M&M going revenue based [for award miles on LH group tickets] 12MAR2018
#76
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#77
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Location: Netherlands
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#78
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Location: Netherlands
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The whole trip should give me 10,126 status/award miles including executive bonus which is quite a bargain. Under the new system I will only get 3,292 miles if all flights are on LH Group airlines - the reason why I'm curious to know what will happen if the same ticket was bought after 12.3.18.
So: no change as regards status miles.
Additionally - it only applies to new bookings. NOT to existing tickets.
"When does the revenue-based system come into effect?
The new system will apply to tickets issued from 12.3.2018 and to flights operated from 12.3.2018. Both conditions must be met."
#80
Senior Moderator, Moderator: Community Buzz and Ambassador: Miles & More (Lufthansa, Austrian, Swiss, and other partners)
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: 150km from MAN
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"Does not apply to the calculation of status, select and HON Circle miles "
So: no change as regards status miles.
Additionally - it only applies to new bookings. NOT to existing tickets.
"When does the revenue-based system come into effect?
The new system will apply to tickets issued from 12.3.2018 and to flights operated from 12.3.2018. Both conditions must be met."
So: no change as regards status miles.
Additionally - it only applies to new bookings. NOT to existing tickets.
"When does the revenue-based system come into effect?
The new system will apply to tickets issued from 12.3.2018 and to flights operated from 12.3.2018. Both conditions must be met."
Also I wanted to point out it's not clear on M&M's website how a non-LH Group flight will be treated in a mixed itinerary.
Edited to add:
I used the animated tool on M&M's website and found that for FTL/SEN/HON the factor of 5 is used for all airlines on which you can earn M&M miles but which are not individually mentioned along with Brussels Airlines and Eurowings.
Last edited by NewbieRunner; Dec 12, 2017 at 4:42 am
#81
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: NUE,MUC,INN,FDH
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Posts: 2,075
I just calculated my last flights. I do a lot of domestic flights in higher booking classes, most in Business and a few longhauls. The enhancement is form me betwenn -10 to -40%.
Thank you LH. So when I shop with my payback card it becomes much more valuable!
On the other hand you now can calculate the real value of a mile. This is interesting for the tax office (income tax), or lawyers when fighting against LH. Now you just can price the simple mile cashback into your price comparison.
When you fly in cheap tickets it is even worse. I thought that 125 miles is low enough. But yes, it can be beaten!
Thank you LH. So when I shop with my payback card it becomes much more valuable!
On the other hand you now can calculate the real value of a mile. This is interesting for the tax office (income tax), or lawyers when fighting against LH. Now you just can price the simple mile cashback into your price comparison.
When you fly in cheap tickets it is even worse. I thought that 125 miles is low enough. But yes, it can be beaten!
#82
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Location: Montreux CH
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Segment Qualification
I wonder if it will still be possible to qualify for FTL through segments. In fact, I wonder if segments will be noted at i just wonder how they can really do a revenue based system in Europe with so many different markets.
#83
Senior Moderator, Moderator: Community Buzz and Ambassador: Miles & More (Lufthansa, Austrian, Swiss, and other partners)
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People who pay for B or Y fares to fly in Economy or E & G for Premium Economy have been getting more miles than those paying for heavily discounted business fares. So this isn't new.
#84
Join Date: May 2015
Location: Munich, Deutscheland
Programs: Try to be elite again... :)
Posts: 488
Honestly speaking, I do not think I lose amid the change. Lufthansa already gives extremely small amount miles for lower classes, e.g. 125 miles per segment flown. You can only earn more with the new system. The real losers are primarily long-haul low classes flyers... I guess.
#85
Join Date: Sep 2015
Programs: LH SEN; BA Gold
Posts: 8,400
The current F offer CDG-HKG on LX would earn a basic M&M member only 9,088 miles (1956€ BF + 316€ YQ/YR). That's 0.75 of the distance. Ouuchh. Under the current system it's 38,600 miles. That's a minus of of nearly 80%.
#86
Join Date: Feb 2013
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#87
Join Date: Feb 2013
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Posts: 5,449
The devaluation of A really bites, but is probably one of the desired effects of the reform.
