Flying Lawyer

Could you kindly explain why this is a EU261 situation? In my personal belief you need to present yourself in time at the gate. But I could certainly be wrong. And I appears pretty normal to me that an airline requests to scan a passport before issuing a boarding pass for travel to the US. Happy to learn! And MCT is the minimum for a legal connection at an airport not a guaranteed connection I would personally never use a MCT connection at an airport like FRA unless I travel Schengen to Schengen or similar easy connections.

YuropFlyer

You seem to be mixing up IDB (where you indeed have to be present at the gate in time) and "regular" EU261 compensation (where a missed connection - which is what we've here counts)

OP booked a legal connection, on one ticket, Ex-EU, arrived later than 4 hours his final destination. Without weather or other issues being responsible for the delay which would make the airline not being at fault.

So, he's definitely eligible for EU261.

Flying Lawyer

Could you once again explain to me as a known dummy?

OP booked a flight from Copenhagen to Frankfurt and further on to SFO, most likely on a SAS (under LH codeshare) and UA connection. Flight arrived in Frankfurt in time. Assuming that the inbound flight is a A320 service he should have arrived at a gate position. For what reason ever he did not make it to his connection with his lap-child in time. Why is this within the responsibility of the airline?

YuropFlyer

I'll try to explain it to you as easy as possible:

OP books a ticket with a valid connection.

Airline (Doesn't matter who) can't issue BP at point of origin (but apparently can check-through luggage) for the whole journey, tells OP he'll get it at the gate of his next flight.

OP - despite having a small child with him - makes it on time (before boarding closes, from what I understand) to the Gate in FRA, where he's denied a boarding pass (that's NOT denied boarding, but that's probably a difference only from the legal point of view) as they've stopped Check-In for the flight.

Probably the flight is delayed as they'll have to remove his luggage.

If you offer such a connection, and your pax won't make it for whatever reason he can't be blame for (delayed flight, no Cobus 3000 available, long queues without a "departing soon" fast lane, whatever) it's EU261 time.

This is clearly not the case of some Indian teenager girls who went on a shopping spree with Dadies money in duty free land.. but the case of a pax that booked a valid connection, and got delayed by a night because of airlines inability. Which means, EU261 compensation.

bedeve

Exectly ^^

warakorn

EC261/2004 does not look only on a single segment, but the ticket itself.
OP booked a ticket CPH-SFO.
It does not count how much the OP was delayed on CPH-FRA, it only counts how much the OP was delayed into SFO.

The airline may only deny the EC261/2004 claim by proving extraordinary circumstances or prove that it was the OPs fault to miss the connection.
According to the account of the OP, the OP is not at fault.

Flying Lawyer

OP did not hold a boarding pass for his onward connecting, so obviously was not checked in due to circumstances we do not now.

I have experienced it more than once that a boarding pass for on onward flight could not be issued at the departure airport. For very good reason you are advised before landing "if you do not hold a boarding pass see the next transfer desk" - this did obviously not happen. Given that, the OP did not follow the given advice but "ran" to the connecting gate. Assuming that he arrived on the LH flight at the A Gates and departed on UA 902 from the Z Gates this is generally doable.

The Airline brought the Pax to Frankfurt in time for a connection that is generally doable. The Pax however refrained from getting a boarding pass asap but "ran" to the gate (I have difficulties to understand how you can ran 40 minutes from the A gates to the Z gates).

This will be a hard time for the Pax in court because prima facies it appears that the Pax did (a) did not follow the rules (did not get a boarding pass asap) and (b) was a "bit" slow in getting from one gate to another.

EU 261 is not a blank cheque for every misconnection, even though waracorn and YuropFlyer like to present it that way.

I would personally would try it but prepared to have a tough ride and be very careful about the story I am going to tell. I am pretty sure the agencies would not take on the case, but trying to hand over this case to them could be a first sanity check.

Germanfflyer

Well he was present at the gate in time for the flight - that is all that counts for EU261!
The agencys are no sanity check really as they only take the very easy cases - but of course if the DO take this case that means it is really obviously an easy case !

YuropFlyer

There are reasons why lawyers are usually not invited to parties

Flying Lawyer

In all your quotes I have never seen any reference to difficult cases but a lot of alleged successful cases without any reference. And certainly: You need to be checked in in time and need to be at the gate in time. There is a difference between "Check in deadline" and "Gate closing". Check in deadline in Frankfurt is 40 minutes, boarding most likely 30 minutes before departure.

Flying Lawyer

Lawyers are second only to MDs the most beloved persons on parties because everybody believes we have nothing better to do than to give legal advise for free between 10pm and midnight. That will most likely never happen to a technical engineer (imagine: I have a little problem with the nuclear power station in my garden)

YuropFlyer

Trust me, IT engineers are MUCH more popular.. (and no, I won't fix your computer...)

Germanfflyer and warakorn said it well enough again already, OP go ahead and claim your EU261 in whatever way that is most convenient for you (doesn't Denmark have some sort of small claim courts?)

sunseeker

Arriving at the gate 20 minutes prior to departure for an United flight without a boarding pass is madness.
Still boarding could have been possible presenting a luggage tag, a ticket print AND proving valid ESTA for ALL pax.

looks like we will never learn about the full story...

YuropFlyer

Madness is more like the agents at the starting destination not being able to check-through on one ticket (but the luggage can be checked through..) - all on "great" *A carriers (which is less compatible with each other than Easyjet is with Emirates ), on one ticket..

I see absolutely no reason why OP wouldn't have had a valid ESTA. Most likely they wouldn't have checked him in at all otherwise.

It's fairly easy. Whoever sold OP this ticket was crazy to do so, OP was slightly crazy to fly LH/UA , and unless someone brings evidence why he couldn't claim EU261, I'm sure he'll be able to do so.

Steve_19

I don't think the reactions are unusual at all.

OP (as their first post on FT) notes they "take a lot of international flights", but seems to think a 1 hour connection with 1 year old at FRA is no issue with no chance of problems.....

The BP not being issued is not unusual for me as this has happened several times to me for reasons I have not been able to figure out (but as I always make sure I have a decent connection time no issue).

OP then ends with asking us to confirm it is "fishy" - implying to me that they think there is some conspiracy against them by LH or some other party? Really?