New qualifying points system for status from 2021

    Hide Wikipost
Old Dec 29, 19, 10:11 pm   -   Wikipost
Please read: This is a community-maintained wiki post containing the most important information from this thread. You may edit the Wiki once you have been on FT for 90 days and have made 90 posts.
 
Last edit by: oliver2002
Wiki Link
All the changes are listed on the official M&M Website: https://www.miles-and-more.com/de/en...ts/update.html

Starting 2021, the system for earning status changes. From then on, status points are earned by cabin and segment flown:

Regional flights will earn 5 points in Economy and Premium Economy, 10 points in First and Business class per segment
Intercontinental flights, ie flights between two IATA regions, will earn 15 points in Economy, 20 in Premium Economy, 50 in Business and 70 in First class segments

There will be two kinds of points : qualifying points (QP): earned with M&M integrated partners (LH/EW/LX/OS/LO/OU/LG/etc) and normal points : earned with other partners like the airlines in the Star Alliance. QP can be earned on LH Airrail train segments, but are capped at 40/120/250 per year for FTL/SEN/HON.

'Frequent Traveler' (FTL, equivalent to *S) status is given to members with 160 points (of which atleast 80 need to be QP), 'Senator' (SEN, *G) to members with 480 points (of which atleast 240 need to be QP). HON Circle (HON) is awarded after reaching 1500 QP in one year.

SEN will receive two evouchers upon qualification each year, HON 4 evouchers. There will be no rollover of QP, but for members who exceed the qualification QP level, M&M will grant the following benefits:
FTL: Mileage exchange for QP at 200 qualifying points
SEN: 2 eVoucher at 700 qualifying points; 15,000 award miles at 1,000 qualifying points; Frequent Traveller partner card at 1,300 qualifying points
HON:2 eVoucher at 1,800 qualifying points; 30,000 award miles at 2,100 qualifying points; 2 eVoucher at 2,400 qualifying points; Frequent Traveller partner card at 2,700 qualifying points; Senator partner card at 3,000 qualifying points

The system of status miles, HON Circle miles, select miles, and status star points will be abolished at the end of 2020. Any status earned prior to that will be honored. Any HON Circle miles earned in 2020 will be credited as QP in the ratio 200:1. Status star points earned till end of 2020 will converted to lifetime QP at a ration of 2:1.

Members with a lifetime QP of 7500 will be awarded FTL for their lifetime. If members reach 10000 lifetime QP and have been SEN for at least a cumulative 10 years they will be awarded lifetime SEN status.

Status is always valid for the year of qualification and one additional year. HON and SEN will have a 'soft landing' ie if they cannot requalify for status, they will get a year of SEN or FTL respectively.
Print Wikipost

Old Nov 12, 19, 3:16 am
  #226  
 
Join Date: Nov 2018
Location: BRU
Programs: LH HON*
Posts: 190
Originally Posted by DownUnderFlyer View Post
High spender will continue to move business the LH way in this model.
I would concur with someone on VFT who said this is a loyalty scheme for frequent fliers, rather than for high spenders.

Perhaps LH intel shows that high spenders are not driven by loyalty schemes, but other factors, and that they will keep buying F, J, D fares despite that from a loyalty program point of view they will now get significantly less recognition for their money vs cheaper fare buyers.
Vixit is offline  
Old Nov 12, 19, 3:16 am
  #227  
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Nearby ZRH
Programs: SEN
Posts: 16
Massive devaluation of PE. I am only allowed to fly PE for business purposes, and was able to achieve SEN with 5 to 6 intercontinental trips (plus feeder flights) per year. The new system would require me to do 10 intercontinental trips in PE. Why is C valued 2.5 times more in terms of these points, as the cheaper fares are close to the pricing of PE G or E?
Gnopps likes this.
Seraelph is offline  
Old Nov 12, 19, 3:19 am
  #228  
 
Join Date: Sep 2015
Programs: A3*G,BA Gold
Posts: 519
A bit off topic but they have to update the information. It says you can earn status with Adria Airways. Must be a unique experience if you sit in one of their grounded planes and become HON.
ermis177 is offline  
Old Nov 12, 19, 3:21 am
  #229  
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Germany
Programs: *G, OWS
Posts: 182
Originally Posted by esseff View Post
This is actually great news for me. I'm currently a 'multiple-Sen' with no chance of ever reaching HON, as I fly mostly intra-European Eco (+3-4 US Business flights).
Quick calculation of last two years brings me to 1270 and 1340 points - this year will be at 1410.
With the changes I have an actual chance to get to HON - which would be greatly appreciated with the time I spent at airports
I think this issue has beeen a bit overlooked. The current crop of HONs are qualifying primarily based on their long-haul flights, leading to little time spent in the airport compared to in the air.
With the changes I expect a shift in the composition of HONs with short-haul flyers qualifying.
Those will most likely be at the airport more often - I expect the FCT to become quite a bit more crowded...
frogster is offline  
Old Nov 12, 19, 3:26 am
  #230  
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Programs: Eurostar Carte Blanche, SBB-CFF-FFS GA-AG, SNCF Grand Voyageur LeClub
Posts: 6,337
So Eurowings flights count towards HON now, that's nice.

