The flying torture chamber: EW nonstop BER/STR-DXB

Old Aug 21, 23, 9:59 am
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The flying torture chamber: EW nonstop BER/STR-DXB

If you like to punish yourself: EW nonstop on A320neo BER-DXB, starting 30 October, STR-DXB starting 29 October. Seems to be EW proper, not 4Y, therefore no widebody with C or PE
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Old Aug 21, 23, 11:13 am
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What's the seat pitch? 30 inches? 32 inches?
BER-DXB is about the same distance as transcontinental flights in the US, and Frontier operate those flights with a 28 inch seat pitch.
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Old Aug 21, 23, 1:53 pm
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A flight to rival LOTs MAX service from WAW-DXB!
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Old Aug 21, 23, 2:26 pm
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European airlines are finally lesrning their lesson from their USA airlines where narrow bodies are regular things on up to 6hr flights and some airlines for south american are doing this on 7+ hours flights ...

This is really bad for passangers looking for flat seats but some airlines like Copa have flat seats in 737 max.
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Old Aug 21, 23, 4:17 pm
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Originally Posted by curt
If you like to punish yourself: EW nonstop on A320neo BER-DXB, starting 30 October, STR-DXB starting 29 October. Seems to be EW proper, not 4Y, therefore no widebody with C or PE
And? People will fly these. So what if there are no lie-flat options - are we this spoiled? Have flown longer flight in distances in the back.
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Old Aug 21, 23, 5:31 pm
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Originally Posted by josephniezbedny
European airlines are finally lesrning their lesson from their USA airlines where narrow bodies are regular things on up to 6hr flights and some airlines for south american are doing this on 7+ hours flights ...

This is really bad for passangers looking for flat seats but some airlines like Copa have flat seats in 737 max.
This is correct. With bad headwinds, some of these US flights can reach over 7 hours.

Ryanair / EJ also have a few flights around 6 hours.
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Old Aug 21, 23, 5:46 pm
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Originally Posted by danielflyer
This is correct. With bad headwinds, some of these US flights can reach over 7 hours.

Ryanair / EJ also have a few flights around 6 hours.
even without headwinds gol is flying mia - for on narrow body. Copa is also doing pty - sfo on 737 max. United/Delta/AA have flights from EWR to BOG which takea 6hr.
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Old Aug 21, 23, 6:06 pm
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Originally Posted by josephniezbedny
even without headwinds gol is flying mia - for on narrow body. Copa is also doing pty - sfo on 737 max. United/Delta/AA have flights from EWR to BOG which takea 6hr.
There are some domestic flights which start and end in the same country with 7 hours+ of flying time, and never even goes over water.
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Old Aug 22, 23, 12:30 am
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Originally Posted by Repooc17
And? People will fly these. So what if there are no lie-flat options - are we this spoiled? Have flown longer flight in distances in the back.
Im sure there is a massive difference between flying an A330 or even a 777 in economy, and flying a low cost in an A320 with slimline seats that probably dont even recline.
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Old Aug 22, 23, 12:49 am
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Originally Posted by Repooc17
And? People will fly these. So what if there are no lie-flat options - are we this spoiled? Have flown longer flight in distances in the back.
Its not about flying in the back. Its not about flying longhaul in a narrowbody (flew some transatlantic flights on a 707). Its about the horrible seats EW uses in the A320 (the seats in the NEOs are only marginally better than the seats in the CEOs).
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Old Aug 22, 23, 1:30 am
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Originally Posted by Deckter
Im sure there is a massive difference between flying an A330 or even a 777 in economy, and flying a low cost in an A320 with slimline seats that probably dont even recline.
Originally Posted by curt
Its not about flying in the back. Its not about flying longhaul in a narrowbody (flew some transatlantic flights on a 707). Its about the horrible seats EW uses in the A320 (the seats in the NEOs are only marginally better than the seats in the CEOs).
Wow, do you guys even read what I had posted? Where did I even indicate anything about widebody? I was talking about narrowbody long haul in excess of Germany to UAE in distance and travel time. It's fine. People will survive.

