So What Is Happening To The Towneplace Suites Hotels Built In The 90's & Early 2000's
Sep 9, 2021, 11:13 am
#1
formerly Will Stonehocker
Original Poster
Join Date: Nov 2017
Posts: 587
So What Is Happening To The Towneplace Suites Hotels Built In The 90's & Early 2000's
I noticed a lot of the Towneplace Suites that were built in the 90's and early 2000's no longer carry the Marriott name in favor of something like Sonesta or Hawthorn (this includes the very first Towneplace Suites from Newsport News Virginia). What appears to be the reason?
Sep 9, 2021, 1:33 pm
#2
Join Date: Oct 2014
Programs: IHG Spire, Marriott
Posts: 574
Marriott updating their franchising fees and brand standard.
Eg. Room corridors must now be indoor/have controlled access for better security.
Rooms must be refreshed every X years.
Property owners probably thought reflagging was a better option due to physical limitations or budget.
Eg. Room corridors must now be indoor/have controlled access for better security.
Rooms must be refreshed every X years.
Property owners probably thought reflagging was a better option due to physical limitations or budget.
Last edited by miloworld; Sep 9, 2021 at 1:38 pm
Sep 9, 2021, 3:21 pm
#3
formerly Will Stonehocker
Original Poster
Join Date: Nov 2017
Posts: 587
Marriott updating their franchising fees and brand standard.
Eg. Room corridors must now be indoor/have controlled access for better security.
Rooms must be refreshed every X years.
Property owners probably thought reflagging was a better option due to physical limitations or budget.
Eg. Room corridors must now be indoor/have controlled access for better security.
Rooms must be refreshed every X years.
Property owners probably thought reflagging was a better option due to physical limitations or budget.
Sep 9, 2021, 3:32 pm
#4
Join Date: Jul 1999
Programs: QF WP, AA EXP
Posts: 3,520
Sep 12, 2021, 7:05 am
#5
Join Date: Aug 2020
Location: Somewhere in the Mid-Atlantic
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The actual correct article is this one:
Marriott Loses 122 Properties in $11 Million Default on Payments | Frequent Business Traveler
What is interesting about this is that a lot of the properties involved were corporately managed. I only know this because one the RI locations that has since become a Sonesta ES is one that I worked at many, many years ago. When it was built Marriott had a 25 year management contract to run it. In all honesty, most of the properties were no big loss to the company as they were primarily 20-25+ year old places that look nothing like what is being built now and the few that I've seen or stayed at are very dated. Sonesta had been rebranding old Gen 1-3 RI locations to Sonesta ES properties for quite a few years prior to this. First one I can think of is the Sonesta ES in Somers Point NJ. That location got changed ??, 7-8 years ago. Same as one or two in the Harrisburg, PA area that went back to the original group that Marriott bought into in '87.
Marriott Loses 122 Properties in $11 Million Default on Payments | Frequent Business Traveler
What is interesting about this is that a lot of the properties involved were corporately managed. I only know this because one the RI locations that has since become a Sonesta ES is one that I worked at many, many years ago. When it was built Marriott had a 25 year management contract to run it. In all honesty, most of the properties were no big loss to the company as they were primarily 20-25+ year old places that look nothing like what is being built now and the few that I've seen or stayed at are very dated. Sonesta had been rebranding old Gen 1-3 RI locations to Sonesta ES properties for quite a few years prior to this. First one I can think of is the Sonesta ES in Somers Point NJ. That location got changed ??, 7-8 years ago. Same as one or two in the Harrisburg, PA area that went back to the original group that Marriott bought into in '87.
Sep 13, 2021, 2:42 pm
#6
formerly Will Stonehocker
Original Poster
Join Date: Nov 2017
Posts: 587
The actual correct article is this one:
Marriott Loses 122 Properties in $11 Million Default on Payments | Frequent Business Traveler
What is interesting about this is that a lot of the properties involved were corporately managed. I only know this because one the RI locations that has since become a Sonesta ES is one that I worked at many, many years ago. When it was built Marriott had a 25 year management contract to run it. In all honesty, most of the properties were no big loss to the company as they were primarily 20-25+ year old places that look nothing like what is being built now and the few that I've seen or stayed at are very dated. Sonesta had been rebranding old Gen 1-3 RI locations to Sonesta ES properties for quite a few years prior to this. First one I can think of is the Sonesta ES in Somers Point NJ. That location got changed ??, 7-8 years ago. Same as one or two in the Harrisburg, PA area that went back to the original group that Marriott bought into in '87.
