Latin Pass Point Transfers to Partner Programs
 

Has anyone successfully transferred points from Latin Pass to one of their partner's frequent flyer programs. If so, were the points then used with the partners of the programs into which they were transferred?

There has been discussion in other threads of such transfers leading to American, Air France, Continental, etc. Perhaps we can consolidate, and in this thread document, the absolutes, i.e., you can transfer and use points here, but not there . . . documented as follows . . .

This would benefit all of us who made Latin Pass runs as we try to get the best returns on our investment.

I believe the programs and signup URL's are:

Aces/Premium Pass Aces http://www.acescolombia.com/
Partner(s): Air France, Continental
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/Forum30/HTML/000062.html
Reward Chart from previous thread per FreeFlyer 9-10-2000

Aeropostal/Aero Pass http://www.aeropostal.com/ingles/miembros.htm
Partner(s):?

Aviancia/?,?
Partner(s): ?

COPA/? http://www.copaair.com/english/welcome.htm
Partner(s): ?

SAETA/? http://www.saeta.com.ec/
Partner(s): ?

GRUPO TACA/Distancia http://168.243.149.70/distancia/indexeng.asp
Partner(s): American
http://www.grupotaca.com/ing/distancia/aereos.html
Distancia’s reward chart for AA
(though recent reports indicate problems using bonus miles to get AA reward tickets). per
FreeFlyer 9-10-2000


[This message has been edited by Here-I-Go (edited 09-11-2000).]

[This message has been edited by Here-I-Go (edited 09-11-2000).]

LP will not permit mileage transfers to OnePass, which is COPA's frequent flyer program.

In addition to the LP partner airlines of KLM, US Air, TWA, and National, the only other choices to burn miles are as follows:

Aces Premium Pass: rewards on Continental and Air France
Reward chart from previous thread

Taca's Distancia: rewards on AA (though recent reports indicate problems using bonus miles to get AA reward tickets).
Distancia's reward chart for AA


[This message has been edited by freeflyer (edited 09-11-2000).]

Please note my original posting at the beginning of this thread is being updated to include responses so the info can be aggregated in one spot.

Has anyone transferred then USED miles in a member's partner airline?

I transferred 200K to the ACES airline program shortly after I received my Million. I was told I could use the miles to get an award on Air France (Two FC tickets to Europe). I called ACES today and was informed I couldn't use them on Air France and that basically I could only use them to fly on ACES. ACES flies no-where I want to go so I asked about transferring them back to LatinPass and he said that probably couldn't be done.

Has anyone else had the same problems? Does the program have the right to distinguish between earned miles and Million Mile bonus miles?

I had the exact scenario with Taca's Distancia....How can they distinguish which miles you transferred.??.some DID originate with air, auto and hotel activity....

Reading the legal fine print in the LatinPass member's guide, it basically says that they can change whatever parts of the program they want without any notice. I would think the Premium Pass and Distancia programs have similar provisions.

Miles in Distancia (and I would imagine Premium Pass) can still be redeemed using their LatinPass chart, which includes rewards on TWA, KLM, US, and National. So all is not lost.

On a more positive note, has anyone noticed the LP discounted special rewards for flights within North America? 15k-econ. 30k-biz. This was supposed to run from Jan. 15 to May 30, but it's now Oct. 1 to May 30.

If I may editorialize for a moment, I still think we got more than a good deal out of this mileage promotion. Over 100 flyertalkers took advantage of it, much to the surpise of LatinPass, and I can understand them putting some sort of restrictions on the use of these miles, such as limiting transfers to other programs or restricting which airlines we can use them on. I'm not saying I like it, but I can live with it. Are the LatinPass member and partner airline choices so bad? I don't think so. I paid $1,300 for my ticket and earned 500,000 miles, and to be honest, I'm just glad the program hasn't gone bust altogether! But I do agree that they should improve their system for getting reward tickets on their partner airlines, though.


[This message has been edited by freeflyer (edited 09-18-2000).]

