777 seat map
 

http://www.travelquality.com/phpbb2/....php?p=869#869

Ouch! Y will be really tight at 31"!

johan

Didn´t they promise flat bed type seats in WBC ? This looks really disappointing.

IMO LH is a main competitor for KLM and as they have announced their premium biz product to come soon KL looks not so good with this seating chart...

However if they would offer those 'crew-rest' areas overhead for C pax... http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/wink.gif

Yes, they did. The seats will apparently not be of the cocoon type, though.

I agree, this looks really disappointing. Pitch reduced to 58" on the port and starboard sides, and a 2-3-2 configuration. KLM currently only uses this configuration on MD11 aircraft. The 777's cabin is only 15cm wider.

WBC is KLM's flagship product, but with the exception of seat pitch they generally lag behind most of the competition. The introduction of the 777 ought to be an opportunity to narrow the gap.

johan

The 2-3-2, while disappointing per se, is unfortunately the standard in C for the 777. I can only think of 2-class CO, DL, and SQ 772-ER's with 2-2-2 in their business cabins.

While KL also only has 2 classes, KL's WBC is usually a bit more accessible (either paying by cash or miles) than those 3 carriers' biz cabins, I think.

And perhaps the absence of space-hungry cocoons can be blamed on the Dutch people being the tallest in the world? http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/wink.gif


As for the economy cabin, the number of desirable seats is definitely down on the 747 http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/frown.gif

Looking forward to some KL A330's. Airbus' argument that passengers prefer 2-2-2 C and 2-4-2 Y is hitting closer to home now...

Frankly I find that (as nice as the KLM people I've dealt with have been) their service in Y & C tend to lag (to say the least) behind most of the competition.

hi,

what about the original link? does not seem to work anymore ...

31" is the same as Ryanair, Easyjet, Buzz etc etc. How can you expect people to fly with you in Y when you now have the chance to step ahead of the competition and increase seat pitch. How long will it be before we have a trans atlantic Ryanair ??? People will pay a little more for comfort and for sure it is better to fill a plane with passengers who will pay 5% more to know they will be comfortable when they get off a 10 hour flight

Try this instead :

http://members.home.nl/tqam/klmseatplan.jpg

johan

31" in Y for one of the tallest European nations http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif ?

This is very poor. One of the reasons I don't fly on the low-costs is because, where the seat pitch is 29", I genuinely can't fit in the seat. Now, if KLM's doing this transatlantic...

Sorry, KL, you won't find me in a 31" seat across the ocean.

I really dislike the middle seats both in business and economy. The crew on either side always miss you out and getting up is tricky. Combined with all the new stuff they will shove under the seats for entertainment in economy 31 inches is very mean. Like the MD11 there are very few seats worth having in Y. Yuchs!

I'm confused - Ebookers leg room chart give 31' as the average KLM pitch in economy at the moment, so how is the seat pitch in Y in the 777 any different from what we are currently getting? Is it more on 747s currently, but all the fokkers bring the average down?

Incidentally, Ebookers show it as better than easyJet, Ryanair (at 29') VS (at 30'), the same as UA and BA, but worse than SQ, LH, CX, AA, ML, AF and surprisingly Air China!

Hi everyone - been away for a while...good to be back! Here is my 2-pennies' worth:

If we accept the perceived notion that Singapore Airlines [SQ] & Cathay Pacific [CX] are the industry leaders when it comes to in-flight amenities, then here is how KLM's new 777s compare:

58" in C is also what SQ is offering on their new Spacebeds, so I expect we'll have to tuck our legs well under the person in front [very cosy], just like on the SQ Spacebeds. And the SQ 777s in 2 cabin configuration also have a 2-3-2 layout up front:
http://www.singaporeair.com/images/e...B777-200_2.gif

CX claims 60" on their NEW C seats, but that is with the privacy coccoon [which must take up at least 2" of space!], and does not look much more luxurious either. [Not yet available on their 777-200s, according to their own website].

What is far more disappointing is as pointed out, here was a chance for KLM to upgrade its product and distance itself from the likes of Ryanair, yet in Y, it is content to stick with the now cramped 31" pitch. Only the charter and low cost carriers give less by way of room ... those poor long Dutch legs!

However, looking at that SQ seat map, it would appear that KL and SQ have virtually the same number of Y seats, but KL has 5 more C seats, but 1 less toilet! Yet SQ claims a 32" seat pitch in Y...CX has 45 C [old style] and 291 Y seats on their 777-200s.

So, apart from BA's different style C seats, KL's aren't that different from the norm, but those Y seats could really have done with more room.

------------------
KLM FD PE, BMI Gold, AA Platinum, UA Premier, Hilton HHonors Gold

I have the unofficial seatmap for the 777s with no seat numbering. Anyone booked any seats on these yet? Select seating area? best in business and economy? Thanks

I rang KLM in the UK and spoke to a very hepful agent. She told me that they had not yet been supplied with any plans but she had a memo saying that the seats were identical to those on the new NWA A330 300. There is a video and picture of them on the www.nwa.com site.

[This message has been edited by simonsmith (edited 08-18-2003).]

Seat numbers : rows 1 - 5, AC + DEF + GJ.

johan