Dec 12, 2018, 6:51 am
Al Maha Desert Resort & Spa, Dubai [Master Thread]
Dec 28, 2018, 5:44 am
#391
Join Date: May 2011
Programs: UA platinum, Club Carlson Gold, SPG Gold
Posts: 111
My reservation made in the Marriot System the 13th of december included the food and drinks and the hotel will mantain that, so it's not accurate that bookings made after december 11 don't include food and activities, they changed it a few days after the marriot system change. I have attached a capture of the marriott screen after i made the reservation with the rate details
Dec 28, 2018, 8:30 am
#392
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: New York
Programs: MB-LTT , HH-Diam., HGP-Expl.
Posts: 778
Okay, I’ll play along. Are there any other hotels in any other program that are entirely all inclusive when booked with cash, but are room only when booked with points? Or is Marriott letting this one hotel make its own rules?
Regardless of the answers tp those questions, the fact remains that this hotel has made changes to reservations that were already booked and no matter how good or bad a deal it is now, that is not alright.
Regardless of the answers tp those questions, the fact remains that this hotel has made changes to reservations that were already booked and no matter how good or bad a deal it is now, that is not alright.
I share you opinion about retroactive changes to reservations.
Last edited by rny321; Dec 28, 2018 at 8:52 am
Dec 28, 2018, 8:57 am
#393
Join Date: May 2006
Programs: SPG, HH, UAMP, AEPL, DC
Posts: 46
Assuming that the food and activity costs to the property (including the profit margins) remain relatively stable year-round at USD 400 pp/pd, and the pricing is based on double occupancy, the basic villas are being "valued" in the range of USD 300 to 900 per day. That makes a 60,000 point redemption for room only range from a pretty poor deal to a really excellent deal. Some other random thoughts:
1. Anyone who stays in a villa as a solo traveler is a real windfall to the property, since the full board rate is for two people, which effectively means the board charge for the second person is pure profit. I wonder how often that happens.
2. There are about 40 villas on the property, and the vast majority are the same floor plan, square footage, etc. (though the views may differ). I wonder if the property didn't/couldn't find a way to distinguish between these villas so that only a subset were "standard" rooms eligible for points redemption (I know people hate it when properties do this, but it would hardly be the first time, and if a generic Sheraton can get away with it, why not a special property like Al Maha), and as a result has been swamped with reward redemptions for certain weeks, including for high season which can't yet be charged at peak rates?
3. While there may be some nights when occupancy is 90% plus (ie, 35 or more villas booked), thus justifying higher reimbursement from Marriott for award stays, I suspect it's not frequent enough to offset providing full board to two people per room and being reimbursed at the standard reimbursement rate (about USD 600 for 60,000 points).
4. Which leads to my thoughts on "points people". Perhaps ironically, given how much pleasure I take in my points hobby, one of the reasons I like staying at Four Seasons properties is the absence of this gamesmanship, both on my part and on the part of the staff who are not constantly dealing with attempts to finagle additional benefits (of course, FS guests can act plenty entitled in other ways...). It's a kind of old-fashioned equation there: here is the price, am I willing to pay it, and if so here is what I will get. The AmEx FHR upgrade is one of the very few variables, and regardless the FHR rate always includes breakfast, WiFi, etc.
1. Anyone who stays in a villa as a solo traveler is a real windfall to the property, since the full board rate is for two people, which effectively means the board charge for the second person is pure profit. I wonder how often that happens.
2. There are about 40 villas on the property, and the vast majority are the same floor plan, square footage, etc. (though the views may differ). I wonder if the property didn't/couldn't find a way to distinguish between these villas so that only a subset were "standard" rooms eligible for points redemption (I know people hate it when properties do this, but it would hardly be the first time, and if a generic Sheraton can get away with it, why not a special property like Al Maha), and as a result has been swamped with reward redemptions for certain weeks, including for high season which can't yet be charged at peak rates?
