool at time of physical check-in" policy. Some hotels with such a policy still proactively block upgraded rooms for Ambassadors, some for Titaniums too, but some do not.

- Different hotels, based on geography, business vs liesure market, time of year, etc, will see a different mix of status levels and room booking trends and their policies and procedures around upgrades will reflect that. For example, many properties in Asia rely on local families booking suites for weekend staycations (stay near the city centre, get restaurant breakfast, lounge dinner, shop or sightsee, visit family, etc), so a stay that includes a weekend may make it hard to upgrade as the hotel predicts selling the suite. While an airport property may generate tons of revenue from last-minute flight cancellations and thus be unable to predict occupancy levels and hesitant to give away a suite that may get booked at a last-minute exorbitant price by a desperate family or someone with good travel insurance. Other properties may have occupancy levels that can be predicted in advance leading to greater comfort giving out upgrades.

- For me, I've never noticed any increase in upgrades from booking more premium rooms in advance. The standard upgrade has almost always been to an executive room floor or suite, regardless of what I originally booked. There's only been a handful of times I've gotten a less premium room upgrade, mostly in the USA (Sheraton Orlando Lake Buena Vista to a regular room with a "pool-side view" that wasn't even cleaned by housekeeping before being assigned (subject of another FT post), Marriott Washington DC to a corner room), during a 9-month stint as a lowly Platinum after taking a Bonvoy break (Singapore Sheraton Towers gave only one-category upgrade to a "business traveller room" aka a room with a desk and single apple (??)), or during high occupancy (e.g., Sydney Sheraton Grand to a "deluxe" but otherwise standard room). Of course "better room" can be subjective; sometimes the standard rooms are tiny and a corner room is better than any non-suite rooms, other times the views are breathtaking up on the executive floor or its rooms are bigger or it offers better amenities or you value the proximity to the lounge due to the amount of work you have done and the need to stay caffeinated.

- Arguably, the much bigger factor than room rate is simply length of stay. Not only does a longer stay run the risk of the upgraded room being booked for part of your stay and thus unavailable, the hotel would often rather upgrade two people each staying 3 nights (hoping they enjoy their stay and return for longer) versus upgrading you for the full 6 nights. I find upgrades are much much much easier if you are staying just 1-3 nights.

- Some properties employ a "we prioritize upgrades for those redeeming points, since it suggests they actually stay a lot and are very loyal to Marriott Bonvoy" and others do explicitly prioritize those on cash rates, though of course there can be a disconnect between policy on paper and in practice; see above.

- One thing I've heard is that hotel staff can sometimes see significant information about your travels through their software, in addition to any research hotel staff may do outside of the Marriott systems. While chatting, I had one duty manager tell me a couple months ago that he could see I travel a lot, that I wasn't one of those people who gets status from credit cards but actually spending a lot of nights in hotels, and that he knew I had been away from home for a few weeks and was going to X hotel next (in another country and a different brand), which he informed me had poached some staff from this property to prepare for its opening, and that he would love to hear my feedback based on my perspectives, etc. I had a lounge manager at another property on a different continent, who recognizes my face and greets me by name every time I return to the property, tell me she knew "everything about me" after I mentioned something about my travel plans. I've also seen front office managers and GMs view me on LinkedIn, and at least one property found a photo of me to circulate to staff before I checked in so that I could be greeted by name by the concierge in the lobby and front desk (yes, a bit creepy to get off a public bus, wheel in your own luggage up to the reception floor, talk to noone, yet strangers come approaching you calling you by name). Suffice it to say, some hotels do research on arriving guests and what they find out may affect how you are treated, which certainly carries over to upgrade chances, welcome amenities, and personalized treatment beyond simply looking at status. Of course, few hotels will ever bother spending time doing that, though we may see a rise in it as status increasingly ceases to be a litmus test for "frequent travellers who may bring good repeat business to the hotel" and a deeper look into guest profiles is required for hotels to figure out which guests they most want to woo to help drive their business (e.g., one FOM came out to make small talk before asking where I worked and openly wondered why they didn't yet have a corp rate to get more of my colleagues to stay in the future...)

