Jul 17, 2014, 9:40 am
Last edit by: NewbieRunner
WELCOME, MODERATOR GUIDELINES and SUMMARY
PLEASE READ BEFORE POSTING
If you are new to us, welcome to FlyerTalk! Who we are: FlyerTalk features discussions and chat boards that covers the most up-to-date traveler information; an interactive community dedicated to the topic of travel (not politics or arguments about politics or religion, etc.)
All travelers are welcome in the community. Just choose a forum: conversing about airlines and their programs, airports, destinations, dining and how to make the most of your miles and points, or visit our Information Desk to start.
We do have some Rules, and everyone agrees to abide by these when they are granted free membership privileges. On a topic that generates a lot of feelings and perspectives, please remember "welcoming, respectful" are key words on FlyerTalk.
As with the earlier MH370 thread, please observe the following in this thread:
1. The normal FT Rules apply. (Including not discussing moderation actions on-thread). And please be particularly attentive to "discussing the idea and not the poster" when you have a disagreement. Civility and mutual respect are still expected and are what we owe each other as a community.
2. You are expected to respect our diversity, and therefore refrain from posting inflammatory comments about race, religion, culture, politics, ethnicity, orientation, etc." Do not cite, copy, or report on such.
3. Please do continue to be attentive to the sensibilities of the families of those on the flight. Think about if you were them what you would and would not want to see posted. Speculation about what happened is permissible; please, though, do not indulge in inflammatory or overly-lurid descriptions or depictions (or links to same) that could well be hurtful.
4. Overly / extravagantly exaggerative posts such as conspiracy theories, posts beyond the realm of science and known facts, etc. as well as posts with information that has been posted several times previously may be summarily deleted. Moderator actions may not be discussed in posts on FlyerTalk.
5. In addition, those who repeatedly fail to comply with FlyerTalk Rules or the guidelines for this thread, may be subjected to FlyerTalk disciplinary actions and have membership privileges suspended, forum masks, etc.
FT MH 017 / Other Asian, Australian, and South Pacific Forum Moderation Team:
ABroadAbroad
cblaisd
JDiver
NewbieRunner
for the MH 17 Moderation Team
N.B. PLEASE do not alter the contents of this moderator note.
N. B. PLEASE SEE THE FAQ IN POST NO. 1.
OTHER FORA OF INTEREST:
This thread is about the loss of MH 17. In depth discussion of unrelated topics — geopolitics, passport theft, aviation security, airport security procedures, etc. — belongs in other fora. A few include:
OMNI/PR: Discussion of perspectives on politics and religion, including geopolitics and terrorism (requires 180 days on FT and 180 constructive posts prior to admission)
If you wish to discuss the politics and political implications related to this issue (or others), please do so in OMNI/PR; the MH 777 Crashes In Ukraine - Official In Kiev Claims Airliner Shot Down By Separatists thread is the place.
Travel Safety/Security: Checkpoints and Borders Policy Debate (including routing passenger aircraft over conflict areas).
Travel Safety/Security: Practical Travel Safety Issues for those discussing travel safety and security issues because they are planning a trip soon (including passport and nationality issues).
TravelBuzz: TravelBuzz for those wishing to discuss the relative safety of a specific aircraft - e.g. Boeing 777.
Further posts regarding any of these issues are liable to summary deletion.
This thread is about the loss of MH 17. In depth discussion of unrelated topics — geopolitics, passport theft, aviation security, airport security procedures, etc. — belongs in other fora. A few include:
OMNI/PR: Discussion of perspectives on politics and religion, including geopolitics and terrorism (requires 180 days on FT and 180 constructive posts prior to admission)
If you wish to discuss the politics and political implications related to this issue (or others), please do so in OMNI/PR; the MH 777 Crashes In Ukraine - Official In Kiev Claims Airliner Shot Down By Separatists thread is the place.
Travel Safety/Security: Checkpoints and Borders Policy Debate (including routing passenger aircraft over conflict areas).
Travel Safety/Security: Practical Travel Safety Issues for those discussing travel safety and security issues because they are planning a trip soon (including passport and nationality issues).
