Jan 3, 2019, 1:46 pm
Last edit by: randomperson24
NEW TO MS? It's suggested that new arrivals should do some serious reading for a month of all the posts and wiki to get an understanding of MS before asking common questions.
Note: the 2017 - 2018 version of this thread is here, 2016 version of this thread is here, the 2015 version of the thread is here
Welcome to Manufactured Spending. Marathon Man did not write this message, but he has edited it and anyone can. If you are new here, please spend some time reading before posting. Most likely your questions have already been answered multiple times. Consider deals that you share. These threads are searchable by Google. A volatile deal may be worth holding close to the vest.
Hints
1) On FT, topics are heavily consolidated. Sometimes the title of the thread and first few posts may not properly reflect the broad range of discussion inside the thread. Be sure to visit any thread relating to the product or service you want to learn more about because you might be surprised by how in depth the discussion really is. High "View Count" and "Replies" are good indicators of active "master threads" on a specific topic.
2) Use Google to search FT. It works a lot better than the built-in search.
3) A glossary wiki for MS located in the thread Glossary, Manufactured Spending Forum
Important Rules
1) MSing is very YMMV. It varies by store, manager, and right down to the cashier working at the moment. Some might argue that MS is like card counting in a casino. It is not illegal but casinos don’t like it. Orhers have said it’s like having a fake ID in college to use just to get into bars where all the fun is. Just because it worked here yesterday doesn’t mean it will get you in today. MS is like being a wood worker constantly using a table saw. Always watch what you are doing—always! Or you will lose something. That being said, always be nice and courteous in the face of rejection. The biggest secret for success is to lay low so you can try again.
2) DO NOT spend more than you can afford. START WITH SMALL AMOUNTS TO TEST THE WATER! As an example.. don't start with a $5000 purchase of VGCs if you can't afford to float that much! Instead, buy one and try it, and scale up once you are comfortable with a new method. It's easy to lose track, or get robbed, when you are handling so much money. Getting a refund is NOT always possible.
3) DO NOT ask employees, cashiers, customer service representatives, etc... about how to MS, or about things you read on this forum. The information you read here are very specific, unknown, legal uses of products or services. Most employees, cashiers, and even managers do not know about them. At best you'll get bad information. At worst you'll create a lot of unnecessary misunderstanding.
4) It bears repeating that there are no guarantees. you could easily buy $10,000 in gift cards or some other instrument, only to discover that your method for liquidating them vanishes the very next day. MS is not "normal" financial activity ("normal" being defined by the banks), and thus is often perceived as "suspicious" even if it is legal.
5) never underestimate the risk of criminal activity. gift cards can easily be stolen, loaded onto a compromised account, loaded in a debit card skimmer, or even fraudulent (e.g., an already used card put back on the rack).
6) MSing can be used for a variety of purposes, ranging from smallish amounts to meet minimum spend requirements to get a credit card signup bonus, to accumulating huge numbers of points for travel/cashback/etc. Remember too that you will often have expenses such as purchase fees, liquidation fees, and gas.
If you have a question that does not seem to fit anywhere, or you have not found an appropriate place for it, post it here.
- A helpful note from seat17D about some of the inherent risks of MS
New MSers can also read all these threads:
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/manuf...-spending-719/
Note: the 2017 - 2018 version of this thread is here, 2016 version of this thread is here, the 2015 version of the thread is here
Welcome to Manufactured Spending. Marathon Man did not write this message, but he has edited it and anyone can. If you are new here, please spend some time reading before posting. Most likely your questions have already been answered multiple times. Consider deals that you share. These threads are searchable by Google. A volatile deal may be worth holding close to the vest.
Hints
1) On FT, topics are heavily consolidated. Sometimes the title of the thread and first few posts may not properly reflect the broad range of discussion inside the thread. Be sure to visit any thread relating to the product or service you want to learn more about because you might be surprised by how in depth the discussion really is. High "View Count" and "Replies" are good indicators of active "master threads" on a specific topic.
