Kmxu

Here is my situation. And I know that I should deal with LH regarding compensation if any.
xxx-MUC was on LH; Air traffic control at xxx delayed the departure by 40 min. When arrived at MUC, LH bussed us into Terminal. When the plane parked, it was T-20min. I ran as fast as I could, but I still missed it. I knew that UA unloaded me before starting running.

At LH Senator lounge, LH could rebook me in economy class (original booking class) although the GPU upgrade got me into Business. If I agreed with the rebooking, I would arrive at my final destination 5-6 h behind the original schedule.

I called UA 1K line later and I was rebooked to Business class, but I had to overnight at MUC at my own expenses. No food voucher was given to me.

Will I waste my time to deal with LH, due to ATC at the originating city?

SK AAR

Yes you will get nowhere with this. No comp for delays caused by ATC and you turned down a same-day flight and arranged for a flight on your own the following day to use your UA GPU upgrade; that is your own decision. Sorry, but no grounds for a complaint nor comp.

Lack

Agree on the no compensation due to ATC, but offering a Y instead of C seat shouldn't absolve the airline of duty of care if the passenger doesn't agree to the downgrade.
I'd still file a complaint and ask for reimbursement on the expenses (lodging and food). Unlike proper compensation, LH is usually way less stingy settling those.

SK AAR

I think the point is that the OP was in Y. Only for the UA flight the OP was able to use an UA upgrade instrument to C but it doesn't make the ticket a C class ticket. Rather than take a same day flight in the same service class as the original ticket to OP preferred to wait to the following day to be able to upgrade to C. This is hardly of relevance to LH

Kmxu

Kmxu

athome

There are two reasons, why LH is not owing you compensation.
Firstly, as already written, LH cannot made be responsible of ATC delays and therefore you would not be eligible for compensation.
Secondly LH would only be eligible for "real" delays, not of hypothetic ones (if you would have taken the same day Y-class fare, you would have nevertheless arrived x hours late).
As you decided not to take LH same day proposed routing and as you decided to organize a C-class flight yourself (because of whatever reason), LH is not owing you anything. For LH you had a Y-class ticket and that is what they tried to book you on. GPU's are an UA thing. Nothing to do with LH.

Lack

I presume the ticket was paid for and issued => OP was in C. LH taking a "heads we win, tails you lose" approach to upgrades isn't an acceptable practice.

They will refuse compensation on account of the ATC. But that doesn't absolve them of the duty of care (lodging and meals).

SK AAR

I beg to differ. The OP had a Y class ticket. Only on a UA flight the OP was able to confirm the upgrade to C with UA upgrade instrument. On any LH metal flight the OP would be in Y (based on the service class of the ticket). There is a duty of care and maybe to OP would be entitled to a 15-20 EUR voucher to buy food and beverages during the 4 hours extra waiting time at FRA, but hardly worth to complain about (I'm sure the OP was fed in the LH SEN lounge). There is no duty of care beyond that as the OP decided to wait for the UA flight the following day; this was already explained to the OP by the LH supervisor.

SK AAR

There is no comp. under EU Reg. 261/04 for delays and mis-connections due to ATC as this is considered an extraordinary circumstance under the regulation. Period.

Lack

So you're saying that an airline has exactly zero regard and responsibility when it comes to upgrades because why?

No meals beyond kartoffelsalat? Which EU261 paragraph states that?

So if they'd just prep a kayak for the OP to peddle across the pond the same day then that would be the OPs fault for not taking them up on the offer?

Fabo.sk

Because the OP was not ticketed in J, but in Y. He had J seating on UA flight due to UA GPU, that is not a part of the ticket, and not applicable on LH flights.
OP was ticketed in Y, offered alternative flight in Y. Declined the option. That's all there is to LH.

Right to care

1. Where reference is made to this Article, passengers shall be offered free of charge:

(a) meals and refreshments in a reasonable relation to the waiting time;


Which is generally understood as a snack after 2 hours, a meal after 5 hours.
It is not clear how long a time was there before departure of the alternative flight, but it would be fairly easy for LH to argue that meals and refreshments were made available in the SEN lounge.

If the OP was booked in peddle-kayak-class then yes.

Kmxu

Thank you all for the replies. Just add another piece of information.
Before we deplaned the LH flight, FA told us (perhaps 5-10 pax) that a separate bus would send us directly to the gate of UA flight. Once we went to the bottom of the stairway, there was a bus for LH’s JFK pax, not the UA pax. We had a good chance to make the connection if LH should have provided a bus for us.
Nevertheless, I will send a short email to LH’s Customer Relations.

Raul_R

This EU compensation thing is much more FOR the customer as it seems to be.
Reason: there are several court cases.
And I managed get comepnsation when the delay was caused by ATC.

Actually there is only very very few limitations (accoridng to court cases), for example also absolutely never the technical problem can be reason of deny the compensation. Court considered that it is normal risk for airlines business, it happens and will happen, but airline must to pay as they know it may happen.
Airlines may try to not to pay.
But with enough legal background request they usually pay.

As there is only less than 2% of eligible passengers ask compensation, then airlines usually trend to pay.

SK AAR

The last poster is very optimistic and seems to forget that we are dealing with LH; LH rigorously denies claims for comp. (and I believe gets away with it). It will be very much uphill to get comp. for ATC delays. I wouldn't put my bet/money on the OP getting anything.