FD Changes
 

I know this issue has crept up in various other forums in the past, but I have some new info, so thought I'd start a new thread.

Rand FD Helpdesk in AMS this morning [about seat bookings], and while on the phone, thought I'd ask about the impending changes to FD.

This was what I was told:

"Major changes are due to the programme on 23 Oct 02. Every FD member will receive a letter detailing those changes."

What was of concern was that the FD operative I spoke to confirmed that changes were imminent, that they would kick in from 23 Oct, but said that we'd all receive our letters in Oct!! And she was not permitted to tell me any more than that! It felt distinctly like a case of [a] there will be no consultation about the changes, [b] we will not get any notice period either - more a case of "we have changed the programme and by the way it came into effect yesterday!" and [c] "by the way all those points you have earned over the years are now worth peanuts in the new mileage programme, but you won't have any opportunities to spend them before we turn them to peanuts as there is no switch-over period"

Oh well....I liked CSA Czech Airlines when I flew with them recently, and if Skyteam & Wings do merge, I think I'll go over to CSA OK Plus instead!!

------------------
KLM FD RoyalWing, AA Platinum, UA Prem, HHilton Silver

some experienced people from this board should write a group letter about this to KLM immediately as it was done in the LH forum!
in this case we have the chance of writing to them BEFORE all the changes ...


By the way KLM is facing some competition, too, so I dont think they will turn our points into "peanuts" ...

First of all, let me remind you of my phonecall to the FD manager more than one year ago.

He told me, that major improvements are virtually just around the corner. Without making further explanations, he told me about significant improvements especially for SW and RW`s !!

So I guess we don`t have to fear the worst, IMO they will announce some major improvements, that were originally planned for late 2001, but were postponed due to same cost cutting moves after the Sep 11 tragedy...

Further on KLM is in a ridicously nice position after acquiring thousands of new customers with the " Matching Miles" promo......

However Scott C brought up a good point on another topic, which was basicly the fact, that KLM sometimes is simply "unpredictable" !!

Could not agree more, but let`s hope for the best !!

"Unpredictable" is not the FIRST word that leaps into my mind. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/wink.gif

Air NZ just heavily revamped their scheme and everyone on Air NZ board agrees it is far, far worse than it was before. Many are leaving the plan for good.

I agree a sensible period of advance notice should be given.

------------------
~ Glen ~

Well, at least Air NZ has made a timeous announcement.

johan

More like "it came into effect a month ago"!

Mail from FD normally takes 4 to 6 weeks to reach me. Announcements of promotions and special offers routinely arrive well after the promotion has started, or as it is about to expire. (The Swedish rule buster trial is a case in point. Did anybody actually receive the letter before August 15?)

If they mail the letter in October, I'd expect it by Christmas. Makes you wonder if KLM have ever heard of air mail!

From the perspective of a European FD member, why is it so important that FD mirrors WP? Living as I do in Sweden, and given my KLM travel pattern, the current programs suits me just fine. True, it could be tweaked here and there, but wholesale change?

I look forward to "major improvements", but I'll believe it when I see it.

johan

The Air Canada folks mounted a pretty successful defense when Aeroplan was gutted last year. It might be helpful to put together a preemptive letter writing campaign to alert KLM that any changes better have a 'grace period'.

I agree that a joint letter [from as many of us as possible would be preferable] might get some notice at KLM FD.

Regulars here will remember that my partner & I wrote a fairly long letter to Lesley McDermott & Andrea Schiptmann more than 2 months ago, with views of 2 RW members re: the changes. Posted & e-mailed it to them. 6 weeks after posting, I received a reply via e-mail that they could NOT open my Word document attached to the e-mail, but encouragingly asked me to resend without attachments as they were "keen to read our views", so I did resend. However that was 4 weeks ago, and have heard nothing since.

If you would like, I could repost that letter here, and we could make that the starting point of our joint letter, ... or if you prefer, we could start afresh.



------------------
KLM FD RoyalWing, AA Platinum, UA Prem, HHilton Silver

So do we have a volunteer for the letter to KLM? We should get some 20 signatures of members under this letter at least.

Anybody here who could draft the letter in english and dutch?

And some good delivery e-mail adresses...? I still don't know much about the structure of the FD prog...

WKS,

this is a good idea. Unfortunately I am myself one of "those new comped members" and do not have too much experience with FD.

regarding a good email address for delivery, I would suggest to print it, with all the flyertalk names as signature and their status on FD, and send it by courier service to their headquarters. So it will look urgent & important and someone has to sign for it as well ...

Why don't we set up a website and a mission like those who tried with saveskymiles.com. Public awareness is the key and they handed these cards out with the website and list of changes to Sky Miles to people on planes, in Delta Crown Rooms, etc.

