Old May 29, 2014, 7:43 pm
FlyerTalk Forums Expert How-Tos and Guides
Last edit by: prasha11
Does not work anymore, is dead..... what is the point to report 'not working'?

As of 08/25/2014, Bancorp cards (Vanilla Visa, OneVanilla, etc.) are rarely working first try for debit transactions at Walmart. There is no apparent geographical basis. Basically, it's a crapshoot.

Do not agitate a cashier or store and lose the ability to make these transactions in the future. Multiple failed swipes or transactions will likely increase scrutiny. You do not want that. It is best to stop using these cards.



Vanilla VISA defaulting to credit
As of 5/29/2014, at most Walmart locations, all Vanilla VISA cards issued by The Bancorp Bank are automatically recognized as credit. Most Mastercard have required a workaround for some time. The MoneyCenter Express (ATM, kiosk, Kate) is not affected by this change.
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MO Purchases using OV @ WM

Old Aug 22, 2014, 5:25 pm
  #2416  
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 4,463
Originally Posted by TRVLUPGD
So finally found a Giant , bought a MC Gift Card , was charged $ 5.95 fee. It is a printed card says DEBIT. No PIN creation instructions...
If there are no PIN instructions in very fine print on a card insert, you'll need to call the number on the back of the card to find out the assigned PIN, and change it if desired.
MaxVO is offline  
Old Aug 22, 2014, 5:52 pm
  #2417  
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 184
Originally Posted by shenxing
Look at the back of the card, see the wiki here.

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/manuf...bit-cards.html
Thanks.

Read the Wiki. The writing is so small on the back, cannot see any phone numbers. Will try to read on. If anyone has the US Bank GC number I would appreciate it, o rwill go get a magnifying glass tomrrow.

Thanks to other replies also.
TRVLUPGD is offline  
Old Aug 22, 2014, 6:36 pm
  #2418  
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Los Angles
Posts: 2,101
Originally Posted by TRVLUPGD
Thanks.

Read the Wiki. The writing is so small on the back, cannot see any phone numbers. Will try to read on. If anyone has the US Bank GC number I would appreciate it, o rwill go get a magnifying glass tomrrow.

Thanks to other replies also.
I don't think any phone # on the card but I know I used the phone # on the package. If u threw the package, go to the store and write it from the blank card hanging.
prasha11 is offline  
Old Aug 22, 2014, 8:04 pm
  #2419  
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Khyber Pakhtunkhwa
Posts: 1,929
Yeah, no phone # on the back of some plastic cards.
Alcibiades is offline  
Old Aug 22, 2014, 9:20 pm
  #2420  
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 16
Originally Posted by hamhead
Just as an added note, Wal-Mart's profit margins are 3.3% ttm, with much lower margins on groceries than on other products if you're shopping for those items. So even if you're dropping $100 in fresh food each trip you're only netting them a couple bucks profit.

You might already know that but I just wanted to clarify as sometimes the difference between revenue and profit, especially with low margin retailers, gets lost in discussions like these on the effect of (perhaps) loss leaders on foot traffic and profitability.
This is a very useful discussion. At least we start to having an understanding of why certain things happening in a logical and sensible way. However, I think for the sake of simplicity and ease of analysis, we should stick to gross margin discussion rather than consider all aspects of a store's profit margin by introducing space, wage, and opportunity cost. There are so many accounting tricks that can manipulate the formula to make it look one way or another. So I wouldn't count on the 3.3% is "accurate" based on set perceptions.

Gross margin is more concrete and easier to calculate. I think WM management will most likely look at the gross margin before making any decisions to kill or keep certain products.
bigmouth2008 is offline  
Old Aug 22, 2014, 9:37 pm
  #2421  
 
Join Date: May 2014
Posts: 186
Again, read the wiki in the thread I linked. The phone number to set pins for USB GC is right there.
shenxing is offline  
Old Aug 25, 2014, 8:52 pm
  #2422  
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 156
OV is dead. i tried this weekend @kate to load bb. nothing worked after multiple swipes. I traded it for meta gc for 6$ loss.
tech2011 is offline  
Old Aug 25, 2014, 9:08 pm
  #2423  
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Atlanta
Posts: 116
Originally Posted by tech2011
OV is dead. i tried this weekend @kate to load bb. nothing worked after multiple swipes. I traded it for meta gc for 6$ loss.
Go to a grocery store to buy MO.
Deallover is offline  
Old Aug 26, 2014, 4:14 am
  #2424  
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: a hotel room, somewhere...
Posts: 962
Originally Posted by hamhead
Don't see how you think that.

You've got $0.40 in exchange fees.

You've got money going to Moneygram - probably at least a 25/75 split of the MO fee going to Moneygram - so $0.17 or so.

With an average labor cost of $12/hour (wage rate, social security/medicare taxes, etc. combined), that is still $0.20/labor a minute.

Then, you've got the cost to maintain their floor space and systems. You've got the opportunity cost of the floor space. You've got to pay the back office people supporting the Money Center desk who command much higher salaries than the CSR.