#88
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Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 11,453
Every carrier is becoming more transactional and the importance of loyalty continues to decrease. Many times pax just don't care about the miles because the fares are so cheap, then next its that they don't care about the lounges because the paid subscription lounges are better or you can access the same ones that previously required a loyalty card with a credit card. Who would have ever thought you would be able to access a LH FCL with an AmEx? Or, you don't care about some orphan miles in EY/EK/QR because they're so much better than your regular carrier and often, the fares are better. Ryanair is bearable because of the things I have mentioned, cheap extra seat, front row, easyJet cards for free exit seats etc. I would rather pay €1500 for a business fare than €2000 with miles. It's with increasing frequency I can find a ticket on another carrier for a better fare than using my miles by my perceived values, conveniences etc. And, given what I just said, I can do without the unlimited potato salad.
The EU has gone after their lovely cash-rich channel of the credit card firms paying for miles which was very important. And to top it off, they want €1000 in taxes and surcharges on your free ticket that is probably available on another carrier (or the same!) as a revenue fare. Once they unbundled we could see it just wasn't premium at all. It's not premium to have a Business Fare and have better food/drinks down the back (like BA CE). They will regret all of this big time and when that time comes we can watch them squirm as they desperately try to show how different they are from the LCC, the ME carriers, and why we should pay more to fly with them for increasingly minimal benefits.
LOT are not too happy with M&M and this could be another step in that direction. The situation has always been really weird. LH are a competitor of LO in a way unlike any other carrier that uses M&M. Forgive me but I think only OU and JP are the others not controlled by papa Lufty? Along with LG, the combination is tiny compared to LO and they barely compete with LH. LO are getting bigger and more a competitor of LH group, LH's dumping on the Polish market is notorious (It's a sea of K fares) and LO are clearly gunning for the tasty German market. I imagine LH would then retaliate against LO like they did with TK on the mileage earning...
Already they offer special promo awards for the PL market which are a fraction of a M&M promo(-show me a LH promo Y return for 7k miles with no YQ). It shows that it really isn't compatible with LO and given the generally low price of LO tickets I can see Polish Members will feel hard hit by the changes.
I just hope LO don't exit Star.
The EU has gone after their lovely cash-rich channel of the credit card firms paying for miles which was very important. And to top it off, they want €1000 in taxes and surcharges on your free ticket that is probably available on another carrier (or the same!) as a revenue fare. Once they unbundled we could see it just wasn't premium at all. It's not premium to have a Business Fare and have better food/drinks down the back (like BA CE). They will regret all of this big time and when that time comes we can watch them squirm as they desperately try to show how different they are from the LCC, the ME carriers, and why we should pay more to fly with them for increasingly minimal benefits.
LOT are not too happy with M&M and this could be another step in that direction. The situation has always been really weird. LH are a competitor of LO in a way unlike any other carrier that uses M&M. Forgive me but I think only OU and JP are the others not controlled by papa Lufty? Along with LG, the combination is tiny compared to LO and they barely compete with LH. LO are getting bigger and more a competitor of LH group, LH's dumping on the Polish market is notorious (It's a sea of K fares) and LO are clearly gunning for the tasty German market. I imagine LH would then retaliate against LO like they did with TK on the mileage earning...
Already they offer special promo awards for the PL market which are a fraction of a M&M promo(-show me a LH promo Y return for 7k miles with no YQ). It shows that it really isn't compatible with LO and given the generally low price of LO tickets I can see Polish Members will feel hard hit by the changes.
I just hope LO don't exit Star.
#89
Join Date: Dec 2007
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It is really pathetic: an A class ticket from MXP or AMS to HNL via FRA and LAX costing Euro 4200 used to earn around 65k award miles, with the changes taking effect after three months that ticket will earn 24k award miles only
#90
Join Date: Aug 2010
Programs: Marriott Bonvoy Ambassador, Melia Platinum, SIXT Platinum, Accor Silver, Lufthansa FTL
Posts: 381
Frankly, I find this whole change underwhelming. Sure it is a devaluation for some people, but then it will also give a lot of people on more expensive eco tickets (especially domestic or European short-haul) a lot more (40%-60% for me personally) miles than before.
Also please remember that at least for German/Austrian/Swiss customers, it is much easier to accrue a ton of miles via cheap magazine subscriptions (eg. currently there is an offer for 60,000 and a daily newspaper for a year for about 700€). To get the same amount of miles with flying, you will need to spend 10 times the amount of money. So I am not sure that giving away award miles is that much of a concern at LH at all.
Also please remember that at least for German/Austrian/Swiss customers, it is much easier to accrue a ton of miles via cheap magazine subscriptions (eg. currently there is an offer for 60,000 and a daily newspaper for a year for about 700€). To get the same amount of miles with flying, you will need to spend 10 times the amount of money. So I am not sure that giving away award miles is that much of a concern at LH at all.