Peak and off peak Awards (General Discussion)
Aug 15, 2019, 5:58 pm
#91
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: GVA (Greater Vancouver Area)
Programs: DREAD Gold; UA 1.035MM; Bonvoy Au-197; PCC Elite+; CCC Elite+; MSC C-12; CWC Au-197; WoH Dis
Posts: 52,139
What about those of us who pay for 100% of our own travel who can't find award rooms because of the selfish program abusers who make a hundred award bookings with no intention of using any of them?
Aug 15, 2019, 6:08 pm
#92
Join Date: May 2013
Programs: UA Au Marriott Ti Hilton C
Posts: 159
This has been a tough year for points devaluation for sure. Between trashing travel packages, category addition, category creep and now this? Ouch.
I was already headed toward free agency when I hit lifetime Ti last year and this makes it that much easier. Mrs. 1120 and I just returned from a couple weeks in Europe. Up til Bonvoy, we would have stayed primarily at Marriott properties. This time? €0
It’s not all bad - we’ve expanded both work and vacation lodging choices and it’s been great.
The grass really is greener when you get away from Bonvoy.
I was already headed toward free agency when I hit lifetime Ti last year and this makes it that much easier. Mrs. 1120 and I just returned from a couple weeks in Europe. Up til Bonvoy, we would have stayed primarily at Marriott properties. This time? €0
It’s not all bad - we’ve expanded both work and vacation lodging choices and it’s been great.
The grass really is greener when you get away from Bonvoy.
Aug 15, 2019, 6:26 pm
#93
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Cockeysville, MD
Programs: Marriott Rewards Lifetime Titanium, Amex Plat, Hertz Gold 5*, National Exec, AA Plat
Posts: 9,467
Aug 15, 2019, 7:23 pm
#94
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Cockeysville, MD
Programs: Marriott Rewards Lifetime Titanium, Amex Plat, Hertz Gold 5*, National Exec, AA Plat
Posts: 9,467
I just rebooked all of next week's business travel to Hyatt. Except for our Cabo timeshare, I cannot think of the last time I stayed someplace not in the Marriott family. Next week, I will be able too.
Marriott just doesn't value loyal guests anymore. I work in corporate sales. My approach is pretty simple. Listen to the client. They will tell you what you need to do to earn their business. Its up to you as to whether or not you'll do it. (Yes there are tons of variables, but in many cases it boils down to that.) When a company tells you they don't want your business, listen to them. I feel like Marriott is screaming that to me.
Marriott just doesn't value loyal guests anymore. I work in corporate sales. My approach is pretty simple. Listen to the client. They will tell you what you need to do to earn their business. Its up to you as to whether or not you'll do it. (Yes there are tons of variables, but in many cases it boils down to that.) When a company tells you they don't want your business, listen to them. I feel like Marriott is screaming that to me.
Aug 15, 2019, 7:39 pm
#95
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: PHX
Programs: AS 75K; UA 1MM; Hyatt Globalist; Marriott LTP; Hilton Diamond (Aspire)
Posts: 56,452
Wow they are deliberately hosing us on the 35k certs. They will never be usable above Cat 5, but will often only be usable below Cat 5.
And Phoenix in July.
SF and NYC will be peak 10 or 11 out of 12 months of the year.
And Phoenix in July.
SF and NYC will be peak 10 or 11 out of 12 months of the year.
Aug 15, 2019, 8:20 pm
#96
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Atlanta but Washington DC will always be home.
Programs: Marriott LTP, Hilton Diamond, Accor Gold, Hyatt Explorist,, Delta Plat,
Posts: 2,070
And of course they're not disclosing how many nights a hotel can label peak or has to label off peak.
I fear (but hope I'm wrong) that in major cities like London, SanFran, NYC, etc...or in places like Hawaii nearly every night of the year could be peak based on the marketing video description of "when the hotel is really busy" as when peak labels apply.
I fear (but hope I'm wrong) that in major cities like London, SanFran, NYC, etc...or in places like Hawaii nearly every night of the year could be peak based on the marketing video description of "when the hotel is really busy" as when peak labels apply.
Aug 15, 2019, 8:21 pm
#97
Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: Stilllwater OK (SWO)
Programs: AAdvantage ExecPlat, World of Hyatt Globalist, plain "member" of Marriott, IHG, enterprise, etc.
Posts: 1,848
This makes me glad I stick with hyatt except for the few rare nights I'm out of their footprint.
For pleasure, I travel fairly equally between locations at their peak times and locations at their off peak times, but for darn sure, I always pay cash at nonpeak times when cash rates are cheap, and always pay points at peak times when cash rates are high.That is the entirety of the beauty of loyalty programs. This change only makes bad redemption opportunities less bad (but still bad) while raising point redemptions all the times when point redemptions have made the most sense. Maybe it matters less to those that earn only on other people's money and always redeem for all personal travel, but for the rest of us this is a pure devaluation.
For pleasure, I travel fairly equally between locations at their peak times and locations at their off peak times, but for darn sure, I always pay cash at nonpeak times when cash rates are cheap, and always pay points at peak times when cash rates are high.That is the entirety of the beauty of loyalty programs. This change only makes bad redemption opportunities less bad (but still bad) while raising point redemptions all the times when point redemptions have made the most sense. Maybe it matters less to those that earn only on other people's money and always redeem for all personal travel, but for the rest of us this is a pure devaluation.
