Nov 12, 2019, 6:52 am
Last edit by: ACflyerDE
The programme will now change from 1 January 2022 (postponed again and it will not start before 2023)
https://www.miles-and-more.com/row/e...ts/update.html
All the changes are listed on the official M&M Website: https://www.miles-and-more.com/de/en...ts/update.html
Starting 2021, the system for earning status changes. From then on, status points are earned by cabin and segment flown:
Regional flights will earn 5 points in Economy and Premium Economy, 10 points in First and Business class per segment
Intercontinental flights, ie flights between two IATA regions, will earn 15 points in Economy, 20 in Premium Economy, 50 in Business and 70 in First class segments
There will be two kinds of points : qualifying points (QP): earned with M&M integrated partners (LH/EW/LX/OS/LO/OU/LG/etc) and normal points : earned with other partners like the airlines in the Star Alliance. QP can be earned on LH Airrail train segments, but are capped at 40/120/250 per year for FTL/SEN/HON.
'Frequent Traveler' (FTL, equivalent to *S) status is given to members with 160 points (of which atleast 80 need to be QP), 'Senator' (SEN, *G) to members with 480 points (of which atleast 240 need to be QP). HON Circle (HON) is awarded after reaching 1500 QP in one year.
SEN will receive two evouchers upon qualification each year, HON 4 evouchers. There will be no rollover of QP, but for members who exceed the qualification QP level, M&M will grant the following benefits:
FTL: Mileage exchange for QP at 200 qualifying points
SEN: 2 eVoucher at 700 qualifying points; 15,000 award miles at 1,000 qualifying points; Frequent Traveller partner card at 1,300 qualifying points
HON:2 eVoucher at 1,800 qualifying points; 30,000 award miles at 2,100 qualifying points; 2 eVoucher at 2,400 qualifying points; Frequent Traveller partner card at 2,700 qualifying points; Senator partner card at 3,000 qualifying points
The system of status miles, HON Circle miles, select miles, and status star points will be abolished at the end of 2020. Any status earned prior to that will be honored. Any HON Circle miles earned in 2020 will be credited as QP in the ratio 200:1. Status star points earned till end of 2020 will converted to lifetime QP at a ration of 2:1.
Members with a lifetime QP of 7500 will be awarded FTL for their lifetime. If members reach 10000 lifetime QP and have been SEN for at least a cumulative 10 years they will be awarded lifetime SEN status.
Status is always valid for the year of qualification and one additional year. HON and SEN will have a 'soft landing' ie if they cannot requalify for status, they will get a year of SEN or FTL respectively.
https://www.miles-and-more.com/row/e...ts/update.html
All the changes are listed on the official M&M Website: https://www.miles-and-more.com/de/en...ts/update.html
Starting 2021, the system for earning status changes. From then on, status points are earned by cabin and segment flown:
Regional flights will earn 5 points in Economy and Premium Economy, 10 points in First and Business class per segment
Intercontinental flights, ie flights between two IATA regions, will earn 15 points in Economy, 20 in Premium Economy, 50 in Business and 70 in First class segments
There will be two kinds of points : qualifying points (QP): earned with M&M integrated partners (LH/EW/LX/OS/LO/OU/LG/etc) and normal points : earned with other partners like the airlines in the Star Alliance. QP can be earned on LH Airrail train segments, but are capped at 40/120/250 per year for FTL/SEN/HON.
'Frequent Traveler' (FTL, equivalent to *S) status is given to members with 160 points (of which atleast 80 need to be QP), 'Senator' (SEN, *G) to members with 480 points (of which atleast 240 need to be QP). HON Circle (HON) is awarded after reaching 1500 QP in one year.