Marriott Loses 122 Properties in $11 Million Default on Payments | Frequent Business Traveler
What is interesting about this is that a lot of the properties involved were corporately managed. I only know this because one the RI locations that has since become a Sonesta ES is one that I worked at many, many years ago. When it was built Marriott had a 25 year management contract to run it. In all honesty, most of the properties were no big loss to the company as they were primarily 20-25+ year old places that look nothing like what is being built now and the few that I've seen or stayed at are very dated. Sonesta had been rebranding old Gen 1-3 RI locations to Sonesta ES properties for quite a few years prior to this. First one I can think of is the Sonesta ES in Somers Point NJ. That location got changed ??, 7-8 years ago. Same as one or two in the Harrisburg, PA area that went back to the original group that Marriott bought into in '87.
Sep 14, 2021, 4:15 am
#7
Join Date: Aug 2010
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Sep 14, 2021, 8:41 am
#8
Join Date: May 2002
Programs: AAdvantage Platinum, United Silver, Marriott Titanium Elite
Posts: 2,273
I noticed a lot of the Towneplace Suites that were built in the 90's and early 2000's no longer carry the Marriott name in favor of something like Sonesta or Hawthorn (this includes the very first Towneplace Suites from Newsport News Virginia). What appears to be the reason?
When a franchise agreement is up for renewal, the owner can make a business decision to go with a different brand (or with no major brand at all). Perhaps an owner sees savings going with a brand with lower standards (lower costs) or lower fees (again lower costs). A different owner might make the business decision to continue with a Marriott brand, with the opportunity to achieve higher rates and higher occupancy.
In the case of properties owned by Service Properties Trust (SVC), with a 34% stake in Sonesta, it's a bit different. SVC used a legal maneuver to walk away from a bunch of IHG and Marriott contracts. SVC made the business decision to build up Sonesta's brands, including Sonesta Simply Suites and Sonesta ES Suites. It remains to be seen if the traveling public will embrace Sonesta's brands. Maybe, this will turn out to be a good business decision on the part of SVC. Or maybe not.
Last edited by Horace; Sep 17, 2021 at 8:08 pm
Sep 17, 2021, 7:22 pm
#9
formerly Will Stonehocker
Original Poster
Join Date: Nov 2017
Posts: 587
The reason for the reflagging of some older Towneplace Suites properties is the same as for any other Marriott brand. The properties are franchises. They are not owned by Marriott. The owner wants to maximize profits.
When a franchise agreement is up for renewal, the owner can make a business decision to go with a different brand (or with no major brand at all). Perhaps an owner sees savings going with a brand with lower standards (lower costs) or lower fees (again lower costs). A different owner might make the business decision to continue with a Marriott brand, with the opportunity to achieve higher rates and higher occupancy.
In the case of properties owned by Service Properties Trust (SVC), with a 34% stake in Sonesta, it's a bit different. SVC used a legal maneuver to walk away from a bunch of IHG and Marriott contracts. SVC made the business decision to build up Sonesta's brand's, including Sonesta Simply Suites and Sonesta ES Suites. It remains to be seen if the traveling public will embrace Sonesta's brands. Maybe, this will turn out to be a good business decision on the part of SVC. Or maybe not.
When a franchise agreement is up for renewal, the owner can make a business decision to go with a different brand (or with no major brand at all). Perhaps an owner sees savings going with a brand with lower standards (lower costs) or lower fees (again lower costs). A different owner might make the business decision to continue with a Marriott brand, with the opportunity to achieve higher rates and higher occupancy.
In the case of properties owned by Service Properties Trust (SVC), with a 34% stake in Sonesta, it's a bit different. SVC used a legal maneuver to walk away from a bunch of IHG and Marriott contracts. SVC made the business decision to build up Sonesta's brand's, including Sonesta Simply Suites and Sonesta ES Suites. It remains to be seen if the traveling public will embrace Sonesta's brands. Maybe, this will turn out to be a good business decision on the part of SVC. Or maybe not.
Dec 4, 2021, 2:40 pm
#11
Join Date: May 2002
Programs: AAdvantage Platinum, United Silver, Marriott Titanium Elite
Posts: 2,273
The name Sonesta is an amalgam of the names of founder Abraham M. (“Sonny”) Sonnabend (1896-1964) and his wife Esther Sonnabend.
