Go Back  FlyerTalk Forums > Miles&Points > Airlines and Mileage Programs > Lufthansa, Austrian, Swiss, Brussels, LOT and Other Partners | Miles & More
Reload this Page >

LH F is a disgrace: related to the cost cutting [split off from F champagne thread]

LH F is a disgrace: related to the cost cutting [split off from F champagne thread]

Old Nov 20, 2022, 10:41 am
  #1  
Original Poster
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Programs: LH M&M, BA EC, DL SM
Posts: 5,626
LH F is a disgrace: related to the cost cutting [split off from F champagne thread]

Originally Posted by GalaxyChris
LH is a disgrace.
Their wine list is not always matching their competition's, but I wouldn't call the whole airline a disgrace. Often gets me to where I need to go much faster than QR or EK, and I would rather not add an extra X hours to my trips to be able to spend even more time in a lounge in Qatar, just because they serve better bubbly.
worldclubber is offline  
Old Nov 20, 2022, 2:44 pm
  #2  
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: ZRH
Programs: QR Gold / M&M FTL / Marriott Bonvoy Titanium
Posts: 650
Originally Posted by worldclubber
Their wine list is not always matching their competition's, but I wouldn't call the whole airline a disgrace. Often gets me to where I need to go much faster than QR or EK, and I would rather not add an extra X hours to my trips to be able to spend even more time in a lounge in Qatar, just because they serve better bubbly.
You are right, when I say disgrace it's related of the cost cutting (no more lounge in many outstations, customer service NA, IT problems, business class seat so much outdated) and my own experience as traveller.
I am flying obviously less than you and I just try to select the best possibility where I am flying,

i.e. Adding more time (2-3h) for flying between Europe - Asia is not a problem for me, if I get a much better experience.

​​​​

Last edited by GalaxyChris; Nov 20, 2022 at 4:27 pm
GalaxyChris is offline  
Old Nov 20, 2022, 3:48 pm
  #3  
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: NYC -- UA 1K; SPG Platinum; HH Diamond.
Posts: 2,908
Considering what LHG charges for F, the list is a disgrace.
NYC1 is online now  
Old Nov 20, 2022, 8:39 pm
  #4  
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Programs: Hyatt Lifetime Globalist, SQ PPS Solitaire
Posts: 3,598
Originally Posted by worldclubber
(...) I wouldn't call the whole airline a disgrace. Often gets me to where I need to go much faster than QR or EK (...)
The whole airline is a disgrace:

- one of the worst hard products in J
- no customer orientation
- response time to HON/SEN feedback unacceptable
- incompetent call centre
- zero flexibility/goodwill and zero empowerment for any staff to make things work

You don't have to run an airline into the ground claiming your flights reach their destinations faster than competition.
Unterwegs, Grog, cas_de and 2 others like this.
SMK77 is offline  
Old Nov 21, 2022, 1:09 am
  #5  
Original Poster
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Programs: LH M&M, BA EC, DL SM
Posts: 5,626
Originally Posted by SMK77
The whole airline is a disgrace:

- one of the worst hard products in J
- no customer orientation
- response time to HON/SEN feedback unacceptable
- incompetent call centre
- zero flexibility/goodwill and zero empowerment for any staff to make things work

You don't have to run an airline into the ground claiming your flights reach their destinations faster than competition.
I agree with you on most of your bullet points, and avoid flying J long-haul, but have experienced similar issues concerning customer service with other many airlines (most recently AF). And as much as I like Krug, flying QR from my home airport in Germany to North America (where I need to go most often) -- let alone to Vienna, London or Rome -- is just not an option.

Many things have gone downhill with LHG, but not much more so than for most (European) competitors. Took LH/LX F to North America about once a month recently and couldn't complain too much as long as nothing out of the ordinary happened; they usually fed me well at the lounge, drove me to the plane in a Porsche, got me where I needed to go without any major detour, on a flat bed, and I could always find something to eat after the caviar that I liked and (after tasting the whole list) was usually also able to identify at least one white and one red that I enjoyed. Could things be better? Absolutely! Is it so bad that I would fly Germany-Qatar-North America instead of direct to drink a glass of Krug? Not really, would buy a bottle of Krug and enjoy it with my family, while others are still waiting for their connecting flight in the desert. YMMV
mag, f4freeJunior, athome and 1 others like this.
worldclubber is offline  
Old Nov 21, 2022, 1:38 am
  #6  
Moderator: Lufthansa Miles & More, India based airlines, India, External Miles & Points Resources
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: MUC
Programs: LH SEN
Posts: 48,132
QR restarted their F because they leased some CX B777 They used to have Krug in the Al-M lounge on request... those were the days... Filet in the dining area... the red wine there was stellar too.
oliver2002 is offline  
Old Nov 21, 2022, 5:06 pm
  #7  
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Programs: Hyatt Lifetime Globalist, SQ PPS Solitaire
Posts: 3,598
Originally Posted by worldclubber
I agree with you on most of your bullet points, and avoid flying J long-haul, but have experienced similar issues concerning customer service with other many airlines (most recently AF). And as much as I like Krug, flying QR from my home airport in Germany to North America (where I need to go most often) -- let alone to Vienna, London or Rome -- is just not an option.

