htb

I had managed to get to flights from NRT-ZRH-FRA on LX later in April with miles. Tickets were issued under a 220* number on 3/10 and a message was sent that there was a schedule change (short haul was moved forward by 10 minutes). I had time until 3/27 to confirm the change, which I did on 3/17.

Now, when I'm checking the flights it says "This flight has been cancelled". Miles have not been returned, no message has been sent out, LX is still flying on the day in question.

I've talked to Miles & More and they said Swiss had taken out the "seats" and the best M&M could do was to refund the miles and money. They also said it's impossible to talk to a supervisor because they are all in home office and can only be reached by email.

Do I have any rights other than getting my money back?

Does anyone else have experience like this with M&M? Apparently this is "a daily occurrence" recently.


Edit: LX did actually cancel all their flights from NRT except for the one on Saturday.

chris63

Disgusting but not surprised, unless you have SEN or HON status it�s almost impossible to get assistance & especially at LX they don�t seem to give a monkeys�.. of course they unilaterally cancelled your contract, you could purchase another ticket & sue for the difference in cost but with award tickets that�s even more challenging

htb

I'll wait a while in the hope of hearing anything back from M&M, but being stuck in Tokyo without return ticket, I'll probably have no other choice than to purchase a new ticket and sue for reimbursement. But that's already where it begins: who do I sue?
M&M says it's a LX matter. LX will say it's a LH ticket and LH will say M&M has issued the ticket, so I should ask them. M&M says, they have special procedures in place and are allowed to give me back my miles and money in this special circumstance... I'm not even sure in which country the ticket was issued: charges were in JPY because the one-way originated in Japan.
Any experience on that? Maybe someone could PM me the contact details of a lawyer in Germany familiar with airline matters?

I've checked availability for paid tickets again -- it looks like LX will only fiy on Saturday now. This doesn*t make the situation any better, but at least it's a "typical" flight cancellation, rather than a mischievous ticket cancellation.

I think the rules for that are much clearer: No compensation since too far in the future -- however, I'm supposed to be offered alternative transportation. Of course, M&M will say "no availability" because no "I" class available. Law would say "doesn't matter, M&M has to buy a revenue ticket, which they will not do". Is my understanding correct so far?

chris63

It is a problem because your a M&M member & when you signed up you agreed to the membership rules, for SEN & certainly HON they would help but they seem very hard on others experiencing issues.
Award availability has probably been removed because of the war in Ukraine & the knock on.

htb

chris63 I'm not sure what "problem" you are describing with the T&Cs. Actually, I couldn't find anything regarding flight cancellations in the T&Cs. It does, however, say that the T&Cs of the airline providing the transport will apply (unless something else is stipulated in the T&Cs of M&M. However, I'm very sure that LX will simply say that it's an LH ticket an LH would have to deal with it. The whole setup is pretty much designed to leave the customer in a vacuum if things go sideways.

chris63

The flights were cancelled, maybe because of the current conflict, they will refund your taxes & fees, no availability within their membership plan, it�s extremely difficult for you & frankly LH group are not doing as much as they can or should be to help in such situations.
Different carriers on partner tickets isn�t helping you either. It�s all designed to get them off as many hooks as possible.

htb

I know that's the situation, but you specifically said I agreed to the T&Cs and that's why I'm out of luck. I don't see anything in the T&Cs of M&M that is covering cancellations. "Refunding miles & money" is not because of "the membership plan" but because they have to under common law.

So I don't see anything "designed" to make life as difficult for me as possible -- just M&M having it the "easy" way because they are used to it. Therefore I'm still interested what the law has to say about flight cancellations (who's responsible in case of cancellation: operating carrier or ticket issuing company, possible contact to an aviation lawyer...).

Looking up T&Cs of SWISS are very clear: if the cancel a flight, I can choose between four options, among those refund or alternative travel. M&M's T&Cs say the operating carriers T&Cs apply, so my question is again: why do you believe that the T&Cs are designed to make it difficult and that "within the membership terms I agreed to" a refund is the only option? I understand that that's they way they handle things because they easily can, but I still don't get it that somehow I screwed up "because your a M&M member & when you signed up you agreed to the membership rules".

daumueller

I disagree on what has been said - given that your flights operate I would push very hard for them to reinstate the tickets.

there is no flight cancellation, your routing isn�t touching Ukraine - hence they have no Legit reason to unilaterally cancel?

oliver2002

If the flight was cancelled they have to accomodate you on an alternative. Call again.

chris63

It�s a membership plan, so of course you agreed to their T&C�s.
You already had their response, they will refund the miles & fees.
You are finding it difficult to contact them, as are MANY others if you follow this forum.
Your ticket & contract was unilaterally cancelled, your redress is the courts if they won�t help, usually you take legal action against the entity you paid.
Yes, a specialist Lawyer would be required in complicated circumstances such as this.

chris63

I agree the OP needs to push hard, they are not making that easy for anyone without SEN plus status & the flights are cancelled, LX only operating Saturday�s.

chris63

Sure but who are you suggesting the OP calls ?

daumueller

it�s not an issue of flight not operating - so I would call m&m again and have them sort it.

oliver2002

M&M, they will sort him out.

gru_muc

In ny experience this is not a matter that should be dealt with via call center. My recommendation for non HON/SEN travelers in cases like this is to ask a lawyer to send a letter or fax to headquarters. No long words - just a very short and polite but clear statement that you request transportation according to the ticket purchased and reserve all rights to claim damages. That should do the trick. Do this as soon as possible.