Non-flexible Y fares (Y fare, not eco in general)??
Mar 3, 2010, 4:03 pm
#1
Original Poster
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: NUE
Programs: LH SEN (I miss my HON days), Sixt Diamond, everything else is silver by now
Posts: 139
Non-flexible Y fares (Y fare, not eco in general)??
I'm sure someone will tell me to read the fine print, but I think it is a very misleading situation:
Two of my recent flights were booked on short notice (2 days before the flight). (NUE-BRU, and HAJ-LHR for what it matters). Costs of both flights were over 900 euros and the booking and receipt showed Y (i.e. full flexible eco) as the booking class/fare bucket.
To my surprised when I wanted to rebook one flight and cancel the other, I was told by the hotline that "these are special Y fares. Rebooking is fifty euros and they cannot be refunded"
Now I don't know about you, but when I book a shorthaul flight for close to 1000 euros, state specifically state a Y fare, I would assume that I get a full flexible product. Yes, I should have clicked on the fare details link when booking, but I find this highly annoying.
It actually puts the frequent traveller who automatically thinks "Y=fully flexible" at a disadvantage.
If LHRelate is reading this, I would like to see this more prominently visible when booking.
Two of my recent flights were booked on short notice (2 days before the flight). (NUE-BRU, and HAJ-LHR for what it matters). Costs of both flights were over 900 euros and the booking and receipt showed Y (i.e. full flexible eco) as the booking class/fare bucket.
To my surprised when I wanted to rebook one flight and cancel the other, I was told by the hotline that "these are special Y fares. Rebooking is fifty euros and they cannot be refunded"
Now I don't know about you, but when I book a shorthaul flight for close to 1000 euros, state specifically state a Y fare, I would assume that I get a full flexible product. Yes, I should have clicked on the fare details link when booking, but I find this highly annoying.
It actually puts the frequent traveller who automatically thinks "Y=fully flexible" at a disadvantage.
If LHRelate is reading this, I would like to see this more prominently visible when booking.
Mar 3, 2010, 4:11 pm
#2
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Worldwide
Posts: 12,949
What's worse, the fully-flexible Y-class fare was only ~14 EUR more:
[KVS Availability Tool 5.3.9995/Diamond - Sabre: Fares/DotRes/US]
[KVS Availability Tool 5.3.9995/Diamond - Sabre: Fares/DotRes/US]
Code:
NUE Nuremberg Metro / Nuremberg Apt DE = NUE [EDDN] BRU Brussels Metro / Brussels Ntl BE = BRU CRL [EBBR] SAT 01 May 2010 | MON 31 May 2010 | R/T | Economy Carrier From To Fare Cur Fare Basis --------- ------ ---- -------- ---- -------- --- -- ---------- LH NUE BRU 79 USD E99B LH NUE BRU 95 USD EKOMBI21 LH NUE BRU 163 USD TKOMBI21 LH NUE BRU 206 USD WABASIC1 LH NUE BRU 296 USD LKOMBI21 LH NUE BRU 332 USD VABASIC1 LH NUE BRU 494 USD QABASIC1 LH NUE BRU 586 USD KKOMBI21 LH NUE BRU 651 USD HABASIC1 LH NUE BRU 732 USD GKOMBI21 LH NUE BRU 826 USD PKOMBI21 LH NUE BRU 908 USD MFLEX1 LH NUE BRU 963 USD BFLEX1 LH NUE BRU 1155 USD YABASIC1 LH NUE BRU 1170 USD YFLEX1
Mar 3, 2010, 4:12 pm
#3
Original Poster
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: NUE
Programs: LH SEN (I miss my HON days), Sixt Diamond, everything else is silver by now
Posts: 139
Great there should be a big blinking flash banner announcing this when I book. 
What's worse, the fully-flexible Y-class fare was only ~14 EUR more:
[KVS Availability Tool 5.3.9995/Diamond - Sabre: Fares/DotRes/US]
[KVS Availability Tool 5.3.9995/Diamond - Sabre: Fares/DotRes/US]
Code:
NUE Nuremberg Metro / Nuremberg Apt DE = NUE [EDDN] BRU Brussels Metro / Brussels Ntl BE = BRU CRL [EBBR] SAT 01 May 2010 | MON 31 May 2010 | R/T | Economy Carrier From To Fare Cur Fare Basis --------- ------ ---- -------- ---- -------- --- -- ---------- LH NUE BRU 79 USD E99B LH NUE BRU 95 USD EKOMBI21 LH NUE BRU 163 USD TKOMBI21 LH NUE BRU 206 USD WABASIC1 LH NUE BRU 296 USD LKOMBI21 LH NUE BRU 332 USD VABASIC1 LH NUE BRU 494 USD QABASIC1 LH NUE BRU 586 USD KKOMBI21 LH NUE BRU 651 USD HABASIC1 LH NUE BRU 732 USD GKOMBI21 LH NUE BRU 826 USD PKOMBI21 LH NUE BRU 908 USD MFLEX1 LH NUE BRU 963 USD BFLEX1 LH NUE BRU 1155 USD YABASIC1 LH NUE BRU 1170 USD YFLEX1
Mar 3, 2010, 5:18 pm
#5
Join Date: May 2006
Location: BRS (Bristol, UK)
Programs: LH SEN/*G
Posts: 1,266
It seems really strange to offer a "special offer" price on the very highest, and least booked, fare class?
Aside from the obvious and understandable problems it's caused here, is it really going to change anyone's decision to travel or not travel if a Y fare is €960,- or €950,-??