I have flown from east coast US all the way to Alaska in a narrowbody. About 8 hours. I have flown EW, and it was fine with me.

I would rather be in a 3-3 narrowbody than a 10 across widebody.
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Old Aug 22, 23, 2:30 am
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Originally Posted by AirborneLocksmith
What's the seat pitch? 30 inches? 32 inches?
BER-DXB is about the same distance as transcontinental flights in the US, and Frontier operate those flights with a 28 inch seat pitch.
The first few rows - up to the exit rows - in these have 30-inch pitch, the seats behind the exit rows have 29 inches, and the last two rows (31 and 32) are the same as Frontier or Ryanair with 28 inches.
With Frontier, "Stretch seating" has 23-33 inches of pitch and costs way less than LH/EW charge for "BizClass" tickets that'll cram you into a cramped 30in-pitch seat.
I`d rather fly a transcon on Frontier upfront than to DXB on one of these.
And I`d rather sit on a train to FRA for an hour and 15 minutes (ex STR) and fly EK on a nicely comfortable aircraft that offers lie-flat seats in business and 33" of pitch in Y.


Originally Posted by Repooc17
Wow, do you guys even read what I had posted? Where did I even indicate anything about widebody? I was talking about narrowbody long haul in excess of Germany to UAE in distance and travel time. It's fine. People will survive.

I have flown from east coast US all the way to Alaska in a narrowbody. About 8 hours. I have flown EW, and it was fine with me.

I would rather be in a 3-3 narrowbody than a 10 across widebody.
OK, then, please fly one of these in the last row for seven hours and report back on the experience.
Narrowbodies are OK even for longer-distance flights, even transatlantic flights, but LH/EW's offer of 28" pitch in Y (for OK money) or 30" pitch in slimline, minimally padded seats (for a ton of money!) as found on these is not.
SAS, JetBlue or TAP who all fly TATL on narrowbodies do it better - there's proper business class seats for those willing to pay, and premium seating in Y offering at least 33" pitch for a decent upcharge. SASplus - a 2-2 premium economy offering that's available at the same price point than the "BizClass" product on EW has 38" pitch and is a totally different game with flights this long.

I just hope that this strategy backfires. and especially high-revenue customers stay away from those flights so they'll have to rethink this.
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Old Aug 22, 23, 2:41 am
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This is to compete with the flights others offer on narrowbodies to from Europe to DXB/DWC: Condor already does DXB from BER 2x weekly in an A320 similar to DWC - AMS (Transavia 737) LUX (LG 737) MXP (Neos 737) or Flydubai 737 from DXB to SZG. People evidently have no problem to do 6h in economy on a narrowbody.
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Old Aug 22, 23, 2:57 am
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Originally Posted by bhomburg
[]

I just hope that this strategy backfires. and especially high-revenue customers stay away from those flights so they'll have to rethink this.
Why?

Its not that they force you onto those planes. Its an LH Group alternative to the LCCs mentioned by oliver2002.
There apparently is a market and they try to get their share of it, From a German perspective rather EW should do these flights than their foreign competitors.

If youre not their target group: fine. You can still fly mainline LH, LX or OS with (in case of LH arguably &#128521 proper J class. The flying masses may be happy to have another cheap(er) option.
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Old Aug 22, 23, 3:16 am
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Originally Posted by oliver2002
People evidently have no problem to do 6h in economy on a narrowbody.
Or no clue.

Originally Posted by Repooc17
I have flown from east coast US all the way to Alaska in a narrowbody. About 8 hours.
With a legacy carrier such as AS or DL? Or with an LCC such as Frontier?

The seat pitch and ultra-thin seaseat padding on European LCC might be fine for that 70 min flight, but I have to agree with previous posters it is brutal for those long flights to the ME.

I actually predict W6 will have more success with this model than other carriers. They have the routes with people which MUST travel to DXB for work or an important family event but cannot afford anything pricier than W6.

However, in my mind this model is not a sustainable one ex STR or BER. Yes, you will get some 18 to twenty-something year olds who want that price point and whose bodies can take the abuse. But I don't see families or business people from STR booking this repeatedly. Fool me once, fool me twice...
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