Throw in fraud loss or just straight stupid cashier loss. There are numerous examples, myself included and an example just a couple posts back of how it happens with Bluebird, of cashiers jacking up transactions and giving people $500/$1,000 MO and not charging the card. That eats the full revenue of hundreds of transactions by itself, not even looking at supposed profit.
i completely get what you're saying and it's a very 'school'-ish view. the real world business view is that the money center serves many purposes. the viability of the business model as it relates to the MC doesn't boil down to the profitability of 1 service such as MO's, or, quite possible, even the p&l of the entire MC. it's a magnet. it provides a service needed by the people who shop walmart. this brings them in the door more frequently than they would otherwise and makes walmart a bigger part of their lives.

as for US... MSer's are definitely a waste of time and resources for walmart. that said, i buy a fair amount of stuff there at self serve check out while, if not for BB, BP, MO's, etc i would never set foot in walmart. see how that works?...
uncommonsensical is offline  
Old Aug 26, 2014, 4:49 am
  #2425  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: BOS, MHT
Programs: AA ltg, B6, DL, UA, AS, SPG/Marriott Plt, HH, Hyatt
Posts: 10,052
my wmts are not so close to nor convenient to my home. But then, not everything is.

That said, I definitely ONLY really shop at wmt BECAUSE I happen to also get MOs there. Oh if we find an item online that can ship to store like the outside small set up pool or the kids trampoline, we will go there too, but then when I am at the store I get MOs.

Generally I only use the store because they have MOs and if Mos stopped existing I likely would not go. I had a couple years when I went so much I also spent a couple grand in the store on regular products (we also got some big ticket items there like TVs, etc)

But even as that is true, no matter how much you spend there, if they ever decide to boot you for buying what that particular manager or market manager considers to be 'too much' in terms of MS related Mos and BB loads, etc, then you are done and it doesn't matter what kind of store customer you have been.

It comes down to a particular store or market and what kind of attention or negative issues are being raised when any particular person is there. If MO activity is seen as a problem they will likely stop that person from getting them. Could start with a suspicious CSR or CSM, or it could have to do with some glitch or error that causes a cash office rift stemming from the errors being produced from a broken or jammed MO printer. The store could make up a ton of reasons to just not want you around any longer--anything from, we changed our policies to only allow this many per day, to "MoneyGram has banned you til January" to an entire market being told who you are and to not serve you any financial products (if this happens you may get away with going below the $3k per day rule and also sticking to BB loads and BPs, or the use of Kate if you have them in your area).

But if and when Wmts ban you, your only choice is to go out of market--probably further from home or work--to continue the craft. And then you have to wait for store managers and area market managers to move to other parts of the country before you can go back--and for the CSR staff to turn over too, because if any one of them knows you are BAD, they will tell the others. As 'schooly' as it may seem, the fact is that all it takes is some closed minded, over protecting, security zealot of a fear-based CSR to say he or she THINKS you are involved with some sort of fraud, and the wheels start spinning in a negative direction.

This is why being a friendly, social and courteous customer can help. Then again, if and when there is a problem, it don't matter how nice that manager or csr is with you, you get outed.

***

Additionally, this OV thing is interesting to me... some feel it is a plan by Wmt and Incomm to get rid of MSers. Could be in part--it's maybe involving a business decision to cut out what either entity sees as fat so as to save a buck. I think they simply upgraded or downgraded their software to be like some other retailers that happen to see certain card sequences as credit rather than debit. Either way it has to do with volume and we don't want to overwhelm any one type of entity if we can help it.

Does a law make it so the Vanilla cards have to have debit on them? Yes. But do all stores need to accept them? I dunno. Maybe not. After all those stores could always use the "yeah but we suspected fraud with these things" and get out of most any inquiry on the matter.

So my advice is to only buy what you know you can burn and stop even trying to do anything Vanilla at the retail giant because it tends to be a frustrating PITA, but please do not publish specifics on where they might work either. That type of non-thought-through move only points the evil eyes at those places too.

You are under no obligation to share such sensitive details in here, but yeah go ahead and tell those you get close to like friends, but do it not on public blogs and boards. Then this stuff will last. We all want it to last, right?

Use PMs and email for sensitive info please!! Don't be lazy and just post stuff here because it's easier than doing it with each individual.

Yes, the debate goes on about things like, "well how do we get to know things then," or, "I like to share so people share with me," etc... but the fact is that for those of you who do care about and know how to carefully manage the MSing you do with the stores you visit, the over sharing--the type that just blasts data our there with no regard to how it's managed--is doing damage to all of us.

I've been MOing at Wmt since 2004. Lots has changed. In those days nobody ever asked to see the cards I was using. Now they do. I can't say I have seen every possible situation there is, but I have sure witnessed a lot of them.

Stay MS thirsty my friends.

MM
Marathon Man is offline  
Old Aug 26, 2014, 5:25 am
  #2426  
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 647
Originally Posted by Marathon Man
my wmts are not so close to nor convenient to my home. But then, not everything is.

