KLM Europe Boarding Rant

Old Oct 21, 2019, 1:09 pm
  #16  
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Originally Posted by irishguy28
In America they call business class "First"

;-)
(rimshot) - good one!
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Old Oct 22, 2019, 1:22 am
  #17  
 
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Originally Posted by harpu4
I'm honestly not sure if the sign says Zone 1 first (will take a close look next time and take a pic), however it stands to reason that they should be boarding business class passengers first, ahead of economy (regardless of status), this is part of what business class passengers are paying for. KL is basically saying FB silver and business class are equal when it comes to boarding order. Doesn't make much sense to me.

This is what it says on the website: https://www.klm.com/travel/gb_en/pre...ents/index.htm

"Prior to the boarding process, we invite passengers with reduced mobility and families with babies under the age of 2 to pre-board first. They are directly followed by our Business Class and SkyPriority passengers.

At many airports, we use zone boarding. Your zone is stated on your boarding pass and depends on your travel class, fare type and frequent flyer level. Passengers in zone 1 are the first to board, followed by zones 2 through 5."
If you go through the booking process at KLM.com, business class tickets are entitled to Sky Priority, no commitment to Zone 1 or boarding ahead of zone 2. Always seems to be 1&2/SP, occasionally then 3, followed by everyone else.

I've never been on a KLM plane and seen zone1 called ahead of zone 2. Certainly different in the US when flying on Delta metal.
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Old Oct 22, 2019, 3:00 am
  #18  
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Originally Posted by The doomed
If you go through the booking process at KLM.com, business class tickets are entitled to Sky Priority, no commitment to Zone 1 or boarding ahead of zone 2. Always seems to be 1&2/SP, occasionally then 3, followed by everyone else.

I've never been on a KLM plane and seen zone1 called ahead of zone 2. Certainly different in the US when flying on Delta metal.
Do you agree this doesn't make much sense? Business Class and FB Silver having the same boarding priority?
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Old Oct 22, 2019, 3:28 am
  #19  
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Originally Posted by The doomed
If you go through the booking process at KLM.com, business class tickets are entitled to Sky Priority, no commitment to Zone 1 or boarding ahead of zone 2.
Then why make the distinction? Doesn't make much sense to print "Zone 1" on a boarding card if it serves no purpose.

Originally Posted by The doomed
I've never been on a KLM plane and seen zone1 called ahead of zone 2.
Very occasionally, only at AMS, and only on jam-packed flights with a long line at the SP boarding gate, I've known them to specifically invite business class pax to board first, even going to the trouble of walking the length of the priority queue checking for such pax and then extricating them.

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Old Oct 22, 2019, 4:18 am
  #20  
 
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Having been more of a Star Alliance passenger in the past where priority boarding only comes with Senator/Gold status which isnt that easy to get it always surprised me that in Skyteam its one of the first perks you receive.

I agree some more selectivity would make this feature more attractive
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Old Oct 22, 2019, 6:18 am
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Originally Posted by The doomed
I've never been on a KLM plane and seen zone1 called ahead of zone 2. Certainly different in the US when flying on Delta metal.
It definitely happens on flights from GRU, where they have separate lines for C and "SP", I don't know where they board FB Silver from though.
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Old Oct 22, 2019, 12:07 pm
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Originally Posted by harpu4
Do you agree this doesn't make much sense? Business Class and FB Silver having the same boarding priority?
Actually, no I don't. E.g. A loyal customer in economy, perhaps someone flying 160XPs worth of economy flights each year, should get treated no less equally for such small comforts as someone a business class ticket.

That's 8 return flights from AMS to Washington a year. That's a loyal customer, more than worthy of being amongst the first 10% on passengers on the plane.

Perhaps the wider benefits of SkyPriority need addressed.
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Old Oct 24, 2019, 3:42 pm
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I see both points of view here. When I am in economy, I want to be one of the first to board. When I'm in business, I want to be one of the first to board. Now, whether I am first or 10th does not bother me, but I certainly would not want to be 40th, as is the case sometimes on elite-heavy routes like AMS-Paris.
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Old Oct 25, 2019, 12:30 am
  #24  
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Originally Posted by harpu4
Do you agree this doesn't make much sense? Business Class and FB Silver having the same boarding priority?
It depends on how you look at it.

This is continental Europe. Many continental European companies don't pay for business class when employees/agents are on a short-haul itinerary, where flight times frequently aren't longer than an hour or two.

Hence, many of the most valuable customers sit in economy class. It may make good financial sense to show appreciation to these customers by letting them board along with business.

