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Customer Service refused to send me to the Loyalty desk

Customer Service refused to send me to the Loyalty desk

Old Apr 7, 2019, 2:07 pm
  #31  
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Originally Posted by Horace
Here's a FlyerTalk thread from 2005 that discuses it, including the lifetime status given to members who joined Marriott Honored Guest (the original name of what became Marriott Rewards and is now Marriott Bonvoy) in 1983: Marriott Lifetime Platinum Elite Credentials Arrived

I joined a year too late — 1984 — so I wasn't gifted the lifetime status for charter members. But it took me only a few years after 2004 to earn Lifetime Gold and then Lifetime Platinum status through whatever the published requirements were at the time.
Obviously, you're still traveling but there can't be many people who joined in 1983 who still regularly stay.

That's 36 years of travel. Even if you were fresh out of school as a junior management consultant, you would be aged 60 or older now. Except for some CEOs and corporate board members, there can't be that many people putting in 75 or 100 nights a year for business above the age of 60. Let alone for 36 consecutive years.
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Old Apr 7, 2019, 2:12 pm
  #32  
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OK, I'll share my memory of Marriott history.

The Marquis program started in 1980. I think there were two subsequent loyalty programs before the current program began in 1985 (so 34 is the max program years for a member). Those of a certain age will remember giving a small card preprinted with an account number each time they checked in, and then later, account numbers that began with CRP.

IMHO, it's unrealistic to expect that Marriott has records back to the early 1980s. Heck, I'm impressed if they have them for the early 1990s.

The assumption that 11 years of Black and Gold equates to 550 nights is flawed. During that period, Marriott was quite generous extending elite status for another year or two if a member did not qualify in a given year.

And I'm also a bit surprised that one's wife apparently was given full access to her husband's account and stay history.
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Old Apr 7, 2019, 2:18 pm
  #33  
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I am not the marketing person who dreamed up "Lifetime Status." My husband and I both have Million Miler Gold Lifetime status with United, whatever that means at any given time. There was a lengthy lawsuit over that definition. Nor am I the one who implied that your Starwood account would be merged with your Marriott account. If Bonvoy wants to redefine nomenclature, it needs to make that clear. I did not expect any past status would confer on my husband, only that lifetime meant all the way back. I question the date Bonvoy has for my husband's start date as he joined the minute any program started up. They say 1985 but it was more likely 1983. They acknowledge that he had, on their record, 11 years of what is now known as Platinum status (1990 to 2000). That is one more than required. Surely, that represents 550 stays. Simple math. They say he has only 561 stays. There is no way that the figure is correct. He retired in 2001 and we have traveled the world for all these years, staying many times at Marriott properties. If they were willing to add up all his stays from 2001 to now and add that to the 550 he surely had in 2001, we would have a deal. But there are layers of who you are allowed to talk to. My beef with the agent was that, despite my trying to explain that Platinum status had different names over time (Black, then Gold, now Platinum), she could not comprehend that. So, my husband's record says he was Gold from 1990 to 2000 which she kept insisting was NOT 50 stays per year. There was no budging her. Then, I find it hard to believe that she was unable to transfer me to a manager or to the loyalty group OR someone who had a better grasp of the program.

Frankly, Bonvoy overextended itself without figuring out what would be entailed for loyal patrons who were with them from the beginning. I think, with my persistence, we will get this settled but not in time for our trip.
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Old Apr 7, 2019, 2:19 pm
  #34  
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Are you sure it was 1980? The AA program started in 1981, which was the first FF program, and my impression is that hotel programs started a little bit later than airline programs. OTOH, the Carlson of Radisson hotels initiated some sundry (mostly focusing on chain grocery stores) frequent shopper rebate and gift programs (gold stamps?) much earlier, probably in the early 1960s.
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Old Apr 7, 2019, 2:26 pm
  #35  
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Originally Posted by Karen2
I am not the marketing person who dreamed up "Lifetime Status." My husband and I both have Million Miler Gold Lifetime status with United, whatever that means at any given time. There was a lengthy lawsuit over that definition. Nor am I the one who implied that your Starwood account would be merged with your Marriott account. If Bonvoy wants to redefine nomenclature, it needs to make that clear. I did not expect any past status would confer on my husband, only that lifetime meant all the way back. I question the date Bonvoy has for my husband's start date as he joined the minute any program started up. They say 1985 but it was more likely 1983. They acknowledge that he had, on their record, 11 years of what is now known as Platinum status (1990 to 2000). That is one more than required. Surely, that represents 550 stays. Simple math. They say he has only 561 stays. There is no way that the figure is correct. He retired in 2001 and we have traveled the world for all these years, staying many times at Marriott properties. If they were willing to add up all his stays from 2001 to now and add that to the 550 he surely had in 2001, we would have a deal. But there are layers of who you are allowed to talk to. My beef with the agent was that, despite my trying to explain that Platinum status had different names over time (Black, then Gold, now Platinum), she could not comprehend that. So, my husband's record says he was Gold from 1990 to 2000 which she kept insisting was NOT 50 stays per year. There was no budging her. Then, I find it hard to believe that she was unable to transfer me to a manager or to the loyalty group OR someone who had a better grasp of the program.

