A clear photo of the affected passengers holding their ID next to their face
Jun 18, 2019, 11:45 am
#62
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 80
I had an analogous experience that I think was even riskier than the LH selfie demand, albeit not with an airline. Some company not only demanded a selfie, they insisted I first download their app to take the selfie on my iPhone. No way I was going to give some unknown app access to my phone. I just shut the transaction down.
When you install any app, even on an iOS device (with better protections than Android apps), you give a lot of potential power to the app publisher. Ex: If you use WhatsApp, you are giving your entire contact list to Facebook. It's possible to disable that by not giving WhatsApp access to your contacts. But who does that, or even realizes there is an issue and a workaround?
I like the callback approach to try another employee at Lufthansa. It is surprising how often that works.
When you install any app, even on an iOS device (with better protections than Android apps), you give a lot of potential power to the app publisher. Ex: If you use WhatsApp, you are giving your entire contact list to Facebook. It's possible to disable that by not giving WhatsApp access to your contacts. But who does that, or even realizes there is an issue and a workaround?
I like the callback approach to try another employee at Lufthansa. It is surprising how often that works.
Jun 18, 2019, 12:21 pm
#63
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 11,539
Yes, I am not sure that LH have properly thought out the implications of asking pax for this, whether it be those abroad in important markets, or the valued Islamic community in Germany who would feel rightly aggrieved and discriminated by this. After all, its payment of a baggage reimbursement, not opening a bank account.
It could put undue pressure on staff to identify those who could be offended by the request based on their name, or some other assumptions, which itself is a form of discrimination. And those who are unable to fulfil this request on religious grounds have to have some other extensive verification- the implication being because they're Muslim? Disgraceful.
I can be absolutely sure Mrs Merkel would be appalled by this request if she came to hear of it.
It could put undue pressure on staff to identify those who could be offended by the request based on their name, or some other assumptions, which itself is a form of discrimination. And those who are unable to fulfil this request on religious grounds have to have some other extensive verification- the implication being because they're Muslim? Disgraceful.
I can be absolutely sure Mrs Merkel would be appalled by this request if she came to hear of it.
Jun 18, 2019, 12:30 pm
#64
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 11,539
I had an analogous experience that I think was even riskier than the LH selfie demand, albeit not with an airline. Some company not only demanded a selfie, they insisted I first download their app to take the selfie on my iPhone. No way I was going to give some unknown app access to my phone. I just shut the transaction down.
When you install any app, even on an iOS device (with better protections than Android apps), you give a lot of potential power to the app publisher. Ex: If you use WhatsApp, you are giving your entire contact list to Facebook. It's possible to disable that by not giving WhatsApp access to your contacts. But who does that, or even realizes there is an issue and a workaround?
I like the callback approach to try another employee at Lufthansa. It is surprising how often that works.
When you install any app, even on an iOS device (with better protections than Android apps), you give a lot of potential power to the app publisher. Ex: If you use WhatsApp, you are giving your entire contact list to Facebook. It's possible to disable that by not giving WhatsApp access to your contacts. But who does that, or even realizes there is an issue and a workaround?
I like the callback approach to try another employee at Lufthansa. It is surprising how often that works.
Jun 18, 2019, 5:15 pm
#66
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Northern Italian Lakes
Programs: BA, *A, Hertz Goldstar, Mucci wannabee, Waitrose, safari Oleg
Posts: 1,545
cheeky bullying German airline
All this over 50 Euro and they presumably already know it's a valid claim and have access to your credit card to reimburse you! Contrast with Icelandair who delayed my bag over 24 hours. They refunded $100 to my card within a few days, without even being asked!
So it looks like Germany is tryiing unacceptable things again.
I think this is totally unacceptable, an invasion of privacy, an attempt to make it inconvenient or stressful or hopefully offputting by Lufthansa, against indivduals. They have no right to introduce this new requirement. I do not think we should have to provide extra information about ourselves, in particular a pcture which is information I don't want to share, just to assert a right to something we are already entitled to under legislation such as compensation for a flight delay.
I thin it is a very disturbing thing that Lufthansa seems to be trying for this. It should be pushed back against and complained about and NOT ACCEDED TO whenever possible. Lufthansa has no right to demand these things.