That said, I definitely ONLY really shop at wmt BECAUSE I happen to also get MOs there. Oh if we find an item online that can ship to store like the outside small set up pool or the kids trampoline, we will go there too, but then when I am at the store I get MOs.

Generally I only use the store because they have MOs and if Mos stopped existing I likely would not go. I had a couple years when I went so much I also spent a couple grand in the store on regular products (we also got some big ticket items there like TVs, etc)

But even as that is true, no matter how much you spend there, if they ever decide to boot you for buying what that particular manager or market manager considers to be 'too much' in terms of MS related Mos and BB loads, etc, then you are done and it doesn't matter what kind of store customer you have been.

It comes down to a particular store or market and what kind of attention or negative issues are being raised when any particular person is there. If MO activity is seen as a problem they will likely stop that person from getting them. Could start with a suspicious CSR or CSM, or it could have to do with some glitch or error that causes a cash office rift stemming from the errors being produced from a broken or jammed MO printer. The store could make up a ton of reasons to just not want you around any longer--anything from, we changed our policies to only allow this many per day, to "MoneyGram has banned you til January" to an entire market being told who you are and to not serve you any financial products (if this happens you may get away with going below the $3k per day rule and also sticking to BB loads and BPs, or the use of Kate if you have them in your area).

But if and when Wmts ban you, your only choice is to go out of market--probably further from home or work--to continue the craft. And then you have to wait for store managers and area market managers to move to other parts of the country before you can go back--and for the CSR staff to turn over too, because if any one of them knows you are BAD, they will tell the others. As 'schooly' as it may seem, the fact is that all it takes is some closed minded, over protecting, security zealot of a fear-based CSR to say he or she THINKS you are involved with some sort of fraud, and the wheels start spinning in a negative direction.

This is why being a friendly, social and courteous customer can help. Then again, if and when there is a problem, it don't matter how nice that manager or csr is with you, you get outed.

***

Additionally, this OV thing is interesting to me... some feel it is a plan by Wmt and Incomm to get rid of MSers. Could be in part--it's maybe involving a business decision to cut out what either entity sees as fat so as to save a buck. I think they simply upgraded or downgraded their software to be like some other retailers that happen to see certain card sequences as credit rather than debit. Either way it has to do with volume and we don't want to overwhelm any one type of entity if we can help it.

Does a law make it so the Vanilla cards have to have debit on them? Yes. But do all stores need to accept them? I dunno. Maybe not. After all those stores could always use the "yeah but we suspected fraud with these things" and get out of most any inquiry on the matter.

So my advice is to only buy what you know you can burn and stop even trying to do anything Vanilla at the retail giant because it tends to be a frustrating PITA, but please do not publish specifics on where they might work either. That type of non-thought-through move only points the evil eyes at those places too.

You are under no obligation to share such sensitive details in here, but yeah go ahead and tell those you get close to like friends, but do it not on public blogs and boards. Then this stuff will last. We all want it to last, right?

Use PMs and email for sensitive info please!! Don't be lazy and just post stuff here because it's easier than doing it with each individual.

Yes, the debate goes on about things like, "well how do we get to know things then," or, "I like to share so people share with me," etc... but the fact is that for those of you who do care about and know how to carefully manage the MSing you do with the stores you visit, the over sharing--the type that just blasts data our there with no regard to how it's managed--is doing damage to all of us.

I've been MOing at Wmt since 2004. Lots has changed. In those days nobody ever asked to see the cards I was using. Now they do. I can't say I have seen every possible situation there is, but I have sure witnessed a lot of them.

Stay MS thirsty my friends.

MM
<<Slow Clap> building to
kingrat is offline  
Old Aug 26, 2014, 7:25 am
  #2427  
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Rockford, IL
Programs: Hyatt, Hilton Diamond
Posts: 35
So FYI. In Chicago area literally just now, went to wmt to load some simon GC at Kate. While there thought I'd give VO one shot. I loaded 3/3 first try VO. Went to test cashier and loaded first try as well. All VO worked 1st swipe.
gbplesh is offline  
Old Aug 26, 2014, 7:26 am
  #2428  
 
Join Date: May 2014
Location: PHL
Programs: SW CP, SPG Gold, Hilton Gold
Posts: 571
Originally Posted by gbplesh
So FYI. In Chicago area literally just now, went to wmt to load some simon GC at Kate. While there thought I'd give VO one shot. I loaded 3/3 first try VO. Went to test cashier and loaded first try as well. All VO worked 1st swipe.
You mean OV?
ftomasze is offline  
Old Aug 26, 2014, 7:29 am
  #2429  
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Rockford, IL
Programs: Hyatt, Hilton Diamond
Posts: 35
Haha yes One Vanilla cards I bought from CVS last week.
Originally Posted by ftomasze
You mean OV?
gbplesh is offline  
Old Aug 26, 2014, 7:29 am
  #2430  
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 9
Hmm, these new reports of OVs and VVGCs working again are encouraging. It sounds as if they are less flaky too.
carby is offline  

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