TravelBuzz: TravelBuzz for those wishing to discuss the relative safety of a specific aircraft - e.g. Boeing 777.
Further posts regarding any of these issues are liable to summary deletion.
Thank you.
Malaysia Airlines MH 17 crash in Ukraine (17 July 2014 - PLEASE READ WIKI, FAQ)
Jul 17, 2014, 2:48 pm
#496
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: San Marcos, CA
Programs: DL - DM MM / UA - PP / LH - SEN / Marriott - AMB-LTT / Avis - PC
Posts: 342
I always keep my passport on me. One of my friends once witnessed a failed theft attempt aboard a trans-pac flight (thief tried to steal a laptop out of an overhead bin bag, but dropped it on the pax who was the owner...)
There's also FT stories of laptops disappearing, etc. These days.
That said, I'd guess that these passports were scavenged and collected/compiled. Is it that implausible? Not everyone is as "ick" about dead bodies...
There's also FT stories of laptops disappearing, etc. These days.
That said, I'd guess that these passports were scavenged and collected/compiled. Is it that implausible? Not everyone is as "ick" about dead bodies...
I'm sure it's completely plausible that they're scavenged or removed from personal belongings, but why? Nevermind...there really doesn't need to be a why.
Jul 17, 2014, 2:49 pm
#497
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Amsterdam, Netherlands
Programs: KL Gold, SQ KF Gold, CX Green
Posts: 9,399
BREAKING: Malaysia Airlines MH17 crash in Ukraine (July 2014)
Press conference @ AMS now: 283 pax and 15 crew.
27 pax nationality unknown
154 Dutch
22 Malaysian
27 Australian
11 Indonesian
6 British
4 German
4 Belgian
1 Canadian
All crew were Malaysian
27 pax nationality unknown
154 Dutch
22 Malaysian
27 Australian
11 Indonesian
6 British
4 German
4 Belgian
1 Canadian
All crew were Malaysian
Jul 17, 2014, 2:49 pm
#498
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: ORD
Programs: UA Silver, Marriott Platinum/LT Platinum, Hilton Gold
Posts: 5,594
I always keep my passport on me. One of my friends once witnessed a failed theft attempt aboard a trans-pac flight (thief tried to steal a laptop out of an overhead bin bag, but dropped it on the pax who was the owner...)
There's also FT stories of laptops disappearing, etc. These days.
That said, I'd guess that these passports were scavenged and collected/compiled. Is it that implausible? Not everyone is as "ick" about dead bodies...
There's also FT stories of laptops disappearing, etc. These days.
That said, I'd guess that these passports were scavenged and collected/compiled. Is it that implausible? Not everyone is as "ick" about dead bodies...
I have a friend whose passport was in a bag in the overhead bin, she slept on the flight, and when deplaning found the passport and a few valuables gone.
I've also heard that passport theft is a booming business in general but that's more anecdotal, which is why I think its likely these passports were scavenged and photographed.
Jul 17, 2014, 2:50 pm
#499
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 552
I do not understand why since the east Ukranian conflict last April, flight paths are still over the area.
Airspace over every conflict or war area has to be closed, in this case since last April.
Now when a tragic accident has happened, I now see on Flightaware that LH, KL, AF are avoiding Ukraine. Flights KL809 (AMS-KUL) and KL835 (AMS-SIN) are flying over Denmark.
Airspace over every conflict or war area has to be closed, in this case since last April.
Now when a tragic accident has happened, I now see on Flightaware that LH, KL, AF are avoiding Ukraine. Flights KL809 (AMS-KUL) and KL835 (AMS-SIN) are flying over Denmark.
Jul 17, 2014, 2:50 pm
#500
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Amsterdam, Netherlands
Programs: KL Gold, SQ KF Gold, CX Green
Posts: 9,399
BREAKING: Malaysia Airlines MH17 crash in Ukraine (July 2014)
MH 747 will fly KUL to Kiev later today. Team to remain in Ukraine, B747 to continue to AMS to pick up family that wants to go to Ukraine
Jul 17, 2014, 2:50 pm
#502
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 74
I always keep my passport on me. One of my friends once witnessed a failed theft attempt aboard a trans-pac flight (thief tried to steal a laptop out of an overhead bin bag, but dropped it on the pax who was the owner...)