Sometimes computer driven fare algorithms can do very illogical things.
Aside from the obvious and understandable problems it's caused here, is it really going to change anyone's decision to travel or not travel if a Y fare is €960,- or €950,-??
Sometimes computer driven fare algorithms can do very illogical things.
Mar 3, 2010, 6:12 pm
#7
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: SZG
Posts: 3,936
wow thats bitter! sorry to hear that pokeshot! i honestly don't think you could have avoided that by reading the fare rules on the LH website, whenever i press that link it shows very general info that is 99% useless or outright wrong!
might be actually something we should take up with LHrelate...
might be actually something we should take up with LHrelate...
Mar 3, 2010, 6:42 pm
#8
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: BRU
Programs: LH SEN, SN Gold, Eurostar Carte Blanche, BA, QF, AF
Posts: 6,856
Actually, you "just" need to select the right option at the top:
http://250kb.de/GMiUqeF
And it is also described quite clearly at the confirmation screen:
http://250kb.de/Wn3Z5Qq
Still, I think it is outrageous to offer such a fare!
http://250kb.de/GMiUqeF
And it is also described quite clearly at the confirmation screen:
http://250kb.de/Wn3Z5Qq
Still, I think it is outrageous to offer such a fare!
Mar 3, 2010, 6:42 pm
#9
Company Representative - Lufthansa Airlines
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: East Meadow, NY
Programs: Official LH Real Person
Posts: 726
Hi pokeshot,
I saw your tweet already (and responded there too); I will look into that when I get into the office tomorrow.
Agreed that it seems unusual and I can understand why you thought it was fully flexible.
Will let you know what I find out.
Best,
Michelle
I saw your tweet already (and responded there too); I will look into that when I get into the office tomorrow.
Agreed that it seems unusual and I can understand why you thought it was fully flexible.
Will let you know what I find out.
Best,
Michelle
Mar 4, 2010, 1:25 am
#10
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: FRA
Posts: 582
I can only say one more thing:
Guys, swich your business to BA, AB etc.!!!!
LH is really starting to cheat us. No matter if it is concerning status perks, ob-board amenities, service,.... LH is not worth to spend any more money on....
A non-flexible Y fare is as ridiculous as the new "enhancement" conerning "Fuel surgarge belongs to the fare, so we can not do refunds on this any more" while you still have to pay for fuel surgarge on awards....
LH does not get it - it is the wrong way to go to p*** off all your valued customers.
Just sad that I have been so loyal for so many years - just to see all the benefits beeing erased step by step now.
Guys, swich your business to BA, AB etc.!!!!
LH is really starting to cheat us. No matter if it is concerning status perks, ob-board amenities, service,.... LH is not worth to spend any more money on....
A non-flexible Y fare is as ridiculous as the new "enhancement" conerning "Fuel surgarge belongs to the fare, so we can not do refunds on this any more" while you still have to pay for fuel surgarge on awards....
LH does not get it - it is the wrong way to go to p*** off all your valued customers.
Just sad that I have been so loyal for so many years - just to see all the benefits beeing erased step by step now.
Mar 4, 2010, 1:32 am
#11
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: MUC (home), DUS (office), XXX (customer)
Programs: LH, AB, SPG, CC, Sixt, EC
Posts: 6,334
Mar 4, 2010, 1:35 am
#12
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: CGN (Cologne, Germany), travel agent, hardcore Sabre user
Programs: AA Lifetime Gold, BA, DL, LH, HH Diamond, Bonvoy Platinum, AX Centurion
Posts: 445
For me as a travel agent this is not news, but I sometimes still fall into this trap! Our computers are programmed to ticket the lowest price possible for a given itinerary and I can't recall how often I had to void a ticket because I had let my system issue a restricted Y ticket while unrestricted Y would have been just 10 EUR or so more. To do so, we have to manually override the best price option, which can easily get overlooked. Just one more example of absolutely weird airline pricing...
Mar 4, 2010, 2:15 am
#14
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: London, UK and Southern France
Posts: 18,364
In any event, IATA recommendations on fare type nomenclature are just that: recommendations.
Mar 4, 2010, 2:49 am
#15
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: FRA
Posts: 582
Furthermore, one can buy crazy routings for domestic flights: FRA-BRE can be done via AMS using KLM etc.....
And for long-haul:
I will just try to get 1mio. miles by "Die Welt", "FTD" subscriptions, credit card spendings etc. and then buy premium cabin tickets with miles. It is just that easy!
Lufthansa has created so much trouble that I see so many (previous very loyal) customers thinking about alternatives.... And they are even willing to spend more money or do one more connection, just to avoid LH.
So LH, you are so much on the wrong way.... It is not that people do fly less or have less money to spend - they are just p***** off that they are treated so bad when flying LH....
LH has to change its attitude towards the customer instead of decreasing quality and service to save money....
Saving money decreaes income while increasing service and quality would result in a big increase of income and profit....
I can already see the next enhancement:
"Due to customers feedback and to further enhance our service level, HON Circle members are invited into our exclusive First Class lounge and terminal facilities whenever flying Lufthansa*. HON Circle members are offered the exclusive option to take one guest into the lounge. Further guests are allowed provided the guest is travelling on the same ticket**.
* Please note that First Class lounge and -terminal access is not allowed when booked in ticket class O, X, I, E, T, L, S, W, H, M, V, Q, B.
** For every guest starting with the second guest, a handling fee of Euro 200 is charged. HON Circle members are offered the exclusive option to pay this fee directly at the lounge entrance. Alternatively, lounge access can be bought for 80,000 miles."