3. While there may be some nights when occupancy is 90% plus (ie, 35 or more villas booked), thus justifying higher reimbursement from Marriott for award stays, I suspect it's not frequent enough to offset providing full board to two people per room and being reimbursed at the standard reimbursement rate (about USD 600 for 60,000 points).
4. Which leads to my thoughts on "points people". Perhaps ironically, given how much pleasure I take in my points hobby, one of the reasons I like staying at Four Seasons properties is the absence of this gamesmanship, both on my part and on the part of the staff who are not constantly dealing with attempts to finagle additional benefits (of course, FS guests can act plenty entitled in other ways...). It's a kind of old-fashioned equation there: here is the price, am I willing to pay it, and if so here is what I will get. The AmEx FHR upgrade is one of the very few variables, and regardless the FHR rate always includes breakfast, WiFi, etc.
Dec 28, 2018, 9:03 am
#394
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: MCO, YEG
Posts: 1,179
@rny321, I know that there are plenty of hotels that offer full board or all inclusive as an option along with room only for cash, however, I am wondering if there are any other hotels that are only all inclusive for cash, but only allow room only bookings for awards. It appears that Fairmont Mara does offer room only cash rates, albeit at a very small discount to their all inclusive rates.
On another note, after emailing the hotel advising of my disappointment that my reservation was unilaterally changed without notice, they advised that they do not have access to make any changes to award reservations. So either they are being dishonest or Marriott is making these changes without their knowledge.
1 star Tripadvisor reviews are starting to pile up.
On another note, after emailing the hotel advising of my disappointment that my reservation was unilaterally changed without notice, they advised that they do not have access to make any changes to award reservations. So either they are being dishonest or Marriott is making these changes without their knowledge.
1 star Tripadvisor reviews are starting to pile up.
Dec 28, 2018, 9:05 am
#395
Join Date: May 2006
Programs: SPG, HH, UAMP, AEPL, DC
Posts: 46
One additional thought: while the change to room only redemption took place around the time of the Marriott migration, I wonder whether the "real" motive was the announcement that the new category 8 pricing would not go into effect until March 2019, rather than January 2019 as most people assumed would happen (and maybe properties were led to believe)? So in effect there is an another 90 day window for these wildly generous redemptions and property management said "enough".
This does not justify retroactive changes to existing reservations, and we'll have to wait and see how that issue as handled as we get more reports from actual stays. But I have to say, as frustrating as the merger has been from a guest perspective, I'm beginning to think that it may be equally frustrating to individual properties, especially the high-profile, deluxe resorts like Al Maha. If internal communications were as poor, inconsistent, and unreliable as the customer-facing ones...
This does not justify retroactive changes to existing reservations, and we'll have to wait and see how that issue as handled as we get more reports from actual stays. But I have to say, as frustrating as the merger has been from a guest perspective, I'm beginning to think that it may be equally frustrating to individual properties, especially the high-profile, deluxe resorts like Al Maha. If internal communications were as poor, inconsistent, and unreliable as the customer-facing ones...
Dec 28, 2018, 9:10 am
#396
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: India
Programs: Bonvoy Lifetime Titanium, IHG Plat, HH Gold, Trident Plat, DL Diamond, AI Maharajah
Posts: 29,645
In such a circumstance, I agree that one wouldn’t come out ahead. Of course, I don’t believe that cirumstance is as realistic or common as suggested. I don’t believe that meals and activities on average cost as much as stated, nor do I believe it is that common that room rates are less than $1100 a night. So to me, that entire hypothetical calculation is nothing more than a red herring.
also, post # 351 states what the property is quoting for meals per person....breakfast is about $45 per person, lunch is about $75 per person & dinner is about $140 per person....so even if you get free breakfast as a plat, you still end up paying $430 for 2 meals for 2 people ($520 if you don't get free plat breakfast)....activities are also around $70 per person so including that you end up paying upwards of $650 a night for 2 people....