- As with anything Marriott Bonvoy, the only consistency is inconsistency. Sometimes it plays to your advantage. Sometimes you get flagrant T&C violations. The best way to increase the chances of a good upgrade is to review reccomrndations from other frequent travellers to find hotels that still value elites and give them your business. Don't reward properties that want the upside of being part of the program (e.g., steady traffic, marketing, loyalty from members) but not the downsides (e.g., the costs of providing program benefits that drive such blind loyalty).

- Don't shy away from cheating on Marriott with other programs. It's OK to forgo your 1000 bonus points and 1 EQN to pay less money and have a more pleasurable stay at a non-Bonvoy property if it's better than the Bonvoy options. Maybe try a status match or get CC status in a competitor chain and feel them out. Ignore the sunk cost fallacy. Life is too short to be chained down to a hotel chain of all things. It's not too late to become a Hilton or Hyatt guy/gal. Hyatt lets you upgrade an entire 7 night stay to a suite at time of booking with a single upgrade certificate? Maybe give up on Bonvoy's SNAs/NUAs that expire having never cleared all year and give Hyatt a chance to impress instead?

- If a hotel flagrantly violates T&Cs, or just doesn't want to welcome elites, let others know so they don't make the same mistake. FT, Marriott website reviews, facebook elite member groups, google reviews, etc.

Caveat: my experience is almost entirely at properties outside North America, particularly Asia and Europe, but also Ocenia, South America, Africa, and the Middle East, in that order.

It’s an old story ….and always the same.

Based on my experience at highest level with Accor, IHG and Marriott, Marriot is by far the most generous chain when it comes to upgrade, both on cash and points stays, on week days and weekend, starting from Asia and in Europe as well

USA are a world apart in this business of (un)hospitality

first underlined: yes. the spirit of the rules is clear. while there is sufficient room in the wording to get out of the responsibility, thats the bad faith move. No one likes dealing with those who act in bad faith

second underlined: this statement implies that status doesnt cost the members anything. is there a cost to the property? *maybe* (if we are talking about potential lost revenue, not tangential costs, like increased housekeeping costs to clean a suite vs a room). But your business model is to generate profit under the umbrella of the marriott network. That means consideration of guests is part of delivering value to shareholders. Branding your property has costs associated with it, and the loyalty program is one of them. either pay the costs, or reflag to hilton.

it sucks that the loyalty game has become confrontational when it ought to be viewed as mutually beneficial.

I'd also argue that some hotels clearly forget or simply do not acknowledge that in many cases the only reason a guest has booked with them is because of the Bonvoy affiliation and the expectation of value from the delivery of elite benefits. Without the elite benefits delivered in good faith the guest can have no reason to book with an individual hotel in the Marriott portfolio. The only over-riding reason I can think of would be to get the EQN if the guest specifically needs it. This can be the case for non-Lifetime members approaching 50 or 75 nights in the year doing an organic stay or those doing mattress runs to achieve the same 50 or 75 nights by year end.

But the points and badly-delivered elite benefits can easily be offset by the cash savings from staying at an alternative non-branded or local hotel and this is what shady Bonvoy hotels are ignoring. It's also what many Bonvoy members ignore and I'd historically include myself in this lazy group because I've unthinkingly booked Bonvoy hotels many times in the past without even considering alternatives and have had a few poor experiences as a result despite living in Asia where everything is milk and honey of course.

It goes back to the point made by Nazdoom : don't shy away from cheating on Marriott and at the root of this advice must be to do some basic research on whether the hotel honours elite benefits to a sufficient extent and if not then save the money and stay somewhere else at a local brand. We just did this in Bali where we paid less at the Trans Resort (no, not that) with its club lounge and two hours of free flow booze than we would have staying at the Courtyard in Seminyak despite our Titanium status. Significantly better quality resort with lounge benefits on top.