Frankly, Bonvoy overextended itself without figuring out what would be entailed for loyal patrons who were with them from the beginning. I think, with my persistence, we will get this settled but not in time for our trip.
Please be careful about terminology. This might be adding to the difficulty for you.

Marriott counts NIGHTS not STAYS and AFAIK has never counted stays or used them for *regular* elite status (although stays might have been part of the requirements for various status match offers or offers to requalify on a promotional basis).
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Old Apr 7, 2019, 2:37 pm
  #36  
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There's been some discussion of predecessor programs to the Marriott program. The ones I found in the FlyerTalk boneyard are Starwood predecessors.

Sheraton Club International- final post was in 2005

Westin Premier - final post was in 1999

I think both of them had an annual membership fee. I don't believe I joined either.

I am a lifetime member of the Marriott program. I joined it in 1983. I still have the letter from Bill Marriott conferring lifetime platinum elite status.

I know this isn't helpful to the OP, but thought others might find it of interest.
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Old Apr 7, 2019, 3:00 pm
  #37  
 
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Originally Posted by MSPeconomist
Are you sure it was 1980? The AA program started in 1981, which was the first FF program, and my impression is that hotel programs started a little bit later than airline programs. OTOH, the Carlson of Radisson hotels initiated some sundry (mostly focusing on chain grocery stores) frequent shopper rebate and gift programs (gold stamps?) much earlier, probably in the early 1960s.
I found this blog from Marriott online. It says the 25th anniversary of Marriott Rewards was in 2008. So Bill Marriott claims the program started in 1983.

https://www.blogs.marriott.com/marri...t-rewards.html
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Old Apr 7, 2019, 3:05 pm
  #38  
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Originally Posted by Jaunts
I found this blog from Marriott online. It says the 25th anniversary of Marriott Rewards was in 2008. So Bill Marriott claims the program started in 1983.

https://www.blogs.marriott.com/marri...t-rewards.html
That sounds about right to me: 1983, not 1980.
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Old Apr 7, 2019, 3:09 pm
  #39  
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Originally Posted by SanDiego1K
I am a lifetime member of the Marriott program. I joined it in 1983. I still have the letter from Bill Marriott conferring lifetime platinum elite status.
I'd love to see the letter and whether it was conditioned or lifetime was defined. Can you post it?
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Old Apr 7, 2019, 3:10 pm
  #40  
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Originally Posted by Jaunts
I found this blog from Marriott online. It says the 25th anniversary of Marriott Rewards was in 2008. So Bill Marriott claims the program started in 1983.

https://www.blogs.marriott.com/marri...t-rewards.html
So, 36 years. It would be interesting to know how many people from 1983 are still frequent hotel guests.
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Old Apr 7, 2019, 3:17 pm
  #41  
 
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Originally Posted by MSPeconomist
Are you sure it was 1980? The AA program started in 1981, which was the first FF program, and my impression is that hotel programs started a little bit later than airline programs. OTOH, the Carlson of Radisson hotels initiated some sundry (mostly focusing on chain grocery stores) frequent shopper rebate and gift programs (gold stamps?) much earlier, probably in the early 1960s.
I believe Marriott Club Marquis launched in 1981 for guests who stayed at least 5 nights per year at Marriott Hotels. It might have been 1980. Club Marquis provided benefits to these "frequent" guests.There were far fewer Marriott Hotels then. Club Marquis was not a rewards program.

Marriott Honored Guest, the rewards program that allowed guests to earn free nights and other awards, launched in 1983. Its first full year was 1984. (Both of these years are mentioned as the beginning of Marriott Rewards.) I still have my membership card from the 1980s. The membership number is the same as my Marriott Bonvoy account number today.

Here's a 1986 article by Alfred Borcover in the Chicago Tribune about hotel loyalty programs at the time: https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/...600-story.html

The article does not have anything about Westin Hotels (or Western International Hotels as it was called before it became Westin), but you might enjoy what is has about Marriott.
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Old Apr 7, 2019, 3:43 pm
  #42  
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Originally Posted by hockeyinsider
Obviously, you're still traveling but there can't be many people who joined in 1983 who still regularly stay.

That's 36 years of travel. Even if you were fresh out of school as a junior management consultant, you would be aged 60 or older now. Except for some CEOs and corporate board members, there can't be that many people putting in 75 or 100 nights a year for business above the age of 60. Let alone for 36 consecutive years.

60 year olds still traveling? Gasp. What about us OLD people putting in 100 nights a year for leisure? lol
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Old Apr 7, 2019, 3:48 pm
  #43  
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Originally Posted by damon88
60 year olds still traveling? Gasp. What about us OLD people putting in 100 nights a year for leisure? lol
Don't take my comments out of context. You know darn well what I was saying. There can't be that many charter members who have maintained 75 or 100-plus nights year in and year out for 36 years.
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Old Apr 7, 2019, 4:08 pm
  #44  
 
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Originally Posted by txpenny
I'm impressed that you managed to lurk for 7 years before deciding to make your first post.
I'm impressed that I remembered my password!
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Old Apr 7, 2019, 6:06 pm
  #45  
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Originally Posted by MSPeconomist
The AA program started in 1981, which was the first FF program
Some believe that Texas International's frequent flyer program (1979) and Western Airlines' Travel Bank (1980) were first. Both were mileage-based.
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