2) Use Google to search FT. It works a lot better than the built-in search.
3) A glossary wiki for MS located in the thread Glossary, Manufactured Spending Forum
Important Rules
1) MSing is very YMMV. It varies by store, manager, and right down to the cashier working at the moment. Some might argue that MS is like card counting in a casino. It is not illegal but casinos don’t like it. Orhers have said it’s like having a fake ID in college to use just to get into bars where all the fun is. Just because it worked here yesterday doesn’t mean it will get you in today. MS is like being a wood worker constantly using a table saw. Always watch what you are doing—always! Or you will lose something. That being said, always be nice and courteous in the face of rejection. The biggest secret for success is to lay low so you can try again.
2) DO NOT spend more than you can afford. START WITH SMALL AMOUNTS TO TEST THE WATER! As an example.. don't start with a $5000 purchase of VGCs if you can't afford to float that much! Instead, buy one and try it, and scale up once you are comfortable with a new method. It's easy to lose track, or get robbed, when you are handling so much money. Getting a refund is NOT always possible.
3) DO NOT ask employees, cashiers, customer service representatives, etc... about how to MS, or about things you read on this forum. The information you read here are very specific, unknown, legal uses of products or services. Most employees, cashiers, and even managers do not know about them. At best you'll get bad information. At worst you'll create a lot of unnecessary misunderstanding.
4) It bears repeating that there are no guarantees. you could easily buy $10,000 in gift cards or some other instrument, only to discover that your method for liquidating them vanishes the very next day. MS is not "normal" financial activity ("normal" being defined by the banks), and thus is often perceived as "suspicious" even if it is legal.
5) never underestimate the risk of criminal activity. gift cards can easily be stolen, loaded onto a compromised account, loaded in a debit card skimmer, or even fraudulent (e.g., an already used card put back on the rack).
6) MSing can be used for a variety of purposes, ranging from smallish amounts to meet minimum spend requirements to get a credit card signup bonus, to accumulating huge numbers of points for travel/cashback/etc. Remember too that you will often have expenses such as purchase fees, liquidation fees, and gas.
If you have a question that does not seem to fit anywhere, or you have not found an appropriate place for it, post it here.
- A helpful note from seat17D about some of the inherent risks of MS
New MSers can also read all these threads:
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/manuf...-spending-719/
New to Manufactured Spending? Start here (2019-2024)
Apr 17, 2020, 8:19 am
#331
Join Date: Mar 2005
Programs: Continental Onepass, Hilton, Marriott, USAir and now UA
Posts: 6,433
From my reading, PP is a no no for MSing, but if you wish to try, have at it. However, please report back in the now moribund (for good reason
) PP thread with your results.For full disclosure, I have a PP account which is strictly used for paying appropriate bills only when no other payment method works. This means that I use PP maybe once or twice a year.
May 13, 2020, 11:09 am
#333
Join Date: Aug 2019
Posts: 44
I found a few VGC that are almost certainly $0 but wanted to confirm before discarding. I had a couple from ODOM purchased in the last few months that said to go to giftcardmall/mygift and one of them worked but the other said "Invalid request." I also had one Simon, probably from last September, and went to that website and got a different error - "Your card has been blocked. Please contact Simon Support to correct this issue."
Again, according to my records I used these but am confused why I am unable to check the balance. Do they turn off transaction history shortly after the card balance is zero? I'm confused why some worked and some didn't that were likely purchased and used on the same days as each other.
Again, according to my records I used these but am confused why I am unable to check the balance. Do they turn off transaction history shortly after the card balance is zero? I'm confused why some worked and some didn't that were likely purchased and used on the same days as each other.
May 13, 2020, 11:46 am
#334
Join Date: Mar 2005
Programs: Continental Onepass, Hilton, Marriott, USAir and now UA
Posts: 6,433
I found a few VGC that are almost certainly $0 but wanted to confirm before discarding. I had a couple from ODOM purchased in the last few months that said to go to giftcardmall/mygift and one of them worked but the other said "Invalid request." I also had one Simon, probably from last September, and went to that website and got a different error - "Your card has been blocked. Please contact Simon Support to correct this issue."