There's also FT stories of laptops disappearing, etc. These days.
That said, I'd guess that these passports were scavenged and collected/compiled. Is it that implausible? Not everyone is as "ick" about dead bodies...
There's also FT stories of laptops disappearing, etc. These days.
That said, I'd guess that these passports were scavenged and collected/compiled. Is it that implausible? Not everyone is as "ick" about dead bodies...
Jul 17, 2014, 2:52 pm
#503
Moderator: American AAdvantage
Original Poster
Join Date: May 2000
Location: NorCal - SMF area
Programs: AA LT Plat; HH LT Diamond, Maître-plongeur des Muccis
Posts: 62,948
Jul 17, 2014, 2:52 pm
#504
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: ORD/PSP
Programs: AA LT Plat, 6.0 MM, Marriott LT Platinum
Posts: 1,002
Possibly captured from the eastern Ukrainian air base they overran a week or two ago, IIRC.
Looks like some over eager moron thought he was shooting down a troop transport, got a passenger plane instead. Ooops, not so good for the cause.
Looks like some over eager moron thought he was shooting down a troop transport, got a passenger plane instead. Ooops, not so good for the cause.
Jul 17, 2014, 2:52 pm
#505
Join Date: May 2001
Location: SYD
Programs: SK,BA,QF,AA, HH, IGH
Posts: 276
Whether it will be the same this time around is yet to be seen (although images of the crew manifest are already circulating).
Jul 17, 2014, 2:54 pm
#506
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 74
I just can't picture the rebels with the kind of training to down a commercial airliner flying at 33,000 feet. What scares me more is that the Russian military was responsible, which means SB Putin was involved or at least have them the authorization to do so. Russia is not a thrid-world banana republic, so it's hard to imagine that SB Putin not having total control of the military.
Jul 17, 2014, 2:54 pm
#507
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Chicago USA
Programs: *A Junkie, SQ PPS, Skywards Gold, 2 Million Mile Flyer;*wood LT Plat, BA MM
Posts: 1,762
Mine is always in pocket, regardless of if I'm on a plane...It's one of those things while on international travel I check by feel 'wallet, passport, phone'.
The videos of all the near-pristine condition passports found is interesting. Did they come off bodies? Did they leave seatback pockets? I can't imagine them flying out of rollerboards or backpacks...
The videos of all the near-pristine condition passports found is interesting. Did they come off bodies? Did they leave seatback pockets? I can't imagine them flying out of rollerboards or backpacks...
What happened is disgusting. Those of us who fly to Europe to Middle East/SE Asia often know our flights pass over this region. It could have been any flight.
Jul 17, 2014, 2:55 pm
#508
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Aussie in ORD
Programs: Marriott Plat, Ua Gold, GE.. Sucker for punishment
Posts: 4,237
I know that this sounds very shallow, and it is, but seeing than many Aussies on board chills my soul.. I imagine many were connecting in KL on the way home.. Here but for fate it could have been a loved one (and I am checking now!)
Makes me mad and sad and sick all at the same time.. I only hope, that if this was the act of some one or people, that they are bought to quick and appropriate justice.
Jul 17, 2014, 2:56 pm
#509
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: San Marcos, CA
Programs: DL - DM MM / UA - PP / LH - SEN / Marriott - AMB-LTT / Avis - PC
Posts: 342
...Speaking from recent personal and professional experience, the 'next of kin' notification process is a crock of you know what.
Jul 17, 2014, 2:56 pm
#510
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Mar 2013
Programs: DL PM, MR Titanium/LTP, Hilton Diamond
Posts: 10,130
How are the nationalities of 27 of the passengers unknown? I assume MH / Amsterdam requires passengers to provide passport information prior to boarding the plane.