Maybe its time to give LatinPass some media coverage, the same way it was all over the newspapers and on TV what a great bonus/promotion they had and bla, bla, bla. How now they are not honoring what their program promised and how they are changing all the rules and provisions of the program. Maybe all those people who at that time made LatinPass close the promotion cause they wanted to be on TV and be quoted on newspapers are willing to go out and tell the public what a big bluff the whole thing is. After all, all the concerns people had at that time, before investing all that money in crazy itineraries / hotel stays / car rental etc, are slowly becoming reality. Some people may end up, yes with a million miles, but unable to use them ! http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/mad.gif http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/frown.gif

I agree with freeflyer that the LP million was a wonderful promo and LP ought to get some slack/benefit of the doubt. On the other hand the worst way to handle a marketing promotion mistake is to take it out on the customer. All that goodwill you were after in the first place goes out the window and you still have to honor the promo (sooner or later). I really don't know where a reasonable middle ground lies but I think it would be a good idea to find it.

As part of the discussion though I do need to add that just because LP puts something in the rules doesn't mean it is enforcable as part of a contractual agreement. When FF programs in the past attempted 'sudden' changes the view of the concerned regulatory agencies was that it was a reasonable expectation of people in FF programs to have notice of changes regardless of what the rules say. This is fairly standard for any so-called contract. If the contract or clause in it fails to make muster as enforcable/legal etc., then it does not apply.

Now, I am not suggesting we try to stick it to LP on the issue of changes or anything else. I really do think there ought to be a 'reasonable' solution. It isn't about grabbing the most benefit and it isn't about making it hard to enjoy the benefit. As I see it we do want everyone to be happy, including LatinPass. I would be eager to open a dialog amonst FT members on this issue either in this thread or a new one.

It would be my approach to use any threats or bullying as a very much last resort. It isn't nice and might not be effective either. On some issues it seems pretty clear to me where fair lies (if miles were transferred based on one set of information then if that no longer applies, the very miniumum is to undo the transfer BTW, I have not transferred any miles, it is just an issue of clear cut fairness to me). On issues like transfer limitations, use on partners 'once-removed' (such as Continental via Aces) I do know what I think ought to be allowed but also think there is room to be considerate of all positions.

Well, these ideas are not meant to be comprehensive or exclusive, I think discussion is the one thing most called for, and absent any rash or extreme action. As an issue overlying the LP situation I think FT has the ability to influence, by the actions and opinions of its members, the future of FF programs either for better or worse.......... kind regards http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif

Myriad:

The only reason people are bailing to other programs is Latin Pass doesn't seem to have any seats available to use. My scenario then is I want to go from Dallas to Myrtle Beach can I get a ticket on USAIR ticketed for February and go standby in October. Your thoughts.

Hi Bobby, I hear you on the rez problems people have been bringing up, sounds positively antique. My post wasn't meant to say there were not real problems, just that we ought to try to work with them a bit rather than get unpleasant. I wonder if anyone has approached LP about a discussion of changes/ways to make LP work better/fair treatment of LP 'mileionares' etc. Not a hothead phone call demanding immediate justice (lord knows I have made a lifetime's supply of those myself) but something thought through, perhaps discussed beforehand here on FT. I guess that was what I was trying to get started. If you think of the human resources LP is going to expend on the tortuous rez process you would think they might have a real interest in streamlining it.

As for your specific trip needs there do seem to be people who get rez then manipulate them to the dates they want. As I don't have my million yet (ANOTHER 3 weeks they say again) I have no personal experience with it. I will be able to do most of my bookings way out in advance and with a lot of flexibility, so I am hoping to have not too much trouble. Still, I think everyone would be well served by an 'adjustment' to the methods used for this process.

There's a good and relevant thread going on in The Buzz right now about transferring LP points into Marriott Rewards points, which can then be redeemed for travel with any of their airline partners (UA, AA ... just about everybody).

Apparently LP's monthly transfer limit from LatinPass Promotion Bonus Miles to Marriot Rewards points 30,000 LP miles. That equals 60,000 per month, or 360,000 per year.