SEN will receive two evouchers upon qualification each year, HON 4 evouchers. There will be no rollover of QP, but for members who exceed the qualification QP level, M&M will grant the following benefits:
FTL: Mileage exchange for QP at 200 qualifying points
SEN: 2 eVoucher at 700 qualifying points; 15,000 award miles at 1,000 qualifying points; Frequent Traveller partner card at 1,300 qualifying points
HON:2 eVoucher at 1,800 qualifying points; 30,000 award miles at 2,100 qualifying points; 2 eVoucher at 2,400 qualifying points; Frequent Traveller partner card at 2,700 qualifying points; Senator partner card at 3,000 qualifying points
The system of status miles, HON Circle miles, select miles, and status star points will be abolished at the end of 2020. Any status earned prior to that will be honored. Any HON Circle miles earned in 2020 will be credited as QP in the ratio 200:1. Status star points earned till end of 2020 will converted to lifetime QP at a ration of 2:1.
Members with a lifetime QP of 7500 will be awarded FTL for their lifetime. If members reach 10000 lifetime QP and have been SEN for at least a cumulative 10 years they will be awarded lifetime SEN status.
Status is always valid for the year of qualification and one additional year. HON and SEN will have a 'soft landing' ie if they cannot requalify for status, they will get a year of SEN or FTL respectively.
New qualifying points system for status from 2024
Nov 12, 2019, 3:37 am
#241
Moderator: Lufthansa Miles & More, India based airlines, India, External Miles & Points Resources
Original Poster
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: MUC
Programs: LH SEN
Posts: 48,158
The average LH customer (see the Demographics of LH passengers ) will probably pony up 500-1000€ extra for a business ticket on his next vacation with the family in Egypt to get the missing 140 QP.
Nov 12, 2019, 3:37 am
#242
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Geneva
Programs: LX SEN, AFKL Platinum, BA Bronze,
Posts: 5,625
Thankfully we can still earn on Adria Airways..
[Apologies, already posted but missed it]
[Apologies, already posted but missed it]
Nov 12, 2019, 3:38 am
#243
Moderator: SAS
Join Date: Feb 2018
Location: BLL & CPH & ZRH
Programs: LX, SK EBD (*G)
Posts: 3,150
Nov 12, 2019, 3:43 am
#244
Moderator: Lufthansa Miles & More, India based airlines, India, External Miles & Points Resources
Original Poster
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: MUC
Programs: LH SEN
Posts: 48,158
If those countries would be regarded as Europe mileage spending would also be based as an inter European flight down there, which also is not the case with M&M today.
In conclusion: I'm am 90% sure Morocco, Tunesia and Algiers will not be regarded as part of Europe, unless M&M decides to change their country and region classification, which I doubt they will do.
PS: Georgia wasn't regarded as an intra European flight by the old earning routes as well (it was also specially marked on the map, but in that case I think they might reclassify those flights to Baku, Yerevan and Tbilisi as intra European, which will lead to the funny tag on flight from baku to ashgabat to be classified as an intercontinental qualifyling 50 point flight
In conclusion: I'm am 90% sure Morocco, Tunesia and Algiers will not be regarded as part of Europe, unless M&M decides to change their country and region classification, which I doubt they will do.
PS: Georgia wasn't regarded as an intra European flight by the old earning routes as well (it was also specially marked on the map, but in that case I think they might reclassify those flights to Baku, Yerevan and Tbilisi as intra European, which will lead to the funny tag on flight from baku to ashgabat to be classified as an intercontinental qualifyling 50 point flight
Don't get too excited with the N. African opportunities, we had this debate a while ago... LH considers their LH 400-799 flights to be 'Interkont'. TUN & ALG are LH 12xx flights. Yesterday we were already thinking alound about the various TUN fares (used to be a favorite HON F run starting point about 10 years ago) and the M&M guy smiled and said that these are in Europe. TIP and CAI will be your sweet spots to investigate... if Libya ever opens up again.
Nov 12, 2019, 3:44 am
#245
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Usually seat 1A, home:Tallinn
Programs: LH -- HON Circle **, IHG Spire Elite, Hilton Diamond, 1865 Voyager
Posts: 470
The majority of frequent flyers / high spenders I know outside Flyertalk will just book (to be precise: will have their corporate travel agency or PA book) whatever the cheapest business fare is available for the route they want to fly. And if the business trip is planned 4 months out this will be P class and if it is tomorrow it is C. None of them buys a D fare because she wants to buy a D fare.