Dec 28, 2018, 9:16 am
#397
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: New York
Programs: MB-LTT , HH-Diam., HGP-Expl.
Posts: 778
@rny321, I know that there are plenty of hotels that offer full board or all inclusive as an option along with room only for cash, however, I am wondering if there are any other hotels that are only all inclusive for cash, but only allow room only bookings for awards. It appears that Fairmont Mara does offer room only cash rates, albeit at a very small discount to their all inclusive rates.
On another note, after emailing the hotel advising of my disappointment that my reservation was unilaterally changed without notice, they advised that they do not have access to make any changes to award reservations. So either they are being dishonest or Marriott is making these changes without their knowledge.
1 star Tripadvisor reviews are starting to pile up.
On another note, after emailing the hotel advising of my disappointment that my reservation was unilaterally changed without notice, they advised that they do not have access to make any changes to award reservations. So either they are being dishonest or Marriott is making these changes without their knowledge.
1 star Tripadvisor reviews are starting to pile up.
Dec 28, 2018, 10:38 am
#398
Join Date: Jan 2017
Programs: IHG - spire amb, Marriot - tit, Radisson - plat, Hilton - gold, Accor -gold, GHA - plat
Posts: 282
not at all a red herring....i stayed here last year for 3 nights for under $750 a night....my wife & i are considering staying here again next year for my birthday & the rate i am getting is $720 a night....i have also seen $900-$1,000 rates quite regularly....
also, post # 351 states what the property is quoting for meals per person....breakfast is about $45 per person, lunch is about $75 per person & dinner is about $140 per person....so even if you get free breakfast as a plat, you still end up paying $430 for 2 meals for 2 people ($520 if you don't get free plat breakfast)....activities are also around $70 per person so including that you end up paying upwards of $650 a night for 2 people....
also, post # 351 states what the property is quoting for meals per person....breakfast is about $45 per person, lunch is about $75 per person & dinner is about $140 per person....so even if you get free breakfast as a plat, you still end up paying $430 for 2 meals for 2 people ($520 if you don't get free plat breakfast)....activities are also around $70 per person so including that you end up paying upwards of $650 a night for 2 people....
Dec 28, 2018, 10:39 am
#399
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: In the air
Programs: Hyatt Globalist, Bonvoy LT Plat, Hilton Gold, GHA Tit, BA Gold, Turkish Elite
Posts: 8,712
2. There are about 40 villas on the property, and the vast majority are the same floor plan, square footage, etc. (though the views may differ). I wonder if the property didn't/couldn't find a way to distinguish between these villas so that only a subset were "standard" rooms eligible for points redemption (I know people hate it when properties do this, but it would hardly be the first time, and if a generic Sheraton can get away with it, why not a special property like Al Maha), and as a result has been swamped with reward redemptions for certain weeks, including for high season which can't yet be charged at peak rates?.
Two caveats: 1. this was before the transition to the Marriott system and 2. I might just have been mischarged.
Back to the general debate, the real problem is Marriott not noticing the property’s special conditions until after the programme announcement, so they not unreasonably had to do something. I’d rather they went back to just asking a reasonable amount of points, but in the meantime their solution is reasonable.
As I said, it means that for a couple you should not book on points unless rates are $1,100 or higher (I would want min $1,300), although the relative attractiveness on points is much higher if only
one person is staying: for once, a benefit to single people on a points stay.
Dec 28, 2018, 11:07 am
#400
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: La Jolla, CA
Programs: Marriott Ambassador, Lifetime Titanium, Delta Plat, Hilton Diamond , Hyatt Globalist
Posts: 2,615
One additional thought: while the change to room only redemption took place around the time of the Marriott migration, I wonder whether the "real" motive was the announcement that the new category 8 pricing would not go into effect until March 2019, rather than January 2019 as most people assumed would happen (and maybe properties were led to believe)? So in effect there is an another 90 day window for these wildly generous redemptions and property management said "enough".