Will they want a photo of you naked next every time you need compensation for damnged baggage or a late flight? The cheek!
Jun 19, 2019, 1:45 pm
#67
Original Poster
Join Date: Aug 2005
Programs: UA*G(1K), PC Diamond Amb, Marriott Titanium, Accor Platinum
Posts: 4,667
I've finally replied and pushed back both on the retroactive request for boarding passes (their information leaflet only mentions "receipts" as a requirement for reimbursement and most people I know dispose of their boarding passes right after their flight) and asked if they are really serious about the picture thing, and how they are intending to use and safeguard such pictures.
The airline that stated they couldn't store our passport information in our profile due to data protection reasons is asking for a clear picture of my passport next to my face. The irony.
From the way the requirements are stated, I believe they are facing internal embezzlement and are trying to control compensation payments. I'm not sure how such a scheme would work, however. How would you make sure the person handling a false claim is actually into the scheme?
HTB.
The airline that stated they couldn't store our passport information in our profile due to data protection reasons is asking for a clear picture of my passport next to my face. The irony.
From the way the requirements are stated, I believe they are facing internal embezzlement and are trying to control compensation payments. I'm not sure how such a scheme would work, however. How would you make sure the person handling a false claim is actually into the scheme?
HTB.
Jun 19, 2019, 5:54 pm
#68
Join Date: Dec 2018
Location: Somewhere between BHX and HUY
Programs: Flying Blue Plat, Eurobonus Silver, ALL Gold
Posts: 1,671
You can likely assume they would treat your photo with similar confidence and destroy it immediately after verification. You are also entitled to demand confirmation of that.
Do you hold state secrets, have full control over your company's entire assets, or are a wanted activist? If not I personally wouldn't be worried of what Lufthansa could do with your personal details.
Regardless how ridiculous their request seems (and it is), it's not really worth going on a crusade. They're not trying to scam you.
In fact, not being GDPR compliant could have consequences for them a million times more serious than the 50 euros they owe you.
Jun 19, 2019, 6:43 pm
#69
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 11,539
On second thought it's not ironic, quite the contrary. That they destroyed any of your personal identifiable documentation immediately after you travelled is a sign of GDPR compliance.
You can likely assume they would treat your photo with similar confidence and destroy it immediately after verification. You are also entitled to demand confirmation of that.
Do you hold state secrets, have full control over your company's entire assets, or are a wanted activist? If not I personally wouldn't be worried of what Lufthansa could do with your personal details.
Regardless how ridiculous their request seems (and it is), it's not really worth going on a crusade. They're not trying to scam you.
In fact, not being GDPR compliant could have consequences for them a million times more serious than the 50 euros they owe you.
You can likely assume they would treat your photo with similar confidence and destroy it immediately after verification. You are also entitled to demand confirmation of that.
Do you hold state secrets, have full control over your company's entire assets, or are a wanted activist? If not I personally wouldn't be worried of what Lufthansa could do with your personal details.
Regardless how ridiculous their request seems (and it is), it's not really worth going on a crusade. They're not trying to scam you.
In fact, not being GDPR compliant could have consequences for them a million times more serious than the 50 euros they owe you.
Don't want anti-semitic Facebook posts to be on the BBC- then don't post a thing to FB. Don't have FB at all. I don't.
And as far as the GDPR, I had a good giggle. The only people who thought that companies would be shaking in their boots are the bureaucrats who came up with it. I see GDPR violations every day and I expect FA to be done about it. Is it going to the consumer crisis as the VW scandal? No. And they blatantly lied and misled the consumer.
The safest option for the OP is to NOT provide LH with his photo and details. It's absurd to ask a pax to provide this data, and until someone posts to the contrary I am of the opinion it could be considered an unfair practice.
If I were in his/her position and LH refused to pay out without this photo, I would sue and allow the judge to decide if he/she agreed with me that it was unreasonable or to side with LH that yes, a photo of you holding your ID is required to get your baggage payment
.
Jun 20, 2019, 9:18 am
#70
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: The Netherlands
Programs: BA, KLM, Alitalia
Posts: 99
This is what I don't get. Why do you need to *prove* you're you in submitting a claim for delayed baggage reimbursement. LH should already know your identity is verified, as you boarded their flight and you have to get your ID verified numerous times before getting on a plane.