Again, according to my records I used these but am confused why I am unable to check the balance. Do they turn off transaction history shortly after the card balance is zero? I'm confused why some worked and some didn't that were likely purchased and used on the same days as each other.
Again, according to my records I used these but am confused why I am unable to check the balance. Do they turn off transaction history shortly after the card balance is zero? I'm confused why some worked and some didn't that were likely purchased and used on the same days as each other.
Let us know what you found out.
BTW, it is very easy to presume that you have used your card when in fact you haven't. I have made that mistake on rare occasion
May 17, 2020, 5:58 pm
#335
Join Date: Mar 2020
Posts: 83
Hey all hope everyone's Sunday is going well. Had a few questions regarding USB VGC.
1. For USB VGC, after purchase, is the PIN automatically set to the last 4 digits of the card?
2. Is there a way to set the pin online? or is the only way to call the number on the back and go through the auto prompts.
1. For USB VGC, after purchase, is the PIN automatically set to the last 4 digits of the card?
2. Is there a way to set the pin online? or is the only way to call the number on the back and go through the auto prompts.
May 17, 2020, 8:22 pm
#336
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: SAN
Programs: Delta Gold. Hilton Diamond. Hyatt Explorist.
Posts: 1,674
Hey all hope everyone's Sunday is going well. Had a few questions regarding USB VGC.
1. For USB VGC, after purchase, is the PIN automatically set to the last 4 digits of the card?
2. Is there a way to set the pin online? or is the only way to call the number on the back and go through the auto prompts.
1. For USB VGC, after purchase, is the PIN automatically set to the last 4 digits of the card?
2. Is there a way to set the pin online? or is the only way to call the number on the back and go through the auto prompts.
May 17, 2020, 8:54 pm
#337
Join Date: Mar 2020
Posts: 83
May 18, 2020, 9:03 am
#338
Join Date: Mar 2005
Programs: Continental Onepass, Hilton, Marriott, USAir and now UA
Posts: 6,433
I found a few VGC that are almost certainly $0 but wanted to confirm before discarding. I had a couple from ODOM purchased in the last few months that said to go to giftcardmall/mygift and one of them worked but the other said "Invalid request." I also had one Simon, probably from last September, and went to that website and got a different error - "Your card has been blocked. Please contact Simon Support to correct this issue."
Again, according to my records I used these but am confused why I am unable to check the balance. Do they turn off transaction history shortly after the card balance is zero? I'm confused why some worked and some didn't that were likely purchased and used on the same days as each other.
Again, according to my records I used these but am confused why I am unable to check the balance. Do they turn off transaction history shortly after the card balance is zero? I'm confused why some worked and some didn't that were likely purchased and used on the same days as each other.
However, I guess you could try and do a minimal purchase of say $.05 using the card and see if it goes through. However, this is way too much work, IMO. Call Simon or Visa as they request.
May 19, 2020, 1:02 pm
#339
Join Date: Jul 2018
Posts: 17
IMHO, the quickest and best way to build up your credit file is to have your spouse, assuming you are married, add you as an authorized user to all the credit card. This will be reflected on your credit report and at least "fill" up the white space. After that you can try to open for a store credit card or secured credit card to build up that file.
May 19, 2020, 8:26 pm
#340
Join Date: Aug 2019
Posts: 44
There is no harm in contacting Simon mall about your card. They certainly will give you the skinny on why they blocked your card.
Let us know what you found out.
BTW, it is very easy to presume that you have used your card when in fact you haven't. I have made that mistake on rare occasion
Let us know what you found out.
BTW, it is very easy to presume that you have used your card when in fact you haven't. I have made that mistake on rare occasion
The others I was able to confirm $0 balance through the automated process at the phone number on the back of the card. As expected, but easy enough to confirm. Odd they didn't work with the online check balance.