This does not justify retroactive changes to existing reservations, and we'll have to wait and see how that issue as handled as we get more reports from actual stays. But I have to say, as frustrating as the merger has been from a guest perspective, I'm beginning to think that it may be equally frustrating to individual properties, especially the high-profile, deluxe resorts like Al Maha. If internal communications were as poor, inconsistent, and unreliable as the customer-facing ones...
This does not justify retroactive changes to existing reservations, and we'll have to wait and see how that issue as handled as we get more reports from actual stays. But I have to say, as frustrating as the merger has been from a guest perspective, I'm beginning to think that it may be equally frustrating to individual properties, especially the high-profile, deluxe resorts like Al Maha. If internal communications were as poor, inconsistent, and unreliable as the customer-facing ones...
I can only imagine how frustrated some of these higher tier hotels may be. When something is “too good to be true” it typically doesn’t last long. It’s another brand but when Hyatt first announced 9000 points per night Upgrades to Premium Suites on 11/1- future guests (including my son) were able to book the Diplomatic Suite at the Park Hyatt Tokyo that sells for $4000 per night. There was no way that that was going to last, and sure enough Hyatt is now (per their T&Cs) excluding those. This deal was similar- 60K per night for deluxe accommodations with meals and activities.
I definitely agree though that they must honor the reservations that were booked under those (amazing) terms.
Last edited by damon88; Dec 28, 2018 at 4:53 pm
Dec 28, 2018, 4:50 pm
#401
Suspended
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Kan@da
Programs: Anything with sweet spots
Posts: 1,790
Upon reading this thread on Christmas Eve, I checked my reservation and it showed breakfast included but did not speak to the remainder, so I wrote to the hotel. They responded that nothing is included and proceeded to unilaterally amend my reservation to room only, so for those that think the hotel will provide them with anything, better document it, because they will do whatever they feel like doing.
They offered to reinstate the full board and activities for just $800/night for two of us (2840 AED). I might just hold onto the 5 night reservation until close to the cancellation deadline and let them try to fill it on 30 days notice.
With every interaction I have with Marriott rewards, I become more convinced that I never want to deal with Marriott rewards again. Three transactions this year and three times they have made my travels increasingly stressful. Not what I look for in a loyalty program.
They offered to reinstate the full board and activities for just $800/night for two of us (2840 AED). I might just hold onto the 5 night reservation until close to the cancellation deadline and let them try to fill it on 30 days notice.
With every interaction I have with Marriott rewards, I become more convinced that I never want to deal with Marriott rewards again. Three transactions this year and three times they have made my travels increasingly stressful. Not what I look for in a loyalty program.
Dec 28, 2018, 5:05 pm
#402
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: La Jolla, CA
Programs: Marriott Ambassador, Lifetime Titanium, Delta Plat, Hilton Diamond , Hyatt Globalist
Posts: 2,615
May 6-June 30 the rates drop into the low $700s per Google Book. (Of course it’s 100+ degrees, right?) My husband would divorce me.
Dec 28, 2018, 5:09 pm
#403
Suspended
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Southern California, USA
Programs: Marriott Ambassador and LTT, UA Plat/LT Gold, AA Gold
Posts: 8,764
Dec 28, 2018, 6:08 pm
#404
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: La Jolla, CA
Programs: Marriott Ambassador, Lifetime Titanium, Delta Plat, Hilton Diamond , Hyatt Globalist
Posts: 2,615
And in Feb 2019 the rates go from $1600/night to $5700/night Wow. At certain times of year that 60K looks even more amazing- even without the full board.
Dec 28, 2018, 6:43 pm
#405
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: India
Programs: Bonvoy Lifetime Titanium, IHG Plat, HH Gold, Trident Plat, DL Diamond, AI Maharajah
Posts: 29,645