Many things have gone downhill with LHG, but not much more so than for most (European) competitors. Took LH/LX F to North America about once a month recently and couldn't complain too much as long as nothing out of the ordinary happened; they usually fed me well at the lounge, drove me to the plane in a Porsche, got me where I needed to go without any major detour, on a flat bed, and I could always find something to eat after the caviar that I liked and (after tasting the whole list) was usually also able to identify at least one white and one red that I enjoyed. Could things be better? Absolutely! Is it so bad that I would fly Germany-Qatar-North America instead of direct to drink a glass of Krug? Not really, would buy a bottle of Krug and enjoy it with my family, while others are still waiting for their connecting flight in the desert. YMMV
Smart people fly straight from Frankfurt to the US by using Singapore Airlines. I have always gotten my bottle of Krug and excellent service on the ground and in the air.
SMK77 is offline  
Old Nov 21, 2022, 5:42 pm
  #8  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: BOS/EAP
Programs: UA 1K, MR LTT, HH Dia, Amex Plat
Posts: 31,978
Originally Posted by SMK77
Smart people fly straight from Frankfurt to the US by using Singapore Airlines. I have always gotten my bottle of Krug and excellent service on the ground and in the air.
only really working well if you need to go to NYC. Connecting via LGA/EWR is a pain oif you fly to JFK
athome and worldclubber like this.
cfischer is offline  
Old Nov 21, 2022, 6:12 pm
  #9  
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: BOM-SIN-EWR
Programs: UA*G (1K again), Sixt Plat, *was*: SQ QPP01 & SK EBS/EBG, LH SEN, AA EXP, 9wPlat
Posts: 8,606
Originally Posted by worldclubber
...while others are still waiting for their connecting flight in the desert. YMMV
Love the desert statement!

The one time I connected at DOH recently (with *no aerobridges* for wide-bodies), I could not help but look out the window at the desolate scene below...it is TRULY a desert!!

(QR Biz) Lounge sucked - prefer the SEN lounges myself...

LX F is definitely an option as you have stated.

Originally Posted by SMK77
Smart people fly straight from Frankfurt to the US by using Singapore Airlines. I have always gotten my bottle of Krug and excellent service on the ground and in the air.
Originally Posted by cfischer
only really working well if you need to go to NYC. Connecting via LGA/EWR is a pain oif you fly to JFK
Both correct and smart statements - to which I concur as well...

Last edited by SuperFlyBoy; Nov 21, 2022 at 6:15 pm Reason: Clarity...
SuperFlyBoy is offline  
Old Nov 21, 2022, 8:20 pm
  #10  
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Programs: Hyatt Lifetime Globalist, SQ PPS Solitaire
Posts: 3,598
Originally Posted by cfischer
only really working well if you need to go to NYC. Connecting via LGA/EWR is a pain oif you fly to JFK
If the alternative is flying via DOH, you can easily plan a comfortable airport change in New York and still get to your US-destination faster.
SMK77 is offline  
Old Nov 22, 2022, 12:50 am
  #11  
Original Poster
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Programs: LH M&M, BA EC, DL SM
Posts: 5,626
Originally Posted by SMK77
If the alternative is flying via DOH, you can easily plan a comfortable airport change in New York and still get to your US-destination faster.
Did the airport change JFK-EWR just three weeks ago and made a mental note: stupid idea, don't ever think about doing this again!

SQ just doesn't get me to where I need to go in North America most of the time. Will fly them to down under soon, as usual, connecting from LX F.
Viennafly, athome and dtbe like this.
worldclubber is offline  
Old Nov 22, 2022, 2:08 am
  #12  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Stoke on Trent, UK (MAN ), BUE, BKK, DBV
Programs: LH HON***,UA,BA.EK Gold,AV.
Posts: 11,581
Compared to what it was pre pandemic LH F is a disgrace.

Old F hard product.

Cost cuts in F soft product.

Poor response time for HON.

Zero flexibility, no F awards even for HON on most routes, no A availability for HON on most routes.

FCL B remains closed at FRA & Satellite at MUC.

Thankfully things are running normally over at LX
HKG1111 and Harper50505 like this.
chris63 is offline  
Old Nov 22, 2022, 4:32 am
  #13  
 
Join Date: Nov 2018
Location: BRU
Programs: LH HON**
Posts: 379
Yet pricing has gone bananas: looking at flights six months out with somewhat flexible dates and F is €8-10k on LH and €9-11k on LX (with 5-8 seats for sale) while C is around €6-7k.

Value for money?
chris63 and Harper50505 like this.
Vixit is offline  
Old Nov 22, 2022, 5:58 am
  #14  
Original Poster
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Programs: LH M&M, BA EC, DL SM
Posts: 5,626
Originally Posted by Vixit
Yet pricing has gone bananas: looking at flights six months out with somewhat flexible dates and F is €8-10k on LH and €9-11k on LX (with 5-8 seats for sale) while C is around €6-7k.

Value for money?
Market forces. Carsten S. said in an interview quoted above that there are just not enough F seats and they always sell out, even at 20k a piece. Not something I particularly like, but high demand and little availability means high prices.
worldclubber is offline  
Old Nov 22, 2022, 6:07 am
  #15  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Stoke on Trent, UK (MAN ), BUE, BKK, DBV
Programs: LH HON***,UA,BA.EK Gold,AV.
Posts: 11,581
Originally Posted by Vixit
Yet pricing has gone bananas: looking at flights six months out with somewhat flexible dates and F is €8-10k on LH and €9-11k on LX (with 5-8 seats for sale) while C is around €6-7k.

Value for money?
Given all the cuts to LH F its not good value
chris63 is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Manage Preferences - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service -

This site is owned, operated, and maintained by MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Designated trademarks are the property of their respective owners.