Last edited by Burton Codh; May 19, 2020 at 8:34 pm
May 20, 2020, 1:03 am
#341
Join Date: Apr 2020
Posts: 8
Money lots of $$$ in and out of paypal must raise some redflags right? Is it common to get asked to email bank statements or salery proof?! If so at what number do they usually as for such things?! In my case, i make about $2500 after tax every month, so sending(giftcards and other transferes) $5000 to paypal and depositing it back to my back would raise some flags?!
May 25, 2020, 11:16 am
#342
Join Date: Mar 2005
Programs: Continental Onepass, Hilton, Marriott, USAir and now UA
Posts: 6,433
Money lots of $$$ in and out of paypal must raise some redflags right? Is it common to get asked to email bank statements or salery proof?! If so at what number do they usually as for such things?! In my case, i make about $2500 after tax every month, so sending(giftcards and other transferes) $5000 to paypal and depositing it back to my back would raise some flags?!
You may want to look at the following site and do a search on FT for other threads.
Banned for life from PayPal & ebay
Jun 23, 2020, 7:28 pm
#343
Join Date: Jun 2020
Posts: 170
MS and the CCs - The Irony
Isn't it a tad ironic that certain credit card issuers are offended by manufactured spending activity when our day to day shopping on the card generates merchant fee between (2%-4%) kickback for them? They borrow out their credit cards to us, and our spending generates cashback for them for which they return an industry average 1% to the customer, and keep the rest. And now because the stores are pricing in credit card fees, we are basically paying the credit card company to use our credit cards unless we are doing 5x points or 5% cashback spend minimum! I find the whole thing amusing. They are offended when we dare to reclaim the fees they are legally stealing from us through the merchant kickback and the higher instore prices which only effect the customer, not the cc issuer...
I'm new and I'm not sure if I can post here, so mods please feel free to delete if not appropriate for this section.
I'm new and I'm not sure if I can post here, so mods please feel free to delete if not appropriate for this section.
Jun 23, 2020, 8:45 pm
#344
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 135
If that's all there was to it, CC companies wouldn't care.
But what you are missing is that people really do want to launder/anonymize money in real life for nefarious reasons, and they use the same techniques we do. Banks do care about that, a lot, because while servicing good accounts is cheap, receiving a subpoena and request to cooperate from the FBI or DEA, and potentially forfeit funds or write off balances, is very expensive when it happens. The fines from the OCC are heavy if you just look the other way, and the reputational risk is real if a Bank finds itself in the news because a criminal was using it, and it slipped through their checks. So when banks see indicator behavior, many won't wait and will just avoid the headache. Same with MOs. Many of these banks won't let payday lenders open accounts either, or they won't let a business have an account if they deal a lot with prepaid cards.
Be smart and find the stores that don't report level 3 info and you'll sleep better if you are concerned about this.
But what you are missing is that people really do want to launder/anonymize money in real life for nefarious reasons, and they use the same techniques we do. Banks do care about that, a lot, because while servicing good accounts is cheap, receiving a subpoena and request to cooperate from the FBI or DEA, and potentially forfeit funds or write off balances, is very expensive when it happens. The fines from the OCC are heavy if you just look the other way, and the reputational risk is real if a Bank finds itself in the news because a criminal was using it, and it slipped through their checks. So when banks see indicator behavior, many won't wait and will just avoid the headache. Same with MOs. Many of these banks won't let payday lenders open accounts either, or they won't let a business have an account if they deal a lot with prepaid cards.
Be smart and find the stores that don't report level 3 info and you'll sleep better if you are concerned about this.
Jun 23, 2020, 9:42 pm
#345
Join Date: Jun 2020
Posts: 170
There should be a way to "verify" CC customers sort of like the TSA pre-screening. I don't know what the criteria would be, and it wouldn't stop someone from turning bad AFTER they have verified, but the restrictions are annoying nonetheless