They also know you checked a bag, and have a record of the delay. So, you being you and you having a delayed bag should not be a surprise to them.
In theory, some random Joe could somehow discover that your bag was delayed, get your booking info and bag tag info, and file a claim pretending to be you, but one would expect that this should only arouse suspicion if multiple different claims are filed for the same incident.
As for the photo of someone with their ID next to their face, I'm assuming they have some way of determining that such a photo isn't photoshopped? If all they want to see is your face, and a photo of your ID with your name on it, seems like something any first-year graphics student could fake.
They also know you checked a bag, and have a record of the delay. So, you being you and you having a delayed bag should not be a surprise to them.
In theory, some random Joe could somehow discover that your bag was delayed, get your booking info and bag tag info, and file a claim pretending to be you, but one would expect that this should only arouse suspicion if multiple different claims are filed for the same incident.
As for the photo of someone with their ID next to their face, I'm assuming they have some way of determining that such a photo isn't photoshopped? If all they want to see is your face, and a photo of your ID with your name on it, seems like something any first-year graphics student could fake.
For those that get there panties in a twist over that people object to this practice, this is not normal in alot of countries, so maybe you should question this practice in your country a bit more
Jun 20, 2019, 2:32 pm
#71
Join Date: Nov 2016
Programs: LH FT, AA Plat
Posts: 198
I find it funny how some people here give likes to those who think this isn't a problem. This question isn't specifically to you but to those that find LH's request just fine:
If LH would ask for a blood sample from you and your entire family, to prove your identity and that you're indeed related to that family, would you do it? And if not, why not?
Jun 20, 2019, 7:33 pm
#72
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 11,539
Well, I can only speculate that Helga will have collected quite a few premium pax's bodily fluids over the years, so perhaps blood is only a small step further. However, I'd speculate that premium pax's wives might not be very happy about that if they became aware.
Jun 20, 2019, 9:44 pm
#73
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 2,186
If this is true, it is absolutely appalling. LH should not request any additional identification data in order to issue a refund or compensation amount to the same means of payment used to purchase the flights.
Do they even perform any sort of verification when you buy flights from them other than for itineraries involving a few specific airports in Africa? They have never asked me for anything, even for 5-figure credit card payments. Thus, I would be unimpressed if they put me through useless hurdles to return 50 EUR after a mishap. They would possibly save 50 EUR and lose a customer.
Do they even perform any sort of verification when you buy flights from them other than for itineraries involving a few specific airports in Africa? They have never asked me for anything, even for 5-figure credit card payments. Thus, I would be unimpressed if they put me through useless hurdles to return 50 EUR after a mishap. They would possibly save 50 EUR and lose a customer.
Jun 21, 2019, 9:09 pm
#74
Original Poster
Join Date: Aug 2005
Programs: UA*G(1K), PC Diamond Amb, Marriott Titanium, Accor Platinum
Posts: 4,667
Lufthansa has replied:
HTB.
Please be advised that the reason we ask for a copy of your boarding pass or a clear photo of the affected passenger holding their ID next to their face is to ensure that payment is being made to the correct recipient.
Jun 21, 2019, 10:16 pm
#75
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: California
Programs: AA EXP...couple hotels and cars too
Posts: 4,548
I'd reply: "My new policy requires YOU to provide me a picture of yourself AND your Lufthansa photo ID...so *I* know I am sending my information to an actual qualified representative of Lufthansa."
Stalemate
Honestly, 74 posts in- there are a ton of reasons Lufthansa WANTS this- yet no legal reason they can REQUIRE it (assuming it isnt German law and they failed to describe this in their Ts and Cs.) I dont care if there is no risk of ID theft, or if LH has some good reason for wanting it.... the reason *I* wouldnt do it is simply because I dont want to and never agreed to it when I bought the ticket.
Stalemate
Honestly, 74 posts in- there are a ton of reasons Lufthansa WANTS this- yet no legal reason they can REQUIRE it (assuming it isnt German law and they failed to describe this in their Ts and Cs.) I dont care if there is no risk of ID theft, or if LH has some good reason for wanting it.... the reason *I* wouldnt do it is simply because I dont want to and never agreed to it when I bought the ticket.