Aug 15, 2019, 8:59 pm
#98
formerly smoaky
Join Date: Jan 2018
Posts: 301
Dear Marriott, do you know when your membership program is FUBAR? When it is so convoluted that you have to publish Youtube videos to explain it, like you did today.
True, but Marriott has said they are only going to update the peak/off peak nights once a month, so it is not dynamic like Hilton's pricing, which devalues in real time as the cash rate changes.
Although this is spread across all properties so it could turn out to be a huge devaluation, I'm guessing Marriott won't use it that way. If Marriott wants to charge more points for a hotel, they'll simply move the hotel to a higher category. Marriott has not been shy about moving hotels to higher categories.
True, but Marriott has said they are only going to update the peak/off peak nights once a month, so it is not dynamic like Hilton's pricing, which devalues in real time as the cash rate changes.
Although this is spread across all properties so it could turn out to be a huge devaluation, I'm guessing Marriott won't use it that way. If Marriott wants to charge more points for a hotel, they'll simply move the hotel to a higher category. Marriott has not been shy about moving hotels to higher categories.
Aug 15, 2019, 9:03 pm
#99
Join Date: Nov 2016
Posts: 812
And of course they're not disclosing how many nights a hotel can label peak or has to label off peak.
I fear (but hope I'm wrong) that in major cities like London, SanFran, NYC, etc...or in places like Hawaii nearly every night of the year could be peak based on the marketing video description of "when the hotel is really busy" as when peak labels apply.
I fear (but hope I'm wrong) that in major cities like London, SanFran, NYC, etc...or in places like Hawaii nearly every night of the year could be peak based on the marketing video description of "when the hotel is really busy" as when peak labels apply.
Aug 15, 2019, 9:11 pm
#100
Suspended
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Southern California, USA
Programs: Marriott Ambassador and LTT, UA Plat/LT Gold, AA Gold
Posts: 8,764
Worrying about peak is a waste of time. (No one is worrying about standard, and everyone is looking forward to non peak.)
It is what it is. It's still better than the award costs under SPG, no matter how you look at it. So everyone needs to stop bellyaching already. You've known it was coming for over a year.
#dramaqueens
It is what it is. It's still better than the award costs under SPG, no matter how you look at it. So everyone needs to stop bellyaching already. You've known it was coming for over a year.
#dramaqueens
Aug 15, 2019, 9:29 pm
#101
Join Date: Feb 2005
Programs: Bonvoy Lifetime Titanium, Hyatt Globlist, Hilton Silver, Amtrak Select Plus, UA Silver
Posts: 2,025
Didn't Marriott have blackout dates and when they feel like it, they can double the points require (think that was what they called anytime awards). So how is that better than SPG. Many on this thread would love to go back to SPG any time any day!!!!!
Aug 15, 2019, 9:32 pm
#102
Suspended
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Southern California, USA
Programs: Marriott Ambassador and LTT, UA Plat/LT Gold, AA Gold
Posts: 8,764
This whole drama is about people complaint about change...and not realizing the change isn’t that bad from the SPG perspective.
From the Marriott side, it was so bad and with so few good and aspirational options that it’s hard to care.
Aug 15, 2019, 9:38 pm
#103
Join Date: Nov 2016
Posts: 812
Well, I hope Marriott publishes the statistics on where the Peak/Off-Peak pricing is going.
What's to stop them from just saying "it will be spread evenly across the portfolio," but having that actually be a flat out lie?
7000+ hotels, probably average rooms is 150ish at each location, that's 1,050,000 rooms per night minimum. There is no way a layman could verify that the peak/off-peak is evenly spread.
Are you going to share statistics on where the off-peaks are going? Otherwise, I will just consider this a 100% devaluation, because there is nothing stopping you from just saying "oh, they are available, you just must not have looked hard enough."
What's to stop them from just saying "it will be spread evenly across the portfolio," but having that actually be a flat out lie?
7000+ hotels, probably average rooms is 150ish at each location, that's 1,050,000 rooms per night minimum. There is no way a layman could verify that the peak/off-peak is evenly spread.
Are you going to share statistics on where the off-peaks are going? Otherwise, I will just consider this a 100% devaluation, because there is nothing stopping you from just saying "oh, they are available, you just must not have looked hard enough."
Aug 15, 2019, 10:38 pm
#104
Suspended
Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: EWR/PHL/BWI
Posts: 4,412
Whatever the point changes regarding peak and off-peak fine. But the problem is the credit card award night. It is fixed at up to 35k or 50k points. the peak/off-peak change skews it to the downside and drops in value. So I do not see the need to carry those Marriott credit cards for the award night.
Aug 15, 2019, 10:50 pm
#105
Join Date: May 2017
Location: YEG, SFO, VCA, JR JY-13
Programs: hahaha
Posts: 921
Can someone clarify what "portfolio" means in the context of today's announcement?
Does it mean all 7000+ properties, or just the brand grouping (Select, Premium, Luxury, etc.), or the particular brands themselves?
Does it mean all 7000+ properties, or just the brand grouping (Select, Premium, Luxury, etc.), or the particular brands themselves?