Secondly, what is it we are trying to save with FD when changes have not been fully announced? The only benefit I find in the awards right now is that it is possible to book one way tickets and this is very good as I know no other program that allows this. I would really want to save this feature as how much higher can award levels really go? Also, it takes so many more flights than other airlines just to earn enough points already. Of course I would hate to see a Goldpointsization take place or have our already earned points become Radissonized. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/wink.gif

------------------
"Fly me to the moon and let me earn alot of miles."

Would these be the thousands of new customers who are now taking the already limited award seats at the expense of people who have actually EARNED status the hard way by suffering the often miserable experience of flying KLM/NW.

So despite that fact that it takes FD six weeks to open one email to which they have not properly replied, you think a letter might change their corporate strategy. WKS you are obviously more of an optimist than me. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif

I (one of the profit-takers from KLM's extremely genereous comping offer) don't feel comfortable and legitimized to already tell KLM/Flying Dutchman now, what I want them to do with the future Flying Dutchman program and change for the better .

ajamieson, I don`t understand your point....

As kurz pointed out in another topic, KLM award inventory for Royal Wing members comes out of the B and M inventory for Economy and out of the D and C inventory for Biz.

These classes are never sold out !!!

Especially not, if you book some weeks in advance.....

I check all these booking engines very frequently and I have never ever seen a KLM flight with only J and S inventory left ( their highest booking classes and only classes above the RW award classes.....)

So availability for Royal Wings is still great, despite some new members...

I know I've posted this question on another thread but I'm still trying to get an answer - does FD free up seats on NW for Royalwings when regular award inventory is gone?
I tried asking the FD Helpdesk and haven't got a straight answer. Thanks.

Then how come I have never EVER been given the dates/times I have wanted for award flights? Last year to CPT (a busy route, I know) there were no economy award seats available to me for a week either side of my preferred dates. And during the discounted transatlantic upgrade promotion earlier this year the availability was erratic.

Tractor Boy makes a very good point. The policy is very confused. Some agents suggest they can "release" seats for you, others deny this, some others waitlist you for cabins which are clearly empty. What is the policy? I don't think even FD knows.

FD changes are a concern, but I would rather have a more competent, efficient program than a generous one which is a complete gamble.

JNB and CPT are always full, especially lately....

But can you blame KLM, when the flight is actually sold out ???

If you check JNB flights for the next days, you will always find M and B class available...

But I definately agree with you, when it comes to the FD agents....

IMO KLM has a nice programm, but unfortunately is lacking both manpower and competence to satisfy the customer. However there are agents who know how to play the game...

Whatever we thought, [ps. I do agree to an extent with ajameson about 'would it make a difference?' but just thought it was better doing something rather than sitting around doing nothing and then complaining after the event] it is too late! New FD programme announced on the KLM website today.

Looks quite good from the bare facts stated, but still wondering what will happen to our existing points...

Nonetheless, let's wait and see...

------------------
KLM FD RoyalWing, AA Platinum, UA Prem, HHilton Silver

This is the link to the current news:

http://www.klm.com/nl_en//flying_dut...ePageID=1057#1

The number of tourists visiting South Africa has been on steady increase all year as more and more people decide to holiday there instead of the USA.

Also, don't forget that there would be few waitresses and barmen in the UK and Holland if the estimated 1.5-2 million S. Africans weren't working there.

I certainly don't recall the last time I was served by a S African, male of female, in the pubs or restaurants I've been into in London. From all parts of Europe maybe, and also Ausie and NZ, but S African ?

There is a huge SA population here in the UK ( I am one ! As is criscokid )

However every single one I have met recently is in a 9-5 job. I think it may be because of the difficulties in getting a UK visa, so that most are here temporarily, and have some degree of financial backing behind them.

[This message has been edited by Cris L (edited 08-30-2002).]

Hi Chris..perhaps you all pick up the London lingo pretty quick and I haven't noticed !

A South African NEVER loses their accent. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/wink.gif

I also feel the figure of 2 million is absurd. There are only 6 million white South Africans in all of South Africa.

------------------
~ Glen ~

Doesn't anyone else find it weird that the flag carrier of a country that prides itself on being so inherently sensible, practical and metric would change its loyalty program to a miles base? Isn't that, like, a throwback to the 19th century?

Points, sure. Kilometres, fair enough? But miles? Isn't the world trying to rid itself of measurements based on former English kings' measurements from the nose to the tips of their fingers?

I understand trying to align with the larger (read: US) airlines' programs, but... Sheesh.




------------------
~ Friends don't let friends fly coach ~

Miles (in their nautical version, viz. 1.8 km rather than 1.6 km) is the standard unit of aeronautical distance, even in those countries which use the metric system for land distances.