The best tip I heard there was that in the case of Rewards redemptions on UA, Marriott will simply dump the miles into your Mileage Plus account and it's up to you to arrange the travel. Neat!

[This message has been edited by essxjay (edited 09-19-2000).]

I'm with you, let's be nice to them and if they improve I will leave them there for ten years or more, my problem is 3 months later still no bonus. Then I hear people who can't use them. Then there told they can transfer them to Aces like MileTex did then they change their mind. How iwll he use 200,000 on Aces they don't fly to Texas, he basically just lost 200,000 miles if they won't let him transfer to Air France. I would like to use 8-10 a year on TWA or USAIR that's all I'm looking for. I'm in Bolivia and have some fear in giving my Latin Pass number because I wonder will it post.

Mryriad has a good idea. We should try to help LP to help us. But start by facing the fact that we are trying to maximize the value of our big bonuses and they are trying to minimize the pain. However, it is in neither party's best interests if LP is bankrupted by delivering on the awards attached to our bonuses. It is also not in anyone's best interest for them to cheat us out of anything and thereby prompt an ugly reaction like a lawsuit or bad press.

So far, I think LP has only gone too far in respect to the misinformation about transfers to LP member airlines and limiting Hilton transfers to 30k per month. These changes should have been made only after giving substantial advance notice and only after completing the paperwork and awarding the bonus miles to all who qualified. The Hilton change is particularly troubling because LP, at Randy's urging, specicially stated that the bonus miles could be transferred to Hilton. I believe this statement was even in the MM bonus FAQ posted on the LP Web site (anyone have a copy?). While they haven't (yet) prohibited transfers, the monthly cap is inconsistent with the stated policy. From LP's perspective the monthly cap may seem like a necessary middle-ground.

The Marriott transfer option was too new to warrant alot of complaining about the cap or the lack of advance notice. In fact, we should be praising LP for being willing to make ANY new options available for use of our miles.

If they would just solve the difficulty in getting partner awards, people wouldn't want to transfer so many miles. But maybe partner awards cost them as much as or more than Hilton or Marriott points. Does anyone know?

Here-I-Go has proposed a private area for the LP millionaires to have private discussions that LP can't monitor. I think this is a good way to proceed. We can also post here on FT, stressing those ideas that work for both sides and that help LP to satisfy us while remaining solvent.

Please see link
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/Forum30/HTML/000087.html

Thank you . . .

dhacker wrote:
I hesitated to post this, but of course LatinPass already knows what was in its own FAQ and the terms of the promotion.

So, we still have this "right" to transfer miles, just now there's a bit of a control in place. One could argue that LP is being more than generous by letting us transfer any bonus miles at all to Marriott.

"One could argue that LP is being more than generous by letting us transfer any bonus miles at all to Marriott."

LP is not being "more than generous." Their bonus offered one million miles, not one million pseudomiles. If they didn't want to deliver on their promise, they shouldn't have offered the bonus to begin with.

PLEASE see the thread at:
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/Forum30/HTML/000087.html

When you look at the current situation that LatinPass is creating they are actually going to lose more business or "restricting" the miles. I have so many Amex miles that I could transfer to LP and I often fly TWA and US air. Would I give my LatinPass number to these entities in the future knowing that I have only one flight a day on Taca to get out of San Francisco? I think not!! What should be a great relationship in steering business to LP is forcing me to only "useup" my million and not replenish with revenue generating business for LP. They were not honest with their promotion. I specifically asked questions about booking KLM, TWA, and US Air and was told that it was no problem and the flights were relatively easy to get. Right now I've been working on one flight in January with KLM or TWA and have been calling and faxing since July and still don't have flights. Their program is a disaster and probably one of the WORST airline mileage programs around today. Or are they just treating their "millionaire" flyers that way?

I can see two sides here.... I really don't fault LP for closing major loopholes - they are a business and have to survive. But they should NOT leave people stranded - like the folks who have already transferred their miles to other programs but had their use severely limited (like Mile Tex). There should be some understanding shown here - these folks should be allowed to transfer their miles back.