Especially if a good fraction of the business class consists of less valuable customers on a feeder flight to long haul (including tourists on a semi-annual business class long-haul ticket etc.).

Disclaimer: Just making a case above, not a general statement. I do realize there are intra-European routes (such as LHR-LUX, LHR-ZRH, LCY-FRA, etc.) where you have a high proportion of execs in J who actually pay for J even when on a purely short-haul trip. But this thread is in the KL forum.

Originally Posted by Concerto
That holding pen is a major bugbear at AMS
Bend it like FR.
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Last edited by FlyerTalker324193; Oct 25, 2019 at 12:42 am
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Old Oct 25, 2019, 6:52 am
  #25  
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Originally Posted by 8mh
show appreciation to these customers by letting them board along with business.
Yes, but given the usually very low (<10) number of C pax on shorthaul flights, they could show appreciation by letting them board right after that handful of pax.

A few days ago I noticed for the first time that the the screen at the gate displayed the boarding sequence as a series of vibrantly colored squares, lumping together zones 1 + 2 as the first to board. Didn't help, as one of the first pax in the priorty line was turned back as ineligible, despite his protestations that since he now was where he was, he might as well be allowed to board anyway. Maybe he was colorblind.

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Old Oct 25, 2019, 7:44 am
  #26  
 
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I'm always impressed with the proactive way DL gate agents handle boarding in the U.S for domestic flights. They are constantly on the loudspeaker making detailed, clear announcements so everyone knows their place.
In Europe things are different, there are more languages to deal with and gate agents in AMS and CDG are definitely too timid. They seem to hide away until boarding begins and make one or two short (inaudible) announcements that people barely listen to. Add to that badly designed boarding gates, poor signage and it's no wonder pax accidently go into the wrong line, which obviously also means longer SP queues.
Perhaps staff need to call boarding depending on certain criteria. E.g. if more than 8 pax in C, call C first, otherwise don't bother with the hassle of shuffling people around.
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Old Oct 25, 2019, 9:06 am
  #27  
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Originally Posted by HalconBCN
it's no wonder pax accidently go into the wrong line, which obviously also means longer SP queues.
Plus those who intentionally try their luck, making the lines even longer.

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Old Oct 25, 2019, 2:06 pm
  #28  
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Originally Posted by johan rebel
Yes, but given the usually very low (<10) number of C pax on shorthaul flights, they could show appreciation by letting them board right after that handful of pax.
I think this statement is based on a plethora of misconceptions.

Perhaps you think the guy who pays more for a ticket should get the best service. That, in itself, is questionable as there are super-important metrics (of retention and engagement, for example) that look well beyond a single ticket.
But even if you considered the price of a single flight/ticket as the only thing that matters (even though that'd be highly questionable), it's not true that J flyers always pay more than Y flyers. Hence, it doesn't follow J flyers should board first.

On many short-haul flights, you're bound to have a number of J pax on feeders to a long-haul J trip which are, relatively speaking, cheapos. There are usually Y pax which pay more for a lesser product. As it is really important for airlines to retain and engage such Y pax, it may be desirable to let those Y pax board in group 1.

Hell, there are even a few airlines which let top-tier elites board prior to business class, regardless of the class of travel those top-tier elites are on.
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Old Oct 25, 2019, 2:21 pm
  #29  
 
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Originally Posted by The doomed
Never been on a KL flight where Zone 1 is boarded first (ahead of SP). Is there anything that outlines zone 1 must board ahead of zone 2?
Yesterday I experienced that from GVA-AMS. Big confusion. All Sky Priority pax tried to board, all boarding passes were denied. It was boarding time for zone 1 only (= biz) , people! So I duefully waited till the 8 or so zone 1 people passed. Then I and a dozen or others were checked in....only to be stopped in the walkway to the plane since it was not yet cleaned or so! So all zone 1, zone 2, and later zones, queued nicely up until someone took away that ribbon that prevented us from boarding....

Last edited by atflyer; Oct 26, 2019 at 2:17 am
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Old Oct 26, 2019, 1:10 am
  #30  
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Originally Posted by 8mh
Perhaps you think the guy who pays more for a ticket should get the best service.
Nope.

I just think that it makes no sense to divide pax in boarding zones, assign J class pax a zone of their own (#1), and then lump them together with zone 2 when it actually comes to boarding.

They should make up their minds: either they board zone 1 before zone 2, or they include SP in zone 1.

KL gate agents occasionally realize and acknowledge there's a problem here, e.g. a couple of weeks ago when they invited me to skip the SP line and board first along with those needing assistance.

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