Just one other clarification: in the new benefits it says that HONs who reach 3000 qualifying points can give a SEN card to someone else. Today already HONs can give a SEN to a partner. Does the new system mean that HONs can give another SEN card to a second person, in addition to the one already shared as part of the HON benefit? Or is the first partner card abolished and it now takes 3000 QPs to share a SEN card with a partner?

And a comment: all in all I think these news aren't altogether terrible. Some quirks and some higher challenges for some people, but all in all we shouldn't be too unhappy. I remember a similar discussion when FB announced changes to its program - everybody was scared that status would become purely spend-based and that segments wouldn't matter anymore. The result was something similar to what M&M introduces now. I can live with it.
San Gottardo is offline  
Old Nov 12, 19, 3:36 am
  #231  
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Stoke on Trent, UK (MAN ), BUE, BKK, DBV
Programs: LH HON**,UA,BA.EK Gold,AV.
Posts: 4,720
Originally Posted by San Gottardo View Post
So Eurowings flights count towards HON now, that's nice.

Just one other clarification: in the new benefits it says that HONs who reach 3000 qualifying points can give a SEN card to someone else. Today already HONs can give a SEN to a partner. Does the new system mean that HONs can give another SEN card to a second person, in addition to the one already shared as part of the HON benefit? Or is the first partner card abolished and it now takes 3000 QPs to share a SEN card with a partner?
.
For sure LH are only going to let you have one partner card at a time.
chris63 is online now  
Old Nov 12, 19, 3:37 am
  #232  
 
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: BRU
Programs: Miles and More FTL; BA Exec Club Silver
Posts: 146
Originally Posted by Marcin83 View Post
Already publshed. The calculador considers such routes as intercontinental
It's fascinating that these routes are intercontinental yet you can fly SIN-NRT-TLV and they are considered continental. And PTY-BOG is intercontinental while PTY-YYZ is continental. So you could fly say on that CAI-ATH-TLV route in J for 100 points yet CAI-ADD-JNB is 20 points.

Overall though I'm happy with the new system. It means that my FTL pattern currently will most years hit SEN as I do about 4-6 Intercontinental J and then around 40-60 Continental Y trips per year, with vast majority on LH group metal. With the fares I buy (K,L,T in EU and P intercontinental) I end up with around 50,000 status miles per year currently. I'll stick with M&M and forget about my planned transfer over to OZ
ChrisBub is offline  
Old Nov 12, 19, 3:38 am
  #233  
Moderator: Asiana & Qantas Frequent Flyer
Aman Contributor Badge
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: STR/SYD/SMF
Programs: QF SG, LH SEN, OZ D+, HH D, SPG P
Posts: 13,994
Originally Posted by Vixit View Post
I would concur with someone on VFT who said this is a loyalty scheme for frequent fliers, rather than for high spenders.

Perhaps LH intel shows that high spenders are not driven by loyalty schemes, but other factors, and that they will keep buying F, J, D fares despite that from a loyalty program point of view they will now get significantly less recognition for their money vs cheaper fare buyers.
The majority of frequent flyers / high spenders I know outside Flyertalk will just book (to be precise: will have their corporate travel agency or PA book) whatever the cheapest business fare is available for the route they want to fly. And if the business trip is planned 4 months out this will be P class and if it is tomorrow it is C. None of them buys a D fare because she wants to buy a D fare.
DownUnderFlyer is offline  
Old Nov 12, 19, 3:41 am
  #234  
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Wrocław, Poland
Programs: SK *S, LH *S; Accor ALL Gold
Posts: 227
They list LATAM under "Star Alliance" in the calculator in the FAQ
marcoos is offline  
Old Nov 12, 19, 3:46 am
  #235  
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Posts: 137
Hm I actually might switch back from United.
As I have tons of short flights in the US and a few TATL the Sen would give me access to at least a free beer *lol* in the otherwise useless UNited Clubs.
noname83 is offline  
Old Nov 12, 19, 3:53 am
  #236  
 
Join Date: Nov 2018
Location: BRU
Programs: LH HON*
Posts: 190
Originally Posted by chris63 View Post
For sure LH are only going to let you have one partner card at a time.
Today you can give a 2nd SEN card to someone else as one of the Selections benefits, in addition to your partner. I take it that this is what will continue:

These additional partner cards give you the chance to confer the benefits of your Senator status on another family member or friend. The partner card for your spouse or life partner, which HON Circle Members receive as one of their status privileges, remains unaffected.
Vixit is offline  
Old Nov 12, 19, 4:03 am
  #237  
Marriott Contributor Badge
 
Join Date: Feb 2018
Location: ZRH
Programs: LX, SK *G, FPC, GA/AG
Posts: 1,848
Originally Posted by worldclubber View Post
It‘s still 30 intercontinental J flights to get HON. All on LH metal. Every year!

