atflyer

Exactly what I thought, Irishguy. Indeed, transfer passengers that have a high (near certain?) risk of being stranded at Schiphol due to a lack of connections are better off at the airport of origin - other rerouting options, at least hotels available. But why not flying people with final destination AMS to AMS? The only reason I can think of is that pax with a connection then won't accept they cannot board. But with clear and careful explanation that should not be too much of an issue.

I am bound for Boston via Paris in a week. Can only pray the chaos is less.

atflyer

Addition - some suggest that wind is a problem and that they hence face runway restrictions. I am in den Haag, 50 km from Schiphol, weather is perfect, a nice, no wind Summer evening. Does not make sense. Seems that the pax issue is the only reason for this meltdown, there is no other word for it.

mfkne

I have witnessed that first hand a few years ago when AMS was down due to snow, all pax with connections in AMS were denied boarding at the outstation, and a handful of passengers, me included, were allowed to board because AMS was our final destination.

johan rebel

There have been occasions when KLM only flew pax with destination AMS to Schiphol, leaving behind all the transfer pax. This was because fog had more or less shut down the airport. I remember reading about one pax flying from OSL (if memory serves) with destination DUS. He managed to convince the gate agents to nevertheless let him board, saying that he would take a train from Amsterdam to Düsseldorf. Once on the plane, he found himself the only passenger!

Johan

atflyer

Today's hourly weather report for AMS - we have 19-20 km/hour or force 3 or less on average, 40-50 degrees (so coming from the NE)....how can this be so disruptive?
https://www.weer1.com/europe/netherl...ate=2022-06-04

dkeng

Crikey, seems it just keeps getting worse in AMS.

I've got business in the Netherlands next week and booked on an orange plane Monday and Friday. Not looking forward to the experience, and starting to wonder if I should be looking at Eurostar. 5 hours on a train has to be better than 4 hours in a security queue, right?

b12e

It's the NE breeze. Everytime there's the slightest NE airflow, AMS shuts down.

johan rebel

The Aalsmeerbaan (RWY 18L/36R) has been closed for maintenance since April 4th, and is only expected to be available again sometime in the middle of July.

The wind at AMS has been blowing from the northeast for days now:



Not much of a wind if you ask me, but since last Thursday there's only been one runway available for arrivals (Kaagbaan, mostly), and one or two for departures. Other major airports somehow manage just fine with two or even only one runway, but not Schiphol.


Now.


Midday today.

Johan

Arpoador

For any other fellow stranded pax. “Compensation” available in the app. Is this new? Not sure whether it was due to the closed lounge or the 2hr flight delay.

johan rebel

I don't think any other major hub airport has as many runways as AMS, but that doens't help if most of them are spectacularly misaligned.

Only the Kaagbaan and Oostbaan are aligned with the prevailing winds, and the latter is too short to be of much use (although I remember landing on it in an SAA 747, in the teeth of a full-blown hurricane).

Way back in 1949, Jan Dellaert came up with a very clever and prescient runway design for Schiphol. Six runways arranged like offset spokes around a single terminal, with room for another four runways, which would have made 10 (!!!) in total. There was also room to lengthen three of the six first runways.


Something there for every wind direction!

Johan

mpkz

The combination of news about UK airports and Schiphol mean that Eurostar might be a good option. No idea about the queues for that, but know some people traveling early next week, so let's see. 5 hours on a train almost certainly beats the risk of long security lines on both sides, even if 4 hours is still relatively unlikely at Schiphol (especially if you find the shortest line instead of just showing up at the default one for your flight).

johan rebel

But how much? Schiphol F&B outlets aren't exactly cheap.

Johan

atflyer

Ach ja, of course. The Kaagbaan cannot be used for starts from the SW. You cannot use the Polderbaan for landings from the South. You cannot use the Buitenveldertbaan (27/9) for landings from the West. The only way to use 4 runways in with a NE wind would be starting on Polder and Buitenveldert but then landings would be on Kaag and Zwanenburg (18/36C) which would imply that landing traffic crosses each other. Dual use of Zwanenburg (the only runway capable of handling starts and landings) is not of help since the only other landing runway would be Kaag. Schiphol's constellation is disastrous if you have any NE wind with any of the North-South runways out.

Schiphol, build taxiways that allow using Polder for landing from the South, and using Kaag for starting from the SW (although even then starting on Kaag can interfere with starting from Buitenveldert).

Dellearts at his time brilliant plan for tangential runways unfortunately works out as a disaster.

Arpoador

Nevermind, this is just an insult..

b12e

that'll get you a bottle of water and, if you're willing to pay a little yourself, a bag of crisps.

maybe a cheeseburger at mcDonald's, but with the prices they have at AMS perhaps a single chicken nugget.