“Sonny” started the hotel company in 1937. Over the years, he acquired and parted with famous higher-end hotels, including the Plaza in New York. The company called some of its higher-end hotels Sonesta or Royal Sonesta. The company became Sonesta International Hotels Corporation in 1970.
Today, Sonesta, like so many other hotel companies, has a portfolio of brands and hotels that run the gamut from lower-end to higher-end, especially after Service Properties Trust (SVC) rebranded a bunch of former IHG and Marriott properties to various Sonesta brands.
Out of my Element asked an intriguing question.
Would “Sonny” and Esther be proud of have their names on old Towneplace Suites properties?
“Sonny” started the hotel company in 1937. Over the years, he acquired and parted with famous higher-end hotels, including the Plaza in New York. The company called some of its higher-end hotels Sonesta or Royal Sonesta. The company became Sonesta International Hotels Corporation in 1970.
Today, Sonesta, like so many other hotel companies, has a portfolio of brands and hotels that run the gamut from lower-end to higher-end, especially after Service Properties Trust (SVC) rebranded a bunch of former IHG and Marriott properties to various Sonesta brands.
Out of my Element asked an intriguing question.
Would “Sonny” and Esther be proud of have their names on old Towneplace Suites properties?
Last edited by Horace; Dec 4, 2021 at 2:47 pm
Dec 6, 2021, 9:47 am
#12
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: SF Bay Area
Programs: Marriott Bonvoy Ambassador, AA EXP
Posts: 2,700
Marriott updating their franchising fees and brand standard.
Eg. Room corridors must now be indoor/have controlled access for better security.
Rooms must be refreshed every X years.
Property owners probably thought reflagging was a better option due to physical limitations or budget.
Eg. Room corridors must now be indoor/have controlled access for better security.
Rooms must be refreshed every X years.
Property owners probably thought reflagging was a better option due to physical limitations or budget.
https://www.marriott.com/hotels/trav...suites-tucson/
https://www.marriott.com/hotels/trav...ts-pleasanton/
https://www.marriott.com/hotels/trav...design-hotels/
Dec 18, 2021, 1:02 pm
#13
formerly Will Stonehocker
Original Poster
Join Date: Nov 2017
Posts: 587
Because of the indoor coordinator rule, does that mean the following hotels are at risk of being deflagged?
https://www.marriott.com/hotels/trav...suites-tucson/
https://www.marriott.com/hotels/trav...ts-pleasanton/
https://www.marriott.com/hotels/trav...design-hotels/
https://www.marriott.com/hotels/trav...suites-tucson/
https://www.marriott.com/hotels/trav...ts-pleasanton/
https://www.marriott.com/hotels/trav...design-hotels/
Jan 12, 2022, 10:37 am
#14
Join Date: Oct 2014
Programs: IHG Spire, Marriott
Posts: 574
Marriott does benefit from a healthy portfolio, so it could be less strict in areas that are spread thin. I would imagine they make improvement "suggestions", if a property refuses to act upon them, they get the short stick, fines, not advancement in hotel category, lower placement on search, lower reimbursement on point redemptions etc.
indoor corridor probably isn't a definitive requirement. The Fairfield directly across the Disneyland resort esplanade is a Cat 5 and has outdoor corridors overlooking the park. Along with proximity to Disney, you could say it's a highlight of the hotel.
Last edited by miloworld; Jan 12, 2022 at 10:50 am
Mar 7, 2022, 1:26 pm
#15
formerly Will Stonehocker
Original Poster
Join Date: Nov 2017
Posts: 587
I'm not a franchisee so these are just speculation..
Marriott does benefit from a healthy portfolio, so it could be less strict in areas that are spread thin. I would imagine they make improvement "suggestions", if a property refuses to act upon them, they get the short stick, fines, not advancement in hotel category, lower placement on search, lower reimbursement on point redemptions etc.
indoor corridor probably isn't a definitive requirement. The Fairfield directly across the Disneyland resort esplanade is a Cat 5 and has outdoor corridors overlooking the park. Along with proximity to Disney, you could say it's a highlight of the hotel.
Marriott does benefit from a healthy portfolio, so it could be less strict in areas that are spread thin. I would imagine they make improvement "suggestions", if a property refuses to act upon them, they get the short stick, fines, not advancement in hotel category, lower placement on search, lower reimbursement on point redemptions etc.
indoor corridor probably isn't a definitive requirement. The Fairfield directly across the Disneyland resort esplanade is a Cat 5 and has outdoor corridors overlooking the park. Along with proximity to Disney, you could say it's a highlight of the hotel.