And that is currently only thing why I do need sometimes TA.
Of course, by new system it will not be any more the case.
But 2020 continue as before: all time D / A fare whenever possible and from 2021 A fare or cheapest Business fare.
Nov 12, 2019, 3:45 am
#246
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Capetown
Programs: Marriott Lifetime Plat, IHG and Hilton Diamond, LH SEN, BA Gold
Posts: 10,167
I am not sure they will appreciate the 5 points for EWR to SFO in Eco. Runs is North Amercia are dead. The Mediteranean or the Gulf will be the new place to visit.
Nov 12, 2019, 3:47 am
#247
Join Date: Nov 2019
Programs: M&M FLT
Posts: 5
I find it quite interesting that domestic flights within Germany receive the same number of points as a x-border European flight. So if fly ZRH-STR-FRA-HAJ instead of ZRH-HAJ I get three times the number of qualifying points; that is quite generous and will create incentives to take a detour when flying between LHs main hubs FRA, MUC, VIE and ZRH. Not sure whether that is in LH`s interest. I would not be surprised if the North African destinations were to be reclassified a "Europe" or if a new category "medium haul" were to be introduced in 2020 or 2023.
Nov 12, 2019, 3:49 am
#248
Moderator: SAS
Join Date: Feb 2018
Location: BLL & CPH & ZRH
Programs: LX, SK EBD (*G)
Posts: 3,150
Don't get too excited with the N. African opportunities, we had this debate a while ago... LH considers their LH 400-799 flights to be 'Interkont'. TUN & ALG are LH 12xx flights. Yesterday we were already thinking alound about the various TUN fares (used to be a favorite HON F run starting point about 10 years ago) and the M&M guy smiled and said that these are in Europe. TIP and CAI will be your sweet spots to investigate... if Libya ever opens up again.
Will the MUC-RAK flight LH7xx be regarded as intercont but the LH13xx from FRA-RAK not?
I've just found this nice tool on the M&M website(https://www.miles-and-more.com/ch/de...ts/update.html) and it states that Morocco, Tunesia and Algeria are indeed regarded as intercontinental. Can I assume that the tool is wrong?
Also: There still seems to be some confusion about the EDW codeshare LX flights. I was under the impression that EDW would yield NO qualifying points and NO points, even if it's booked on the LX8XXX number. (which I find a huge bummer and a dealbreaker for me). Is this wrong? Do LX8XXX earn points or even qualifying points?
Nov 12, 2019, 3:52 am
#249
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Here there everywhere
Programs: Bonvoy Lifetime Titanium, Hilton Diamond, IHG Plat, BA Silver, Aegean Gold, Aeroplan 25k, AA EXP
Posts: 2,825
What about the LH 13xx flights to CMN and RAK from FRA? At least they were regarded as intercont for me the alst time I took them
Will the MUC-RAK flight LH7xx be regarded as intercont but the LH13xx from FRA-RAK not?
I've just found this nice tool on the M&M website(https://www.miles-and-more.com/ch/de...ts/update.html) and it states that Morocco, Tunesia and Algeria are indeed regarded as intercontinental. Can I assume that the tool is wrong?
Will the MUC-RAK flight LH7xx be regarded as intercont but the LH13xx from FRA-RAK not?
I've just found this nice tool on the M&M website(https://www.miles-and-more.com/ch/de...ts/update.html) and it states that Morocco, Tunesia and Algeria are indeed regarded as intercontinental. Can I assume that the tool is wrong?
Nov 12, 2019, 4:02 am
#250
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: FRA
Programs: LH, Avis, Hyatt, ...
Posts: 4,213
Message from LH guys clearly was that high spenders benefit from the award miles and frequent flyers benefit from the status points in the future.
It is an interesting approach with winners and losers. As a HON from almost day 1 I will be in the loser group, since I usually travel long distance in A and have earned 40+k HON miles per r/t, i.e. 15 r/t in 2 years, done deal. In the future this gives 150 QP (assuming one feeder), i.e. 10 r/t in 1 year required for HON.