FTers are not just the recipents of a generous mileage bonus, but the guinea pigs who are fleshing the bugs out of LP's system. It's a two-way street and it's unquestionable that LP has benefited from our participation. As the kinks are worked out of their program LP should be gracious with us - as I'm sure they would like us to be with them.

I have no problem with an off-line discussion, although I hope its kept to a minimum - I really enjoy Flyeralk and its format and would hate to see its value diluted.

Hiker Guy

I can't help but think that the limits on transfering miles may come from pressure from Hilton itself, seeing that a barrage of LatinPass transfers may dilute their program, and create ripple affects as people move large sums of miles from HHonors into other airline programs. The next thing you know, SkyMiles will wonder why people are suddenly transfering hundreds of thousands of miles via HHonors from LatinPass-- and it may jeopardize Hilton's relationship with its other partners. So, from a business perspective, I can understand why the partners want to impose some limitations-- just as LatinPass wants to preserve its own partnerships. Unfortunately, since LatinPass is the only entity that can directly affect the rules, they come across as the "bad guys" as they modify rules based on its partners' pressures.

Frankly, given my return for money invested in the program, I'm content with the travel options offered through the LatinPass carriers, plus TWA, US Air, and KLM. With the exception of US to Asia, these carriers pretty much cover the bulk of destinations with OK- not great, but OK- connections, but again, how can we really complain? If I can fly to Chile for pennies on the dollar, I don't mind spending $60 for a night in Miami or 2 hours between flights. And as far as LatinPass's credibility, I have confidence they will live up to their word. Considering they represent a dozen carriers, any bad press they may receive will directly affect the member and partner airlines, so I feel the other carriers, especially the member airlines, will back LatinPass up.

[This message has been edited by Viajero Joven (edited 09-23-2000).]

Viajero Joven -- The transfer restrictions originated from LatinPass, not Hilton. No other Hilton partner has transfer restrictions. Even miles from the oneworld promotions were allowed to be transferred from AA to HHonors without limits. And this is just speculation, but the limit may very well violate LP's agreement with HHonors.

I spoke to the Premium Pass rep. at Aces Airlines where I had transferred 200K to their program from Latin Pass. They have agreed to transfer back to Latin Pass all 200K. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif

Really thought I had thrown away all those miles. They are a really great airline and this is another example of Aces great customer service. If they only flew other places http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/wink.gif

The Premium Pass representative whom you spoke with should run for political office.

It takes a very special kind of person to lie to a customer, violate written program rules, and then make him feel as though he has been blessed with "another example of Aces great customer service."

You're lucky ACES transfered back. I haven't had the same luck with Distancia (TACA.) I've written four separate letters to different people and haven't gotten any replies. They denied my request to fly AA because I never flew on them before and my mileage transfer was bonus miles. I pointed out that I flew throughout Central and South America in Business Class (majority on Grupo Taca) and they couldn't answer. They are forgetting that in addition to our MILLION we did get some actual miles for air, hotel and car. I did get one ticket from Distancia which was ticketed in economy instead of business. When I went to pick it up the ticket office called Salvador to admit their error and head office insisted on a $25. change fee even though I didn't have a "ticket" but it was "authorized" for ticketing. The TACA employee said to them on the phone that it was her error--which it was--their reply was SOMEONE HAS TO PAY!! Such Bull. Boy do my UA miles look good right now!

Update transfers to Hilton and Marriott...
FYI... I put in a request to transfer
30000 to Hilton and to Marriott a couple of weeks ago and was told the request looked fine and the the transfer would be made last Monday. I found out today that I need to resubmit the request again. The original was not processed since the rule now is 1 transfer up to 30000 a month to a hotel program. I didn't ask if you could do 15000
to 2 programs. The key was 30000 max transfer. I didn't see this in the rules before just the 30000 max to Hilton and 30000
max to Marriott.