Not exactly giving away HON for free.
Do a XXX-FRA/MUC-TUN round trip in P for around 600EUR once per month and HON you shall be
Originally Posted by oliver2002 View Post

A diagram of the IATA regions for reference. Note that Algeria and Morocco are part of Europe...
Originally Posted by oliver2002 View Post
Note that Tunisia is in the IATA region Europe, so you only get 10 points per segment.
I would have to disagree with you Oliver. While you are right that IATA takes them as part of Europe they are regarded as a special case (in the list they are also marked specially, I think they were underlined and in the map I know they are marked as both Europe and Africa).
M&M does actually regard Morocco, Algeria and Tunesia as not being part of Europe and that despite the fact that they base their classification on the IATA code.

If my statement doesn't convince you, just take this thought experiment: If M&M would regard Morocco, Tunesia and Algeria as part of Europe today flights from Europe to these countries would only yield miles as per the European rules (and not the distance based ones). This is, however, not the case.

Furthermore: If they were regarded as part of Europe, flying Cairo to Tunesia in Egypt Air Business would yield 50 points. Given, they wouldn't be qualifying points, but still 50% of the points needed for status could then be cheated that way.

If those countries would be regarded as Europe mileage spending would also be based as an inter European flight down there, which also is not the case with M&M today.

In conclusion: I'm am 90% sure Morocco, Tunesia and Algiers will not be regarded as part of Europe, unless M&M decides to change their country and region classification, which I doubt they will do.

PS: Georgia wasn't regarded as an intra European flight by the old earning routes as well (it was also specially marked on the map, but in that case I think they might reclassify those flights to Baku, Yerevan and Tbilisi as intra European, which will lead to the funny tag on flight from baku to ashgabat to be classified as an intercontinental qualifyling 50 point flight

Last edited by Nick Art; Nov 12, 19 at 4:10 am
Nick Art is offline  
Old Nov 12, 19, 4:07 am
  #238  
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: London
Programs: BA Gold, LH Sen, FB Gold
Posts: 371
Originally Posted by oliver2002 View Post
Also surprised by the lifetime qp calculation. Yesterday they pussy footed around this topic ... But I'm ok with the solution: it's a fitting tribute to the pointless status star episode.
I have been SEN for almost 17 years and will be at 6,700 QP or so at end of 2020. Would need another 5 to 6 year to get lifetime Senator. Compare this to BA where I will get Life-time Gold (which is actually somewhat more worth than Life-time SEN) late next year after having been Gold for "only" 14 years. Oh well....
denhaagflyer is offline  
Old Nov 12, 19, 4:28 am
  #239  
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: SFO
Programs: UA Plat, OZ *G, DL Silver, FB Plat, Hyatt Glob, Marriott Plat
Posts: 278
It seems like they separate North America and South America so there are some very interesting mileage run opportunities. For example, you can hop between PTY,Panama and Bogota,Colombia. 5 business class segments should be 250 points for only $1391 (1260 EUR) and two days:

https://flights.app.goo.gl/f95Pj

Yes you still need half in QP but it sounds like you can always fly EU to TLV (for example VIE-FRA-TLV-MUC-VIE) and earn 120 QP for ~$1k EUR/USD (https://flights.app.goo.gl/CcnZb)

So you could spend ~$3500 + 2 weekends to get Senator status. Is the status worth that?
Rowyourboat is offline  
Old Nov 12, 19, 4:36 am
  #240  
Marriott Contributor Badge
 
Join Date: Feb 2018
Location: ZRH
Programs: LX, SK *G, FPC, GA/AG
Posts: 1,848
I think I have found the optimum for the mileage runs:
MXP-FRA-ALG-FRA-MXP same day return, books in Z for 540 Euro.
(with one night it's possible to push that to 450 Euro)

This flight yields 120 points. (based on the current classification of Algiers as Africa and not Europe).
Do that four times and you'll have 480 qualifying points for 2160 Euro.
Do it once per month and you'll have 1440 qualyfing points for 6480 Euro.

The great thing about this fare is it's bookable year round up to one week before departure.
Nick Art is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Search Engine: