FRA [deicing] delay [03DEC2017] - EC261?
Dec 3, 2017, 7:03 am
#1
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FRA [deicing] delay [03DEC2017] - EC261?
Currently sat on the tarmac at FRA 2:55 after boarding. Captain says de-icers failed to turn up when due (already a 1:30 delay). No signs of any movement.
What are the chances of being able to claim EC261? If the delay was caused by snow then I wouldn't think of claiming but this delay is caused by LH / Fraport failing to ensure personnel are available.
What are the chances of being able to claim EC261? If the delay was caused by snow then I wouldn't think of claiming but this delay is caused by LH / Fraport failing to ensure personnel are available.
Dec 3, 2017, 7:28 am
#2
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The question of who caused the delay isn't the issue, it is who provides the service. If it is LH and deicing happens to be a function which LH outsources, then yes, you have a valid claim unless there is some extraordinary circumstance as to why the deicing equipment was delayed. If this is an airport service, than you are out-of-luck as the delay isn't caused in the least bit by LH and it's not a question of the weather vs. non-functioning engine and so on.
This varies from carrier-to-carrier and airport-to-airport.
This varies from carrier-to-carrier and airport-to-airport.
Last edited by Often1; Dec 3, 2017 at 9:51 am
Dec 3, 2017, 10:52 am
#3
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Current travel information
Weather related flight cancellations and delays at Frankfurt Airport
Flight cancellations and delays to/from Frankfurt are to be expected for 03 December 2017 due to snowfall.
Weather related flight cancellations and delays at Frankfurt Airport
Flight cancellations and delays to/from Frankfurt are to be expected for 03 December 2017 due to snowfall.
Dec 3, 2017, 12:54 pm
#5
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Dec 3, 2017, 7:59 pm
#6
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I think I remember reading an ECJ ruling that the if there are multiple delay causes (e.g. first 01:30 delay due to extraordinary circumstance, and then next 01:30 due to technical issue) then only the delay caused by the non-exceptional problem would be considered for the delay compensation. However I can't find the details.
In any case, some here would argue that snow is not an exceptional circumstance.
In any case, some here would argue that snow is not an exceptional circumstance.
Dec 4, 2017, 2:45 am
#7
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In my view, there were no delays caused by the snow - it was too light, wet and not lying. All delays were caused by lack of de-icing personnel and/or equipment.
We boarded at 11:55 for a 12:10 pushback. The de-icers finally arrived at 16:00 and took 40 minutes to de-ice the A320.
Meal service was carried out on the ground but they didn't bother to request a restock of the drinks trolleys during the delay so there was very limited service after take off.
The pilots had run out of hours, but thankfully there were two dead-heading pilots on board who took over.
We finally arrived 4 and a half hours late. Quite co-incidentally (!) in perfect time to operate a combined LH955 and 957 back to FRA.
We boarded at 11:55 for a 12:10 pushback. The de-icers finally arrived at 16:00 and took 40 minutes to de-ice the A320.
Meal service was carried out on the ground but they didn't bother to request a restock of the drinks trolleys during the delay so there was very limited service after take off.
The pilots had run out of hours, but thankfully there were two dead-heading pilots on board who took over.
We finally arrived 4 and a half hours late. Quite co-incidentally (!) in perfect time to operate a combined LH955 and 957 back to FRA.
Dec 4, 2017, 8:03 am
#8
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Dec 5, 2017, 4:18 am
#9
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In my view, there were no delays caused by the snow - it was too light, wet and not lying. All delays were caused by lack of de-icing personnel and/or equipment.
We boarded at 11:55 for a 12:10 pushback. The de-icers finally arrived at 16:00 and took 40 minutes to de-ice the A320.
Meal service was carried out on the ground but they didn't bother to request a restock of the drinks trolleys during the delay so there was very limited service after take off.
The pilots had run out of hours, but thankfully there were two dead-heading pilots on board who took over.
We finally arrived 4 and a half hours late. Quite co-incidentally (!) in perfect time to operate a combined LH955 and 957 back to FRA.
We boarded at 11:55 for a 12:10 pushback. The de-icers finally arrived at 16:00 and took 40 minutes to de-ice the A320.
Meal service was carried out on the ground but they didn't bother to request a restock of the drinks trolleys during the delay so there was very limited service after take off.
The pilots had run out of hours, but thankfully there were two dead-heading pilots on board who took over.
We finally arrived 4 and a half hours late. Quite co-incidentally (!) in perfect time to operate a combined LH955 and 957 back to FRA.
Dec 6, 2017, 2:39 pm
#10
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I’m not going to file a claim - I have better things to do with my time.
LH’s attitude does really annoy me. I am a corporate lawyer. If I buy-in a service for a client and something goes wrong, I get sued. With LH they don’t accept responsibility and we can’t sue the supplier as we don’t have a contract with them.
At at least I now know what the status stars are there for. My 2 stars means LH treat me with twice as much contempt as a 1 star SEN.
LH’s attitude does really annoy me. I am a corporate lawyer. If I buy-in a service for a client and something goes wrong, I get sued. With LH they don’t accept responsibility and we can’t sue the supplier as we don’t have a contract with them.
At at least I now know what the status stars are there for. My 2 stars means LH treat me with twice as much contempt as a 1 star SEN.
Dec 10, 2017, 6:53 am
#11
Join Date: Feb 2015
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Good afternoon,
My flight from Geneva to Prague via Frankfurt today evening got cancelled (due to bad weather). I was said that all LH/LX/OS/SN flights today are fully booked so they have rebooked me on a flight tomorrow morning via Zurich.
Is there any refund I am eligible for despite the fact that the cancellation was caused by bad weather? I did not take the hotel accommodation that was proposed but can someone tell me if my taxi rides both in Geneva and in Prague will be refunded by LH in case I will ask for a refund?
Thank you and have a nice weekend!
My flight from Geneva to Prague via Frankfurt today evening got cancelled (due to bad weather). I was said that all LH/LX/OS/SN flights today are fully booked so they have rebooked me on a flight tomorrow morning via Zurich.
Is there any refund I am eligible for despite the fact that the cancellation was caused by bad weather? I did not take the hotel accommodation that was proposed but can someone tell me if my taxi rides both in Geneva and in Prague will be refunded by LH in case I will ask for a refund?
Thank you and have a nice weekend!
Dec 10, 2017, 11:33 am
#12
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I’m not going to file a claim - I have better things to do with my time.
LH’s attitude does really annoy me. I am a corporate lawyer. If I buy-in a service for a client and something goes wrong, I get sued. With LH they don’t accept responsibility and we can’t sue the supplier as we don’t have a contract with them.
At at least I now know what the status stars are there for. My 2 stars means LH treat me with twice as much contempt as a 1 star SEN.
LH’s attitude does really annoy me. I am a corporate lawyer. If I buy-in a service for a client and something goes wrong, I get sued. With LH they don’t accept responsibility and we can’t sue the supplier as we don’t have a contract with them.
At at least I now know what the status stars are there for. My 2 stars means LH treat me with twice as much contempt as a 1 star SEN.
Better stick to M&A
If you buy-in a service for a client (and sell it as your own) and something goes wrong, you are only responsible if it is somebody's fault. If you buy in a service for al client and act as an agent only (what I normally do) you are only responsible for choosing a reliable service and not for mistakes they make.