But hey, after almost 25 years with that travel pattern in the air I plan to reduce those activities anyway. So LH helps me supporting this somehow.
Lifetime SEN is given with almost 21.000 status star points on the account.
I don't complain.
It is an interesting approach with winners and losers. As a HON from almost day 1 I will be in the loser group, since I usually travel long distance in A and have earned 40+k HON miles per r/t, i.e. 15 r/t in 2 years, done deal. In the future this gives 150 QP (assuming one feeder), i.e. 10 r/t in 1 year required for HON.
But hey, after almost 25 years with that travel pattern in the air I plan to reduce those activities anyway. So LH helps me supporting this somehow.
Lifetime SEN is given with almost 21.000 status star points on the account.
I don't complain.
Nov 12, 2019, 4:15 am
#251
Join Date: Jul 2017
Programs: AY Plat Lumo, LX SEN, Marriott Titanium
Posts: 464
Tunisian Bureau of Tourism, early 2022:
"Sir, we have the first results for 2021. I have good news and bad news. Which one do you want to hear first?"
"Give me the good news first."
"International tourist arrivals at Tunis more than doubled last year."
"That's great! So what's the bad news?"
"Hotel stays and tourist activities remained the same."
"Sir, we have the first results for 2021. I have good news and bad news. Which one do you want to hear first?"
"Give me the good news first."
"International tourist arrivals at Tunis more than doubled last year."
"That's great! So what's the bad news?"
"Hotel stays and tourist activities remained the same."
Nov 12, 2019, 4:20 am
#252
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Capetown
Programs: Marriott Lifetime Plat, IHG and Hilton Diamond, LH SEN, BA Gold
Posts: 10,167
Don't get too excited with the N. African opportunities, we had this debate a while ago... LH considers their LH 400-799 flights to be 'Interkont'. TUN & ALG are LH 12xx flights. Yesterday we were already thinking alound about the various TUN fares (used to be a favorite HON F run starting point about 10 years ago) and the M&M guy smiled and said that these are in Europe. TIP and CAI will be your sweet spots to investigate... if Libya ever opens up again.
Nov 12, 2019, 4:24 am
#253
Join Date: Oct 2019
Programs: Flying Blue, Hilton Honors, Amtrak Guest Rewards
Posts: 2,394
The new status system seems to acknowledge the reality of fortress hubs, by making it relatively more difficult for Dieter in Darmstadt to achieve status compared to Laurent in Lyon. If LH can get Laurent SEN or HON, he's choosing a connection in FRA or MUC over DXB, AMS, CDG, LHR, etc. Conversely, if Dieter loses status, is he going to choose a connection over direct from FRA?
There may well be a shift in the geographic distribution of SENs and HONs.
There may well be a shift in the geographic distribution of SENs and HONs.
Nov 12, 2019, 4:27 am
#254
Join Date: Apr 2005
Programs: Eurostar Carte Blanche, SBB-CFF-FFS GA-AG, SNCF Grand Voyageur LeClub
Posts: 7,834
The new status system seems to acknowledge the reality of fortress hubs, by making it relatively more difficult for Dieter in Darmstadt to achieve status compared to Laurent in Lyon. If LH can get Laurent SEN or HON, he's choosing a connection in FRA or MUC over DXB, AMS, CDG, LHR, etc. Conversely, if Dieter loses status, is he going to choose a connection over direct from FRA?
There may well be a shift in the geographic distribution of SENs and HONs.
There may well be a shift in the geographic distribution of SENs and HONs.
By the way, has there been any official communicaiton which EW fares yield how many QPs?
Nov 12, 2019, 4:33 am
#255
Moderator: Asiana & Qantas Frequent Flyer
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: STR/SYD/SMF
Programs: QF Lifetime SG, LH HON, OZ Lifetime Diamond +, HH Diamond, Marriott Lifetime Platinum
Posts: 14,372